Arguments for and against rioting as a means of effecting change in places like Baltimore?
I figured r/anarchism would probably have some pro-riots arguments. I'm not really familiar on the issue. Mind filling me in?
Posted Apr 28, 2015, 2:25 AM UTC
I figured r/anarchism would probably have some pro-riots arguments. I'm not really familiar on the issue. Mind filling me in?
Posted Apr 28, 2015, 2:25 AM UTC
How Nonviolence Protects the State is a great work on this subject.
Some points:
The history you've learned has probably been whitewashed to avoid talking about the violence that made many social movements possible. Civil rights movement? Sure there were plenty of nonviolent events, but there were also riots, bombings, arson, the rise of armed gangs to protect communities, etc. Those violent acts may have done more to mobilize the federal government to intervene and push legislation forward than any other force. The independence efforts in India were also marked my militant leaders like Chandrasekhar Azad, and it may have ultimately been violence elsewhere (Palestinian uprisings for example) that force the British hand to send troops elsewhere and take their hands of the colony. None of this, of course, makes for good education if you want law-abiding citizens who wouldn't think of acting against a police force or anything else.
Obviously the book offers more explanations and examples, but the takeaway should be, militant actions (riots and others) have contributed hugely to the success of many social revolutions. Nonviolence and violence both have parts in any movement that wants to create real, actionable change. Movements that use just one are typically much less successful (if at all).
Personally, I don't agree with "How Nonviolence Protects the State." It paints all nonviolence as laying down and being a doormat. It's possible to be extremely disruptive while still being nonviolent. Nonviolent disruption, particularly when it hurts those in power financially, can be a very powerful tool. Flooding the jails was an effective tactic in the 1910 free speech fight and civil rights movement because it overburdened the system and cost taxpayers a lot of money to feed all those protesters they locked up.
However, nonviolence can fail if those in power use extreme violence as a response. Flooding the jails works if the police lock protesters up relatively quietly, but if they beat up every protester then there's going to be defensive violence from the protesters. For nonviolence to work, there has to be some degree of understanding from both sides.
I think it's wrong to consider sabotage to be violence, though. I don't care if a few police cars get torched and windows smashed. It's hurting actual people that I disagree with.
It's been a little while since I read the book, so pardon me if I'm remembering some of the text wrong.
I don't remember it being particular anti non-violance, but rather anti non-violence as the only tactic. He spends a lot of time scorning movements and groups that won't allow any tactic that can be described as "violent" (most generally smashing things). I seem to remember specific examples of mostly liberal groups "turning in" (pointing out to police, coordinating with law enforcement, etc) anarchists and protestors who wanted to smash windows, etc. That was what he really took offense to.
Personally, I believe there's a place for both tactics in any movement. Discounting violence or non-violence does a disservice to those involved and limits your options. Non-violence is paramount in gaining the support of privileged individuals and violence seems to do a lot better job of catching the state's attention. This is what I got from the text, anyway.
And I mostly agree on the sabotage point, though there are forms of sabotage that do not physically hurt individuals.
Rioting is a TACTIC. You evaluate a tactic depending on its context in a STRATEGY. Tactics by themselves do not cause victories. Tactics have particular effects in particular situations.
Can you expand? What situations would warrant rioting??
What do you mean warrant? What context are we discussing this in? You're in r/Anarchism. Generally people here think smashing police cars and other tools of oppression is not only "warranted" but just a brilliant idea at any time for any reason. It's just a matter of whether it's a successful tactic at any particular moment. If they weren't able to rebuild police cars in general then we could just start smashing and soon we'd be done. But given their regenerative capacity and the costs they can impose for smashing, sometimes there are moments when restraint is called for. Does that make sense? Are we on the same page here at all? :/
I mean what cases would make it pragmatic?
The chance you will be prosecuted successfully?
Why Smash Windows by myself.
I'm still holding the theory that you run a window repair and replacement business...
nah, it's a great read thanks!
I mean they say anarchist ruin small businesses when windows are smashed right, but has nobody thought of the window repair and replacement services? I bet they love anarchist.
Window smashing supports the economy.
It doesn't accomplish anything by itself, and it sure as shit ain't pretty. But it gets people's attention (few things in modern America do) and it creates genuine political pressure. If militancy becomes normalized in certain neighborhoods, like it did in some places in Greece (for example) then the relative power vacuum created can be filled by the community without the intervention of the state. If radicals are smart they can take advantage of that and actually start putting their ideas into practice, even if it is on a limited scale.
I'll add that I don't "support" rioting, it's what happens when things get so bad there's no ignoring it and when the state refuses any other attempt to make it accountable. It's power's chickens coming home to roost. But in certain situations it becomes almost impossible to effect change without ratcheting up tension significantly.
I think it's also worth mentioning that bad things happen in all the chaos. Though much of that depends on context. For example, anarchist black blocs, if they are involved in this sort of thing, mainly target police and corporate property and tend to leave regular people's shit alone. For another example, the riots in Frankfurt a little while ago, while fairly destructive and violent, were extremely targeted. Those people obviously didn't show up with the intention of stealing shit or breaking things just because, their actions had a message that was easy to figure out and unless you're a capitalist or a rabid statist you're probably not going to weep for a bank window or a trash can fire.
There's no such thing as an "organized riot", but for these things to be effective I do think there has to be a certain understanding of purpose, otherwise it just turns into more or less meaningless chaos. Rage can only get you so far. The better the understanding of the overall goal and what you're trying to achieve, the less harm is going to happen to innocent people caught in the middle of it. It's hard to look at what happened to Reginald Denny for example and say that such a thing needed to happen. None of the people rioting in Baltimore are animals, they're youth who are in a shitty place in our society and are fed up with it. But I don't really think a lot of them know what they want outside of an abstract concept of "justice". The militancy that sprung from the riots in Ferguson has meaning because it has lead to the growth of organizations that do have very clear and direct goals for their communities rather then just a sense of anger. Disarm NYPD or Take Back The Bronx, for example. The tension created space for these things to grow and for new ideas to find footing.
For a riot to lead to anything truly positive it needs to have an ideology behind it, really. Otherwise it's not resistance so much as venting. It'll come and go, maybe it will spur some half assed reform, but it does not build autonomy unless people work for it.
Rage can only get you so far.
I'm reminded of a quote from The Coming Insurrection:
[R]age and politics should never have been separated. Without the first, the second is lost in discourse; without the second the first exhausts itself in howls.
Here are some essays I think are good:
“In Defense of Looting” by Willie Osterweil is an eloquent defense of looting in the context of the Ferguson riots.
“The Decline and Fall of the Spectacle-Commodity Economy” by Guy Debord is an insightful analysis of the Watts Rebellion of 1965.
“You Are Not The Target Audience” by Wiliam Gillis is an apology for the black bloc tactic of smashing windows.
“The Nature of Police, the Role of the Left” and “Learning From Ferguson” by Peter Gelderloos look at the liberal mechanisms (including the narrative that ‘non-violence works’) used to relegate the efforts following police violence to superficial reforms.
And here are two of my own that I wrote after the Ferguson riots:
"On Camels, Liberal Myths, and Ferguson"
"No War But The Class Apocalypse!: Further Reflections on Rioting"
"In Defense of Looting" was an amazing read. Thank you for sharing it.