Source
r/kancolle•
joncppl

[Question] Understanding fleet composition.

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I've been playing quite extensively for the last six months (HQ100), and have a healthy, well rounded fleet.

However, something has been bugging me about the way that I (and how I expect that many others) play.

Whenever I sortie to a map, be it a regular world map for completion or training, monthly EOs, or event maps, I always go to the wiki and follow the suggested compositions precisely.

While I understand the logic behind the compositions: branching rules, ship types for ideal damage against the map's enemy composition, minimised resource usage, etc, I have little faith in my ability to compose a fleet on my own. Consequently the gameplay feels as if I am just executing predefined instructions rather than actually playing. I find I am scared to experiment out of fear of sending my girls to the docks unnecessarily and wasting precious resources.

So I am wondering what other teitokus do. Do you also default to the wiki/other postings (or recall from memory) for fleet composition, or do you integrate your existing knowledge to construct a fleet for a given map each time?

Obviously front-liners have to do this (+ trial and error) to work out compositions for new maps but when I have watched streams I've never observed and understood the process.

Posted Jun 2, 2016, 12:13 PM UTC

1919
circlewind•

I only check wiki for branching rules, and then I do come up with my own fleet (more or less). Even at event time, I sometimes just go my own fleet. In this event, everyone saying carrier task force is better on E-4, but I still sortie with surface task force in term of saving baux.

I think the key is to understand pros/cons of each type of ship. You need CV for initial damage or you need BB for heavily armored enemy? CVL can help with air supremacy as well as ASW. Once you get used to that, you can easily change the fleet according to your needs.

I do recommend anyone has enough resource to try it. It is very interesting

6
Garlstadt•

I think the key is to understand pros/cons of each type of ship.

Agreed. It can be as simple as having a few rules of thumb, following routing requirements and other hard rules, and going from there.

For example, preemptive attacks are great. Destroying enemy ships before they have a chance to attack reduces the damage you take and thus the resources and time you'll spend in repairs. It also decreases the chances of an accidental taiha forcing you to go back to base prematurely. That means I like bombers and opening torpedoes.

So when I decided to farm E-1 a bit, I looked at the ships I was allowed to take, and filled that with the ships I wanted to take. Just an all-fast fleet and five DDs for the most favourable routing? Up to four CVs in the main fleet and three CLTs in the escort of a CTF? Sounds like a plan. So I went with a fleet like that and it proved very effective at ending battles before they even started, which made for safe and reliable farming.

3
deamonkiller•

Pretty much what I've always been doing myself. I check on the wiki if the map has any routing rules and that's about it. The rest is solo planning on my part, with the rules in mind (exceptions can happen if I have a real difficult time clearing a map of course).

1
Garlstadt•

Allow me to challenge one of the assumptions that may be constraining you:

wasting precious resources

I would argue resources are not precious. You earn them naturally without moving a finger as long as you stay under the softcap, so if you keep spending they'll keep flowing. Ain't that great? Expeditions also boost your income in just a few clicks. Buckets are precious, because they are very useful and you can spend them far quicker than you can earn them.

So spend them resources! They're cheap.

5
shiki88•

as long as you stay under the softcap,

For most people, aren't resources stockpiled way above the softcap in preparation for events? I wouldn't want to throw non-regenerating resources away while sortieing untested fleets, especially a combined fleet.

Expeditions are limited by how often you can access your account every day, and that pretty much acts as a cap on your other way of regenerating resources during events.

For normal maps and gameplay I don't see any issues with experimentation as long as it doesn't cut into Stockpilecolle.

1
Garlstadt•

Stockpiling for events is recommended, but you don't have to do it for the two months that separate two events. I made a thread about it before the Winter event, and the general answer was that two to four weeks ought to be enough, depending on the income you can generate and your desired level of preparation.

1
KantaiWarrior•

Resources are not cheap.

They are very expensive in time to farm, plus the mental toll it takes on you to keep sending out expeditions all day.

It will take me a few months right up the start of the Summer Event to reach max resources again and that's with sparkled fleets.

All at the same time of clearing the weekly and monthly quests and the extra operations maps plus levelling spare ships for their equipments like my Souryuu farm.

1
Garlstadt•

Mental toll? You put a fleet together, send them away, and when they come back you resupply and send them again. That's what, a few clicks every couple hours?

It took me three weeks of stockpiling to prepare for this Spring event (up to ~180k fuel) and I barely spent everything (ended up at 7k) even after farming for weeks and smashing my head against E-7 Hard for days.

I would have spent more if I had more time to play, but then I would also have had more time for stockpiling.

0
Boorishamoeba1•

Usually coming up with a fleet composition on your own requires you to do a few scouting runs, in which you don't expect to clear the map. After that you decide a fleet based on what you think is most suitable for clearing the map based on the enemys you face. Also they make adjustments based on reports from other players with regards to map routing.

Personally for non event maps, I just follow whatever the wiki says but make a few adjustments here and there. The suggested compo on wiki is there because it is the most efficient fleet to use. You can spice it up but will have lower success rate. Tbh compositions for normal map clearing are all pretty similar, due to all the branching rules.

