[Standard] B/G Delirium - Need Feedback

Standard

Hello there Spikes! This is my first topic post in this subreddit. I've been lurking and comments on here for about a month now. I am posting here for any type of feedback, be it "your deck sucks, play a tier 1 deck" or "A or B can improve your consistency". Below I'll put a little background so you know where I am coming from as a player, since this is my first post here, and plan to contribute/participate in discussion a lot more from here on out.

Background
I started in the Kaladesh block back in December of 2016, yes I know I am a baby MTG player. I am competitive by heart and look to seek out great strategies as much as possible, which is why I would like to ask for feedback from this subreddit. The deck started out as a "brew" after looking at a deck that was posted here using Retreat to Hagra and Walking Ballista. I liked the concept, but after testing many times over in competitive leagues on MTGO, it did not pan out at all. I however, saw the value and strength of cards like Grim Flayer and Mindwrack versus decks like Mardu Vehicles and such, so I decided to stick with a delirium shell.

The Deck

I don't know much about what information is needed, but I apologize if my land base choices are awful. I have no idea how to make a great land base for consistency, I definitely need help there. It seems to be performing fine at the moment, but there are occasions where I stumble in with a good hand, but no reliable way to cast my Liliana, Grasp, or Mindwrack Demon without a traverse drawn or in-hand. Below I will provide my reasoning for each card and number of that aren't exactly staples in a delirium deck, and then further down how I perceive each match-up within the top 4 decks I've faced. I'll then leave it to you guys to tell me your thoughts. I appreciate it!

Main Board

  • Vessel of Nascency x2 - So I went back and forth with Vessel or Oath of Nissa. Oath of Nissa being an enchantment fuels delirium when you are bouncing them, but by itself cannot enter the graveyard, I also got no use out of it's second ability. Vessel I originally hated, but after seeing the plays I could make with it on turn 3 via, Grim Flayer, it led me to give it some value.

  • Grasp of Darkness x2 - I main 4 Fatal Push for obvious reasons, but I also have 2 grasps, mainly for Archangel Avacyn. I run 2 of, specifically to match the 2 of Archangel's that most Mardu Ballista's run pre-sideboard. I have a 3rd in Side, just in case. It also hits Felidar, which is nice, but seeing as I have many ways to trigger revolt, via Vessel, Clues, or Evolving, I see Fatal Push as an acceptable answer.

  • Transgress the Mind x2 - Being a heavy copy cat meta, transgress hits both pieces of the combo, and I have had many games where it did work against other decks as well. From taking Gideons post-board after Mardu has switched to more of a midrange, walker-ish gameplan to grabbing Verdurous from G/B energy.

  • Sylvan Advocate x4 - When adjusting this deck I thought to myself, if I could provide a decent blockers and removal in the early game and get to turn 4 or 5 with a controlled board, then I can win. Sylvan Advocate came to mind, because they grow as the game continues and turn Hissing Quagmire into an offensive machine on turn 6. Quite strong when you go from having a 2/3 on turn 5 to a 4/5 and a 4/4 Death Touch on turn 6.

  • To the Slaughter x1 - I board 2 total, but Main 1 simply because trample and walking ballista have been doing fairly well (so far). Post-board versus 4c Saheeli and Mardu Ballista, I have a lot more planeswalker hate for them. However, I usually mainboard for a variety of threats, including Temur Tower/GB Counters.

  • Mindwrack Demon x2 - I know many people don't enjoy Mindwrack, but I've had so much success with him versus Temur Tower and 4c Saheeli. Not to mention pre-Gideon emblem he can win trades with Heart. He is a powerhouse that I enjoy having in my skies. His trample goes through whirler virtuoso thopters and is harder to remove than most creatures, unless unlicensed is in play.

  • Tireless Tracker x2 - I originally main boarded 4, but it seemed excessive and usually only ever needed 1 or 2 if they ever came into play. The card advantage was great and on multiple occasions, these trackers became my win condition.

  • Walking Ballista x3 - Great in general versus planeswalkers, if they use removal it fuels my delirium, overall an amazing card for delirium in my opinion.

Sideboard

  • Pick the Brain x1 - Ran as a 1 of, I can live without it, but for those match-ups that discard is nice, when I draw it...does work. Although I've been torn between Pick the Brain and Lost Legacy for a while now.

  • Murder x1 - Not entirely sure of this slot to be honest. I have no unconditional removal outside of Fatal Push and the Noxious in my side, so adding one more seemed like the right choice. This was definitely a choice for GB Counters, when their hulks get really large.

  • Gonti, Lord of Luxury x1 - Debating adding a second gonti instead of a second Kalitas. I don't see too many recursive decks latley, and once I stick one of my larger defensive creatures, Scounger doesn't prove to be a problem.

  • Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet x2 - Originally put in as a 2 of versus those Zombie decks, U/R Emerge and such. I usually side 1 in if I see scroungers, as I can traverse for him. However, I haven't seen much zombie stuff lately, so thinking of taking 1 out.

