Imagine a character with high CON but low STR. Here's what he looks like:
http://i.imgur.com/ZgK5BVE.png
Have you ever met a fat or beefy dude that wasn't strong? I haven't. All fat dudes are inherently strong.
This is what I think Numenera got right. They combined both STR and CON into a single "Might" score.
Posted Apr 3, 2015, 3:16 PM UTC
wait, you seriously think fat guys have high constitution? have you heart of heart disease and diabetes?
ever heard of a boxer with a glass jaw? is he not strong because he cant take a hit well?
what, do you often find yourself having to roll vs heart disease or diabetes in rpg's? stupid argument.
How about the endurance of running a mile? That's a constitution test but do you think your fat guy could do it?
wow, can't wait to play a character who's only skill is being able to run for a long way
It was an example of a constitution test that "fat dudes" would likely fail, demonstrating the error in your assertion that a high con, low str person would look like the picture you linked above.
Here's a person who has "High Con, Low Str": Long-Distance Runner, Mo Farah. Look at him. Not what you'd really call beefy but that guy can run 10k faster almost anyone.
Oh and "running for a long way" isn't the only application for Con in most rpgs. It also contributes to hit points and can be used as a base stat for certain magical classes in D&D, representing sheer focus.
No, your shit post makes no sense. You even said, "have you ever met...".
Have you ever met a fucking DND character?
Why isn't fitness separate from health? You can have great cardio but a very fragile immune system.
Why isn't endurance separate from might? Carrying a heavy weight a long distance is a very different thing from punching really hard.
Why isn't aim separate from balance? Being able to walk a tightrope or do flips doesn't make you any good at estimating distance, arc, and windspeed, nor vice versa.
D&D has the stats that it does because it's an imperfect model of the world, and it had to pick something.
You ever deal with an endurance athlete like a long distance runner? Most of them I've dealt with I'm stronger than them- And I don't work out much at all. But it takes for ever for them to even get tired let alone stop.
Con traditionally also covers things like poison and disease. Being strong can help with these but some people are just harder to hurt with such things because of diet and genetics.
There is nothing wrong with wrapping con and str together but if you do then you should go the Numenera route and wrap more stats up. In something like DnD where they keep things some what separate there's no reason to combine them.
this is a picture of a dude who can run a 130 mile marathon. High con, not high str.
Smokers. Plus things fall apart balance-wise if melee people get to use the same stat for offense and defense and everyone else is stuck splitting the two.
You can really argue convincingly for correlation of CON with any stat. Being healthy tends to follow from wisdom and will make you smarter, stronger, faster, and more charming.
7th Sea had Brawn. It was your ability to take a hit, as well as how hard you could hit.
SWD6 used STR to soak damage and measure how strong you actually were. And it also made "lifting" a skill, because why the hell not.
GURPS and Mini Six did that way before Numenera came out.
Er... GURPS uses strength and health as separate attributes.
You're problem is that you are thinking about the scores as physical representations of the character. The numbers are just what makes the game run. You can re-skin it to be whatever the hell you want.
At least in my games you can.
Because most games don't deal with purely human organisms. You need to separate STR and CON when dealing with stuff with radically different physiologies than humans, which is pretty much every single game which has at least animals in it.
Why do people who have no idea what they're talking about, talk about stuff which they have no idea of its meaning?
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Leveraging mass is not strength.
Having mass that might help absorb damage but it is not the same as having endurance.
D&D is a game not real life.
There is no real world logic about it. So many RPGs have so called 'solutions' to your perceived problem. I offer... um... TOON. There you go.
Have you ever met a fat or beefy dude that wasn't strong? I haven't.
Well, maybe, but that's why I wanna play fantasy games. To have and experience things I don't in real life.
dumb rationalization
Dumb? Why is that? Lot of things used in RPGs doesn't really make sense. Double-edged axes, for example, or giant hammers, never existed on a battlefield, because they're stupid (far too heavy and unbalanced). And yet, in RPGs, they're common. Why? Because they're fun. And that's why we play RPGs.
Now if you could try not to insult people who disagree with you, that would be nice :)
Endurance athletes like runners might have high Constitution but low Strength. Or Rasputin, who survived getting stabbed, and apocryphally died only after being poisoned and shot like 10 times.
There was bully in middle school that was much bigger and stronger than the rest of us. He picked a fight with my friend who was a cross country runner. My friend took one punch and then just jogged away from the bully. He kept within 10 or so feet of the bully, enough to make the bully think he could catch him. After about 10 minutes the bully was winded, panting, and unable to go on. My friend walked up and said "I think we are done here" and walked away. That is the difference between strength and constitution.