2
Yamiji•

For me the important part is branching rules, I tend to make my own compositions from there, since I might not have the optimal girls/equipment for the "recommended" composition.

Events are a separate matter though, if I have time and resources to burn, I will definitely make something with personal touch, but for event like this one, when time and resources were precious commodities, I didn't really want to risk anything.

2
Jaynight•

I usually use the wiki or other resources since it makes life easier, but if you want to try something yourself you need to scout the map. After running it once or twice you should realize what you need and what is dead weight. For example do you can AS? Do you need more Day FP or Night FP? Etc.

1
willowywicca•

I'm not brave enough to do a fleet completely from scratch, but I'm willing to experiment a little within the confines of the known branching rules, so pretty close to what the wiki recommends but not always identical.

And then during events, the optimal setups aren't really known early on so I'm usually going with knowledge like "use a fast CTF" which means quite a bit of potential variety in setup (within the restrictions of fast fleet and CTF).

1
Skyonite•

For event maps it depends on the strictness of the routing. When the routing is precise about which ship classes are needed,the only leeway I'd have is choosing girls from those classes that can get the job done (depending on the difficulty of the map and enemies), keeping shiplocking in mind (don't want to send my best guns out immediately).On more lenient routing I go for compositions with ships that I wouldn't use otherwise,or are more resource friendly.
On non event maps,I check the routing(s) on the wiki,then make a fleet that fits the requirements,tries to play against the enemies strength(AACI on maps with strong enemy aircraft, BB for a second shelling phase on abyssal torpedo squadrons etc.) and also to be as light as possible while not having a high chance of retreat.

1
issm•

It's mostly just modifying existing fleet comps to fit your own needs.

If the default recommended comp works, then there's no need to change it.

1
blueskin•

I look at the branching rules and nodes first and try to come up with an idea of a fleet I'll use, then sanity check it against the recommendations. If a map looks hard, I'll go straight to recommendations though.

1
Kuroinex•

I always check the wiki for branching rules but I tend to bend things a bit. For example, I ran E-2 this event using 2 DD, 1 CL, 1 FBB, 1 CVL, 1 CAV. I learned that this still allowed my to go to H and helped me clear FD.

I still check what enemies there are and what paths there are to take in order to determine what might be most effective for me. If there's only 1 carrier throughout the map, I might not even take a CV(L) despite it being recommended (I usually do anyway, they're op). RNG heavy nodes like the NB node in 2-5 I tend to avoid because of the RNG even though my light ships are quite strong. It all has to do with your own ship strengths and the enemies they would have to face. If I can, I take anything that has an opening strike attack. AVs are an exception due to their overall weak stats but opening strikes make the map run smoother and faster so it's a preference of mine.

1
KnightofNoire•

While the wiki's suggestion tend to be good, i would say you don't have to follow it to the exact word. Feel feel to start by tweaking things a bit, for example, in my last dance of E7, i realized that the when following wiki's and a lot of people's 1 FBB / 2 CA / 1 CL / 2 DD, i always had problems of my girls not having enough firepower to kill the boss during night battle with boss surviving with like 10 or 20 hps left. So i take out my weaker CA and replaced her with extra FBB, and it worked like a charm. The additional FBB managed to push through boss's armor and killed the boss. Same deal with 2-5. The suggested light fleet comp just couldn't go through the boss so i bring in the heavy fleet which wasn't suggested.

Soo i guess what i mean to say is that, just take those wiki comps as just what it is, "advice", if it don't work out for you, tweak it, use different route. What works for other, might not work for you.

1
forzenrose•

Wiki-recommended compositions are fine for those newer to the game and for those who are more casual about the game, but given some experience with playing the game and sortieing enough times I think you'll have some expectation of what each ship is capable of, and what equipment, lvl etc. is needed for each map.

 

Note that wiki compositions are simply recommendations, and like all other recommendations, they may differ greatly across different sources. Even for cases where compositions are quite consistent, the routes to take may not. E.g. for clearing 3-5, you still have to decide to go with a light fleet through the south route or a heavier fleet through hoppo. Ultimately, you still have to make a decision of what ships to send and what equipment to use, etc. based on whatever factors are more important to you. Reaources? Time? Peraonal preference?

 

For me, branching rules and enemy comp.s are the main things I look out for in the wiki, particularly the AS required so I know what ships I have to bring (branching), what ships are good to have (BBs for 2nd shelling, DDs for ASW, carriers for AS, etc.), then I work my way from there.

 

Repeated sorties over time and PVPs are good ways for figuring out the capabilities of each ship and composition. The EOs every month also gives you opportunities to test out some compositions for yourself without it feeling like there is a huge penalty for experimentation and you can compare the results and efficiency of each comp.

 

Tldr: follow wiki first, get some experience with the ships and comp.s, then figure it out with slight tweaking

1
Lui97•

Well I do experiment, like using Hayasui in 2-5, but by and large nah, too little sanity left to deviate from what others have discovered.

1