Bennies and shorter sessions

Hey all,

I'm a new GM for this system, and one concern I have is with how the 3 bennies rule was decided. I'm guessing that it was made with the idea of very long sessions in mind. My own sessions are about 3 or 4 hours of mixed playing (and honestly, maybe 2 hours of actual playing), and it seems that they'll be able to spend a bennie on every single important roll. There aren't enough rolls to make it actually require a choice of which rolls to spend a bennie on, and we get through so little that it's usually one or two "scenes" per session.

After the first two game sessions, I decided to give 2 chips (this is Deadlands) instead of 3, but I'm still feeling like that's enough to get through everything mostly unscathed.

The reason for this is because a PC is about to go to trial for attempted murder (4 sessions in? Really dude?), and if he's able to just scoot through unimpeded due to spending bennies, when he is 100% guilty, that seems to cheapen the whole "actions have consequences" thing.

So, how do others deal with the number of bennies and short sessions?

Do people tie getting Bennies to objectives, rather than at session start?

Or any tips about the specific scenario above would be appreciated.

Posted Aug 1, 2014, 7:17 PM UTC

110
Zadmar•

My sessions typically last around 4 hours, and I usually award 3-5 bennies per player on top of the 3 they start with, although I vary it depending on the session. One of the players tends to hoard her bennies, the others often run out.

The reason for this is because a PC is about to go to trial for attempted murder (4 sessions in? Really dude?), and if he's able to just scoot through unimpeded due to spending bennies, when he is 100% guilty, that seems to cheapen the whole "actions have consequences" thing.

I'm afraid I don't follow. How would bennies allow him to "scoot through unimpeded"?

2
CheapyPipeOP•

Hitting the target number (4) for the various rolls he'd need to make would make it so he succeeds at what he's trying to do. Bennies generally ensure you get at least 4, from what I've seen.

Maybe I misread the mechanics section, but I thought that 4 was a success against non-opposed rolls, and every raise you got was how awesome you did.

2
Moofaa•

Correct, for non-opposed rolls its vs a TN4, and raises are for how awesome you are. If you are skilled at something, TN4 is pretty easy to beat.

That said, something seems off here. If he's going on trial, there should be opposed rolls against the oppositions lawyer, attempts to sway the judge, or influence the jury. If there really is solid evidence against him, he should get a huge penalty (-4 or -6 maybe?). Opposed rolls require beating whatever the other person rolled, and can be significantly harder to beat than TN4.

It should also require more than one roll, as he has to defeat evidence and arguments as they are presented.

And rather than getting out of jail for free, he could STILL get punished in some way. Instead of getting hanged, he gets time in jail. Or maybe the Judge grants a restraining order to his intended victim, forcing the player to leave town or end up in jail that way.

6
Zadmar•

A difficult task would usually involve penalties, and while bennies allow you to reroll, they don't ensure success. For a murder trial I'd probably use the Social Conflict rules (three opposed rolls, the one with the most successes wins the trial) - if the player has Persuasion and Knowledge (Law) then I guess he could defend himself (allowing him to use his bennies), but the prosecutor could be a Wild Card as well, and might also receive a significant bonus if there's a lot of evidence against PC.

4
Toboe_LoneWolf•

To add, if the player doesn't have Knowledge(Law), then he's rolling an untrained d4-2, which super sucks with Social Conflict, especially with an opposed roll (even against an Extra).

There's also a bunch of outside factors the OP can add in:

  • make it a giant, big hullabaloo for the town, and everyone comes to watch. Regardless if the PC fails or wins, watchers are going to form their own opinion, and may decide to pursue the PC for vigilante justice, or hire the PC to do some dirty work (they successfully got away once, they can do it again!). If the supernatural was involved, either the Rangers or the Agency hears word of this and comes to investigate, and they aren't as easy to dissuade.
  • if a dead body is actually involved, bring 'em back Harrowed. Bonus points if they return in the middle of the trial.
  • If you're feeling really malevolent, if the PC gets away scot-free, send a Hangin' Judge after 'em. >D
  • if the player doesn't feel like rolling untrained Knowledge(Law), they can hire a lawyer. Except lawyers aren't cheap. At all. After the trial the PC is gonna need a job, any job, or else they're going to be eating their boots...
2
AnguirelCM•

And what about the guy prosecuting? Doesn't he get a roll? Don't you have bennies for him? GM bennies + possibly make him a Wild Card so he has a couple of his own. He presents solid evidence? He gets a bonus for his roll. The PC fumbles with evidence? Apply a penalty. If applicable, make sure hindrances come into play as well. On an opposed roll or two, you can easily spend multiple bennies trying to set a good TN for the opposition, or to counter an exceptionally good roll by the opposition.

