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r/warcraftlore•
Nachoslayer

IF we defeat the Legion

SpoilerDiscussion

I've been thinking, it might be that, after this expansion, we will defeat the Legion once and for all. Maybe we might even take Sargeras out deus ex machina style.

But since the Legion's goal was to create an army to stop the void lords plans and destroy potentially corrupted world souls, and since they are probably the only ones keeping them in line, who will stop the void lords after the Legion has been dealt with? Will we have to take responsibility?

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but this question has been nagging at me for a long time. In the past I found it inconceivable that we would ever beat the Legion, but since this expansion I'm starting to doubt that.

Posted Apr 13, 2017, 7:00 PM UTC

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akatokuro•

For clarity, the Legion's purpose isn't to amass a force strong enough to combat the Void Lords. Sargeras saw that as an effort in futility and instead, fel to the rationalization that if he destroys everything in the universe, there will be nothing left for the Void Lords to corrupt.

He's essentially saying, "you can't beat me at Risk if I burn the board and the pieces!"

In universe, we don't know anything about the Void Lords, but we know about these cosmic threats of the Legion and the Old Gods. I don't believe we've ever experienced open conflict between the two, so might not even realize they are enemies as well.

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Anaklu•

fel

nice

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NachoslayerOPReptile lover•

Yeh you're right it isn't exactly the purpose of the legion to combat the void lords directly.

I assume the army of light might have knowledge on the void lords and their schemes. It is more of a "what if" scenario. So when we defeat them, will there be anyone to stop them or hold them back?

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akatokuro•

Just a weird question to ask. The Legion isn't stopping or holding back the Void (Old Gods or Void Loids). It's not like the Legion is holding the gateway to prevent their minions from entering The Great Dark. It's just a long race--can the legion destroy everything before the void corrupt something powerful enough that the Legion can't destroy it, namely, a nascent titan.

If the Legion comes across the void minions, of course they will fight and destroy them. But it doesn't seem like they are out hunting the old gods specifically. So when/if we defeat Legion and it ceases to exist, that just eliminates one of the players. We continue to exist and fight for our worlds/existence. Old gods continue to corrupt, maybe they succeed on Azeroth, maybe they do on some other yet unknown Titan (maybe they already have), and maybe we learn of it or are attacked by the force at some point, or maybe not.

We are one tiny spec in an ocean--with the potential to become a massive wave, but no guarantee of that wave forming.

Army of Light likely knows more about Void stuff, as they seem to have ties with Naaru (who should know about powerful void entities), but not guarantee.

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NachoslayerOPReptile lover•

The whole exterminating life thing IS their way of stopping them. If there is nothing to corrupt, there is nothing to fear. Their plan to destroy Azeroth is their way to stop them from ever obtaining a corrupted titan as a weapon. So no, I do not think it is a weird question at all.

Also I assume the army of light has knowledge, I do not presume they definitely do.

Edit: To be more clear, I do think the Legion is fighting the void on their own way. They are hunting the void and their old gods by taking away potential targets for corruption. They plan to destroy all life to spare the universe from the corruption of the void. It has been established that they destroy planets and the inhabitants if they are unwilling to join them. This is what I see as combating the void in their own way. Without this crusade, which is essentially a purge, there is a far more greater chance for the void to succeed.

I wonder what the forces of Azeroth will do when they do find out about the void (which they definitely will, it is weird to think they will not since, well why would they introduce them in the first place). Whether you deny it, the legion is fighting them and I do believe they are their greatest obstacle to finding a world stone to corrupt. I mean, isn't that what N'Zoth is essentially trying to do right now?

In short, the wave is (in my opinion) definitely coming. I never said there was some kind of portal they are trying to close but, like you said, it is a race against the void, and if they are no longer competing the void will catch up and find a planet to corrupt with no legion in sight to destroy it before it is to late.

