Source
r/leagueoflegends•
Bloodleaf

If the Tribunal isn't perfect, why are punishments Indisputable?

I am not banned, and I am not writing this to vent or anything. I was banned a week ago, of which I was rude to three people so I figured I pretty much got what I deserve.

But what I thought was really odd was the guy who reported me for "cry for jungle... make a fail gank in all lanes and die all the time its the worse jungler ever!! must unistall this"

The Tribunal isn't perfect, but when I asked the support team to look into this after the ban, I got two copy-pasta responses. The first had nothing to do with my question, the second was a short statement about how Riot trusts its players and the Tribunal cannot be repealed.

So if you take a role someone called you have to be worried about being irreversably banned over it?

Why are 10 completely untrained summoners with an extremely limited view of the game the final word in disciplinary action?

If you search Tribunal in this subreddit you get a ton of cases where the tribunal goes wrong. Why aren't trained staffers overseeing a potentially hugely negative experience for summoners?

Posted Jan 8, 2013, 6:46 PM UTC · edited

039
Plattbagarn•

The guy who reported you did the right things for the wrong reasons. You didn't get banned because of his motivation, you got banned because, as you said yourself, you were rude to three people.

He just did a rage-report, which is bad. One of the reasons we shouldn't be able to report people in champ select or during the game. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--ibtorDCCI that could happen every time someone got angry during the game.

2
BloodleafOP•

The people I was rude to were in other cases. This guy was isolated.

1
BloodleafOP•

He was isolated and the only one to report that game. The other people were in a different game.

1
Prinkster•

I don't think anybody has ever, ever been banned for picking a champion/role when they are higher pick. Also, if I understand correctly, you have to be reported many, many times in a lot of games to even be in the tribunal at all. Finally, even if people voted to punish you, you would most likely only be "warned" or "temporarily banned," not permanently banned.

Plus I've seen a Riot post or two where someone's ban is reversed with a really stern warning. Not the norm, but it can happen.

1
BloodleafOP•

You can be reported as few as 3 Times.

1
kihashi•

Why are 10 completely untrained summoners with an extremely limited view of the game the final word in disciplinary action?

They are not "the final word". Cases that are voted as punish are reviewed by Riot staff and Riot is the one that makes the decision as to what punishment is deserved. The tribunal just serves as a way to help vet the cases that are brought before Riot staff.

1
jadarisphone•

Incorrect.

2
kihashi•

Mind explaining that a little more than just saying that I am wrong? This is pretty well-known info and has multiple posts by RiotLyte to source for it.

1
Maxentium•

Only permanent bans are viewed by Riot's employees.

1
jadarisphone•

No it doesn't. Riot reviews all perms, sometimes 2-weeks, and occasionally a set of random cases, this is what Lyte has actually said

1
BloodleafOP•

Any source on that?

1
kihashi•

From http://na.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/en/faq/

How automated is the system?

The Tribunal automatically assigns some low-level penalties to players, such as e-mail warnings. More severe cases, however, are reviewed and assigned punishments manually by Player Support.

1
bworking•

The tribunal gives multiple cases per report, so that was probably rolled up with the other.

Plus it does sound pretty rude to an outside observer.

They don't have professional jurors in US courts and tribunal seems similar.

1
McDrewbs[SillyLily] (EU-W)•

They are disputable, but 99% of the outcomes are correct anyway. You can send a message to support if you think you have been unjustly banned (despite popular believe, they do actually look at your case, you only get the copapaste reply if they couldn't be bothered to tell you why you deserved it, you can just pester them till they do if you want) or if you can find Lyte's email, you can send it to him and ask him about it.

Why are 10 completely untrained summoners with an extremely limited view of the game the final word in disciplinary action?

How are they untrained? Where would one get training? You vote on the summoners code, which is summed up as the "Don't be a Dick Code", I didn't realise you needed training for that, silly me thinking I could get by on common sense, logical thinking, and a high standard of behaviour. And how is the Tribunal voter's view limited? A question is asked to voters, and that is "can you see the summoner in question breaking the summoner's code?" It's a yes or no question, yes equals a punish, no equals a pardon. So what is "limited" about that? We see all the in-game chat, and then after reading that, we answer the question. It's pretty straight forward and effective.

1
kindlebee•

The Tribunal doesn't ban anyone, the Tribunal is a filtering tool that helps Riot filter legitimate reports from asinine reports, which they then review and judge on.

0
Lifthrasil[xDamien] (EU-W)•

Wrong. Apparently Riot does not check the reports coming into the Tribunal nor when you get banned for it unless it's a perma-bann otherwise there wouldn't be so many unjustified bans.

0
RelaxAndRawr•

There aren't as many unjustified bans as you make it out to be. Most of the people who come to Reddit with their cases typically got banned for the right reasons. I've seen probably 1 or 2 cases that were unjustly banned, and those were pretty extreme cases that got Riot's attention all over the boards.

1
Lifthrasil[xDamien] (EU-W)•

I'm not solely talking about the reddit cases here at all...

1
kindlebee•

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/legal/tribunal

"A member of the Riot Games support team will be assigned to audit The Tribunal system, and will be responsible for reviewing the individual cases deserving of more extreme punishment (generally, anything harsher than a single day ban)."

So we are both right, but you were more right than I was.

0
riddler1215•

oh hey look! Its Kindlebee from Wolfy's stream! Why no more epic paint skills?

1
kindlebee•

Not big on the smite, I still try and do some picture every now and then, but my hay-day of like 10 pictures a stream is long gone.

1
jadarisphone•

That link is information over a year old. Lyte has posted saying they review all permanent bans, occasionally 2 week bans, and randomly review a set of random cases to ensure accuracy. They by no means review every case that's a time ban, they would need 10x the staff for that

0
kindlebee•

so, what you are saying is, they review any case with a punishment harsher than a single day ban, and they also randomly review a random selection of other cases. So the information in that article is not wrong, just missing the random selection bit.

1
Dannyguy41•

The tribunal is broken and everytime someone tries to bring it up it is down voted to hell. Bans go out daily without ever being looked at by a riot employee. Why does everyone level 20 and above get to judge cases? Play a match of solo q and you see a lot of level 30s have limited knowledge of this game.

0
RelaxAndRawr•

Maybe because limited knowledge of the game is not actually needed when voting on whether or not some one is being an asshole.

1
Dannyguy41•

No but If you get reported for trolling when in reality you where just not following the meta this could be a major conflict. People may think trolling and my following the meta are the same thing and nothing is stopping them from Hitting punish.

1
RelaxAndRawr•

I feel like something like this is not nearly as prioritized as the chat logs. And, Riot has even outlined that breaking the meta is not considered a break in the summoner's code, so something like this isn't typically a problem. Even without this knowledge, again, people typically prioritize chat logs, kda, and gold farm, along with whatever the reporter actually has to say.

1
Dannyguy41•

Lets have summoner 1 2 and 3 summoner one wants to take a break from ranked and play some jungle master yi in normal, for giggles. Summoner 2 takes normals very seriously and gets angry when someone plays something he doesn't like so he reports summoner 1 for trolling. Now we have summoner 3 that gets the case in the tribunal. Summoner 3 is Lvl 20 and has newly found out about the website reign of gaming. Since he sees that master yi is a tier 3 jungle he shares the same view as Summoner 2 And hits punish. Recipe for disaster. A lot of players follow websites and views like this one and are biased.

1