  • Noxious Gearhulk x1 - Love this guy to death and see him as a great card of value, but I've only gotten to play him once versus Temur Tower and GB Counters. What do you guys think?

  • Skysovereign, Consul Flagship x1 - This guy has single-handedly won me so many games. He's a bomb when dropped and a bomb when attacking. Everything post delirium and post-6 lands in my deck can crew him. Actually thinking of a 2 of in side, maybe take out Noxious? or Not add a second Gonti and add one more sovereign?

  • Tireless Tracker x1 - Versus control match-ups post board, having 3 makes it easier to stick one after they've used removal. Once I get him out of dynavolt range, he becomes very difficult to remove.

  • Ob Nixilis Reignited x1 - For non-dynavolt control decks. The ones I've faced usually have a bit of a problem dealing with walkers, He doesn't do much versus Temur Tower though.

  • Yaheeni's Expertise x1 - The only sweeper I've included. Hits most things in Mardu, hits everything in 4c Saheeli, and most in GB counters as well. Let's me free cast all but 7 of my spells post-board on most match-ups that I bring it in. Exceptionally strong against G/W Tokens.

Match-Ups

Below I've included my side-board spreadsheet, so I don't have to list them here. If you feel so inclined, I've enabled comments on the side-board guide, like I said I'd like feedback!

Side-Board Spreadsheet

Mardu Vehicles - I do not feel favored in this match-up, but if I stick an Ishkanah and have a Grapple or Liliana for recursion post-Unlicensed, I can usually survive and grind out the win.

4c Saheeli - I honestly feel favored heavily in this match-up, pre-board and post-board. I've never faced 4C Saheeli and felt like I didn't have an answer to their next play. Their lack of counters for my discard and information plays are very detrimental for them. I can make moves to pre-pare for combo, since I will know they have it.

Mardu Ballista - Game 1 feels rough, similar to regular Mardu Vehicles, but Post-board I feel in control. I don't know if they don't expect the transgress and pick the brain or the fast delirium into "To the Slaughter", but my game plan for them is within that spectrum.

Temur Tower - Game 1, favored. The moment I distinguish between them and 4C saheeli I immediately go aggressive to close out the game. My gameplan for Gearhulks pre-board is bate them into flash blocking a non-deliriumed Grim Flayer, then Vessel break and Grasp. Although, I have significant trouble with Temur Tower decks that run Bristling Hydra. I have almost no way of dealing with them, I usually choose to either go over them with Mindwrack or Evolving Wilds revolt Fatal Push, if they Hexproof I respond with a second fatal. Not the best way to deal with them, but I don't exactly like them being able to respond to To the Slaughter by activating lumbering falls and saccing that instead. Game 2, I feel is anyone's game. I side in some answers for hulks, but I have no definitive way to deal with tower, which makes me weak against it. It's basically a race.

GB Counters (Most Variants) - I usually pair GB Counters and all Variants together simply because they have a lot of things in common. However, the Energy variant is too explosive for me when it is consistent enough to do so. They usually side-in blossoming defense, making it hard form me to remove utility creatures like Siphoner. My usual way to deal with them is side-in Noxious and Murder and make huge Tireless Trackers or go over them with Mindwrack Demon. Ishkanah usually deals with Aethersphere Harvester just fine.

I've chosen to only include match-ups that I've seen considered within the top 4 decks, either Tier 1 or Tier 2. I am eager to hear from you all, like I said, if my thought process is bad please tell me where I need improvement on and what I can do to make this deck more consistent, including if that means just scrapping the idea altogether, because it just doesn't stand-up to par. All criticism is appreciated. Thank you for the read!

Posted Mar 20, 2017, 9:00 AM UTC · edited

1217
dts317•

I play a somewhat similar list but I feel like my matchups are different.

Mardu variants seem super easy since they cannot attack profitably and there are maindeck answers to their PWs.

Temur Tower seems a bit of a bad matchup, but winnable. I find that Flayer post delirium can give them fits since Tower cannot answer Flayer by itself.

4c Saheeli seems somewhat bad as well since it's hard to answer everything they are presenting unless the answers line up correctly.

3
BoostapacksOP•

For 4c Saheeli, I mostly find them unable to have proper removal for my threats post delirium. Bouncing red oaths at that point doesn't remove anything except low counter ballistas.

I can get where you are coming from with Temur Tower. I've faced the versions mainly where shield aether thief and torrential are their only creatures except Hydra in side board. I've yet to face the Rogue Refiner Mainboard version.

1
dts317•

If you are having trouble with Mardu, try upping the number of To the Slaughters in the main. Slaughter also is great vs 4c.

I find either version of Mardu has a real problem with Ishkanah. The spider squad blocks all of their threats, buys time vs Gideon and goes wide vs the Oath/PW control plan. Try prioritizing getting delirium online ASAP and then slamming Spider to buy you infinite time, and then recurring as necessary.