Feeling it's still too easy? Apply an upfront penalty (the entire town thinks he's guilty, and is pre-disposed to that conclusion, so the PC has an uphill battle). Alone, this would be pretty harsh, so lighten it up slightly by using cooperative rolls to balance. Call th eother characters to the stand and have them roll to grant a bonus (negate the penalty) to the final verdict rolls made by the accused PC (or his lawyer, if he's not representing himself). In particular, force a roll on another character that took all those social hindrances, expecting to be a combat character. Maybe he's called to the stand as a witness. No one else gets to roll for him - he has to survive this himself. If that character succeeds, they negate some of the penalty. If they fail, the penalty stands (or even gets worse if they botch).

Still not enough? Make it an opposed roll against the prosecutor. Successes by the prosecutor increase the penalty against the accused PC. Bring in other witnesses as well. Give the PC's defense attorney a chance to counter. Use legal-equivalents to Tricks (objections, points of order, fast-talk mumbo-jumbo).

Hard to envision, or don't want to play out a full courtroom drama? Play it out as a literal battle of words, using some of tactical battle rules. Translate attributes and skills accordingly. Maybe damage is Smarts + Charisma, and you use Knowledge(Law) or Social skills instead of Fighting, or Shooting, or Throwing. Evidence is a weapon. Moving requires a speech, granting better or worse figurative positioning. You should see plenty of Bennies drop for that.

4
Geekken•

Gotta chime in. As folks have said here, there should be penalties floating around. I'd also wonder if you aren't ramping up the opposition enough. Bennies are there to save their bacon when you're exploding damage die rolls. Don't pull any punches. I'd be using GM bennies too (not to mention you're own wildcards).

I rarely have players hoarding bennies at the end of the game. Typically they are clinging to one just in case they get incapacitated. You need to start throwing those -2 and -4 modifiers around (and hey, is that PC a trained lawyer? If not Knowledge(law) at a d4-2 sounds perfectly reasonable).

2
Toboe_LoneWolf•

I actually had this exact same question.

The answer I'm currently running with (other than increasing the total number of rolls called in general) is using a Benny Pool instead of 3 bennies per session.

Estimate how many sessions an arc or story from your campaign should take, based on a "real" 5-6 hour session. You can take a look at the free one-shots for what a complete 5-6 hour session can accomplish (typically, "stumble upon something weird," "explore for more info on the weirdness," "kill the weirdness").

From there, at the beginning of an arc/story, straight off the bat give your players all the bennies. If you think it should take 3 sessions (three sessions of 5-6 hours actual playing) to complete the arc, then give them 9 bennies (or 10 if you wish to have round numbers and be generous). And that's it. (If you wish to be extremely generous, after a certain number of sessions you can allow perhaps 1 benny per session if a player blew all their bennies already.)

Give them bennies for roleplaying hindrances/etc as usual, but now they have a benny countdown for the story arc. If they decide to blow all their bennies on the early exploratory sessions, it's their call, but then they'll have less bennies for the Kill The Weirdness end. Throw in some simple middle problems (Dramatic Task, Trial, random encounter combat) and burn through their bennies that way.

Last session I had a player burn through 9 bennies of their 10 benny pool. He survived, but he still has to get through the rest of the arc. >D

2
Pariah1974•

It may be possible you aren't adding in all the penalties needed. You're also probably not damaging them near enough. Pump up your game, to make them use those bennies.

2
SnakeyesX•

Meh, just reset bennies every other game. Simple solution.

Don't be mean though, bennies are around for a reason.

0