Source
r/NoFap•
Yuvithegod

Why do some of you generalise and conflate porn and masturbation?

Question

Truthfully, I have always been confused by the idea of "NoFap". It's obvious that any possible addiction does not stem from masturbation itself, but from porn, thus the term "NoFap" is a misonomer.

I've always felt like the term "NoFap" unnecessarily demonises masturbation instead of the root cause - pornography.

And even then, there's many people who can watch pornography without being addicted - so why do some of you act as if (project that) everyone is as addicted, or as susceptible to addiction, as you?

It's like a (recovering) alcoholic shitting on someone for drinking in moderation and calling them addicted.

Posted Jan 6, 2023, 4:12 PM UTC

623
DaleGribbleTheBandit•

If someone was drinking in moderation they wouldn’t be at AA? It’s kind of like that here, if you’re here…. You probably have a problem

5
YuvithegodOP•

Yeah I definitely agree. It seems I failed to understand the context - any level of alcohol is harmful to a recovering alcohol, but obviously not to a non-addicted person.

My issue is that I've seen people extrapolate this belief unto non-addicts.

3
DaleGribbleTheBandit•

I think most people’s opinion in here is that any amount of porn is harmful, the industry and the effects on the users brain - which I agree. Porn is bad for the brain even if used in moderation. You can’t really compare (even though I just did) porn and alcohol imo

2
YuvithegodOP•

I agree but then the difference is that porn can exist outside of the porn industry, nudes are also porn. I do agree that currently porn is largely harmful due to how it objectifies/commodifies women and warps mens perceptions of them (not that only men watch porn) and, like you say, the potential impact on the brain. I just dont think that porn is inherently harmful to the consumer, though I do think it is harmful to the exploited producer

3
DaleGribbleTheBandit•

Fair point, I guess I’d say that when I think of porn I think of produced porn, but when I’m on no fap ( I’m on about 2 months now) I seek out those regular person nudes that get posted on Reddit, most are just advertisement for their only fans though. And I still consider that a close call to relapse. It’s still a struggle

2
Mayafoe•

Misnomer indeed!

######IMPORTANT INFORMATION FOR USERS OF THIS SUB - The History of Nofap

Nofap isn't an anti-masturbation sub... it's a porn-addiction recovery sub!

Yet people say, "but it's literally called 'Nofap'!"

The 'No' in Nofap represents the "30 to 90-day Challenge", that's it.

This sub was created 10 years ago with the idea to challenge people to a 7 to 30-day period of not watching porn or fapping to 'reboot' your addicted mind and body... but after it would be each person's personal choice to fap or not fap (without porn), free from the addiction.

Nofap then added the 90-day challenge.

It was a modern solution to a digital problem - the rise of free unlimited streaming internet porn - and the compulsive fapping that accompanied the addiction of watching it.

There's ZERO evidence that occasional mastubation without porn is harmful, but there's a growing amount of peer-reviewed research that porn is harmful. It's not the intention of this secular, science-based sub to condemn sexual pleasure when done in a non-compulsive way, either solo or with others.

The idea of this subreddit isn't 'anti-fap' or 'forever nofap' or 'anti-masturbation' or 'no-sex', or 'how to be a monk'. We're here to support each other in completing a limited period of abstinence from FAPPING (not abstinence from sex or wet dreams) ...

If you can complete a 30 to 90-day challenge you're free to choose to fap (again, without porn) or not in your life.

To be absolutely clear... READ FROM THE SIDEBAR OF THIS PAGE, WRITTEN BY THE FOUNDERS OF THIS SUB:

This forum is intended for porn addiction recovery and is not an anti-masturbation forum, many users return to non-compulsive masturbation after ridding pornography from their sexual habits

THIS SUB is about working on reducing our addictions, completing at least one 'rebooting' challenge, finding a balance we feel comfortable with regarding masturbation (including zero fapping), and making the personal choice to eliminate porn from our life

Always feel welcome to re-copy this comment when needed. Just take it and use it like it's yours

3
Jesh-mesh•

I get where you're coming from. It seems stupid that recovering porn addicts are telling non-addicts that that all these bad thing are going to happen to them, even though the non addicts have had any of these bad things happen. I would argue that addicts are warning people but I can be over the top sometime. You can't force people to agree.

If you're comparing porn to alcohol. Moderate consumption can be enjoyed but moderate can vary from person to person, like alcohol tolerance.

Porn, like alcohol, is inherently poison but moderate consumption means negative effects are negligible and can be recovered from easily. Again like alcohol, a bit too much you get drunk, sleep it off and you recover from this negative effects. The problem is when you become dependent on it, porn addicts are dependent on porn to get them for sexual satisfaction, alcoholic are dependent on alcohol to function throughout the day. They're are both unhealthy coping mechanisms.

2
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
cardboardchronicles•

Because one leads to the other....

0
notafraidneveragain•

Oh really? There's long-term, male, casual porn users?

Please, show me one.

Also, show me a man who masturbates who NEVER reverts to using porn.

-2
Jesh-mesh•

"man who masturbates who NEVER reverts to using porn"

Hi, you called. I've been porn free for a month and still masturbation without any sexually arousing media.

5
notafraidneveragain•

I did the same shit porn free for TWO months before relapsing because MO led me to P. This is what I'm finding. Everyone saying that MO is ok or people saying MO to clothed insta-baddies is ok, are people who aren't even a year in. Most aren't even 4 months in.

-1
Jesh-mesh•

Well I'll let you know when I get to 2 months and then 4 months.

Most people make the mistake of thinking fapping to ig models etc. or memories is fine but it's not because you're still dependent on the fantasy.

The approach I'm taking is to not be dependent on fantasy but focus on what I'm feeling in the moment.

5
[deleted]•

[deleted]

3
Jesh-mesh•

Thanks you

3
YuvithegodOP•

  1. Everyone throughout human history before the advent of Internet/online pornography. Porn addiction is a relatively recent phenomenon.

  2. Yes, idk how you expect me to prove this to you. Do you think everyone who watches porn is addicted?

2
notafraidneveragain•
  1. Everyone throughout human history before the advent of Internet/online pornography. Porn addiction is a relatively recent phenomenon.

Unfortunately, porn exists now. The entire game has changed.

  1. Yes, idk how you expect me to prove this to you. Do you think everyone who watches porn is addicted?

Yes.

-1
Suspiciously_Flawed440 Days•

Oh really? There's long-term, male, casual porn users?

Yes...

Please, show me one.

The mass majority of men in developed countries.

2
notafraidneveragain•

The mass majority of men in developed countries.

Who are addicts.

2