1
BoostapacksOP•

I'll definitely have to try that. Sounds like an awesome strategy for them. Thank you.

2
bobartig•

Have you considered running any of those "Main board" cards Main deck? That aside, slower GB variants are dramatically disfavored against 4c Saheeli, so my guess is that you either haven't tested this matchup enough, or have been testing against poor/unlucky combo players. This deck is slower to pressure than any GB Constrictor list, so this matchup should be even worse. Having played 4c a bit, I would be overjoyed to see a matchup like this, as I can't imagine a list less-equipped to defeat the combo (while still running some mixture of first-rate constructed cards).

Should have some favorable matchups against GB and Mardu (particularly the more midrangey variants) because you go over with value, and being slightly bigger. Being able to recur Ishkanah several turns in a row can give you the breathing room to not die, but from there seems to be lacking in hard finishers. My intuition is that the jund lists splashing Unlicensed are just way better (from a metagame perspective) because two real pieces missing from GB are it's softness to planeswalkers and lack of hard removal, and Unlicensed provides additional tools for both.

2
BoostapacksOP•

My sample size for 4c Saheeli is about 7 matches. Mainly what has been hurting them is transgress and gonti. I always seem to grab a random or Felidar. Maybe it is luck, but also their stalling tactic using whirler virtuoso is broken by mindwracks trample. I'll continue to play more games against 4c Saheeli and hopefully get a better idea of what the deck is capable of.

1
StankP-I•

I find that with 4 ballista and some collective brutality you really don't need to run any filler/ enabler cards like grapple or vessel of nascency.

I also really recommend autumnal gloom as a 4 of against control

this is the list I've been tuning: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/delirium-in-autumn-aer-has-primer/

Big Nissa is one of the best cards in standard, and I don't quite see how she's gone under the radar for this long. She'll finish out the game in no time, and if you find a window to stick her against control popping that emblem in right away is game breaking.

2
Barrelbear•

I played a similar list and got to the semi finals of a PPTQ on Saturday. Lost to an explosive GB energy draw.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/14-03-17-bg-delirium/

This was my list. Autumnal Gloom was a real mvp. Almost no answers in the meta at the moment.

1
BoostapacksOP•

I've yet to think of adding Autumnal Gloom outside of the Retreat to Hagra deck. I'll have to give it some tests.

1
BlackHarkness•

I've been ruminating on autumnal gloom because I hate Tireless Tracker at the moment. You give me hope...

1
Barrelbear•

If you focus more on delirium it usually flips on the turn you play it. Give it a go and you'll be pleasantly surprised.

1
007brendanCombo / Powerful Jank•

[[Lifecrafter's Beastiary]] is a good sideboard against any of the control decks. Their whole play is to grind you out and win with card advantage. An (mostly) uncounterable 1 mana/draw a card is pretty devastating to those plans, especially since most of your non-creature spells can return creatures from the graveyard.

1
MTGCardFetcher•

Lifecrafter's Beastiary - (G) (MC) (MW) (CD)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call

1
BoostapacksOP•

I completely agree with you about Lifecrafter's, but I feel that running 17 creatures in my deck versus the 20+ that other G/B Variants run makes it not as beneficial. Or is the Scry 1 on Upkeep, with some draws just that amazing? I mean I do feel no worth in Ob Nixilis most of the time. I at most get to destroy a creature and draw once.

1
007brendanCombo / Powerful Jank•

The scry is pretty powerful and the card draw is really the only thing that is going to allow you to make it into the long game against those decks. It lets you cast creatures without really caring whether they get killed or countered, because they're just trading 1-for-1, but now you're up a card. After 2-3 creature triggers, there's not a lot they can do to catch up. Against those decks, you should be sideboarding out most of your removal and playing gonti and tireless from the board, so you should have a few more creatures.

Another card I've experimented with in delirium decks is [[Whispers of Emrakul]] as a 1 or 2-of. On turn 4 and 5, they really want to cast Glimmer on end of turn, and they probably have a Gearhulk in hand that they're just going to hold onto until they can cast it as a 2-for-1 or get down a Tower. Discard 2 is pretty powerful against those decks and no one really expects it. That being said, there can be a ton of variance, and it's not that great if you have to cast it without delirium. But it might be worth trying.

1
MTGCardFetcher•

Whispers of Emrakul - (G) (MC) (MW) (CD)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call

1
StankP-I•

I find that with 4 ballista and some collective brutality you really don't need to run any filler/ enabler cards like grapple or vessel of nascency.

I also really recommend autumnal gloom as a 4 of against control

this is the list I've been tuning: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/delirium-in-autumn-aer-has-primer/

Big Nissa is one of the best cards in standard, and I don't quite see how she's gone under the radar for this long. She'll finish out the game in no time, and if you find a window to stick her against control popping that emblem in right away is game breaking.

0