So when/if we defeat Legion and it ceases to exist, that just eliminates one of the players. We continue to exist and fight for our worlds/existence. Old gods continue to corrupt, maybe they succeed on Azeroth, maybe they do on some other yet unknown Titan (maybe they already have), and maybe we learn of it or are attacked by the force at some point, or maybe not.

This is essentially what I'm trying to discuss. So it might be a weird question, but I like to know others their views are on the matter, like you just did.

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akatokuro•

I don't know, maybe. It just seems like you are separating the two when it is really just a question of survival.

The Legion (namely Sargeras) certainly wants to STOP the Void Lords from attaining any more power. The demons want to kill things. The Void Lords want power in The Great Dark. The Old Gods want to corrupt things. The two factions are certainly enemies in that they have specifically competing goals, but they mean the same to us.

We, the mortal races of the universe, are the third faction who are directly opposed to both of their goals (destruction or corruption). We will fight whichever one opposes us imminently, and if we happen to beat them, will have the next one to contend with. Why should we be concerned that the Legion would no longer exist to stop the Void Lord's goals, when the Void Lords will always have a win conditions as long as we live (and them).

We have to hold and beat he Legion and beat the Void Lords to survive either way, otherwise it is choosing death by fire or by tentacles. Unless a deus ex shenanigans happens (which honestly isn't that far fetched), the story ends with us losing to either of the two factions or beating them both.

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Ysara•

The Old Gods had Neltharion create the Dragon Soul in order to summon Sargeras to Azeroth. They knew that his arrival would cause enough damage to release them and, with their powers combined, they could thrash Sargeras and retake the planet.

I'm fairly certain some character came to be somewhat aware of this through a vision in the War of the Ancients trilogy, although I am not sure who.

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CorruptPeanut•

I dont think they ever thought they could take out Sargeras. But they live for havoc. If we mortals release them under false pretenses of stopping The Legion. Then they end up with us alone. And that is one fight they might win. Well maybe not now. Seeing as we are even united with the elements this time around.

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Griz_zy•

At the time Old Gods were considered about as strong as Titans and there were no Void Lords. The plan is really silly now that Titans are massively stronger than Old Gods and Sargeras could have killed the planet in 1 swing.

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ByronicWolf•

Basically the Chronicle's release did a soft retcon on all that stuff in the WotA trilogy. When even the Void Lords cannot directly harm an awakened Titan, who are capable of obliterating Old Gods with their bare hands, then no, even dozens of them couldn't take Sargeras on.

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mtg_liebestod•

Yeah, I imagine that given the various retcons that have occurred the notion that it was in the interest of the Old Gods to summon Sargeras doesn't fly.

One could retcon it so that it turns out that the OGs didn't actually want the summoning to be successful, they just wanted the war to be as devastating as possible for the races of Azeroth in order to better set up their next moves. Which apparently took them 10000 years to start executing..

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Ysara•

I don't have my books with me, but I'm fairly certain it was stated explicitly somewhere that one titan was, in their estimation, enough to handle. But as lower comments have pointed out, the number of retcons since that trilogy have easily made such a comparison moot.

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akatokuro•

The retcons aside, this is all the more reason four our in-universe selves believe they are working together/part of the same force. Why would they help to open a portal to bring their mortal enemy to their doorstep?

It could be hubris, but in the extreme. With the retcons in power, absolutely need some other plan or reason for doing so. Especially as these Old Gods have met the Titans before, watched as Y'Shaarj was plucked from the world like a festering zit. Unless they are unfathomably stupid, they have to have some motive or plan we don't know.

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Canopus_2•

We probably will have to step up, yeah, but I'm not sure if anybody knows about the existence and threat of the Void Lords quite yet.

Something I just thought about that's kinda funny is that we'll mirror what happened with Illidan. He was protecting and trying to fight against a greater threat (the Legion), but we fought and killed him, only to then have to go and clean up the mess he was trying to clean up. If you replace Illidan with Sargeras, and the Legion with the Void Lords, it's pretty similar.

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NachoslayerOPReptile lover•

Still glad Illidan has not become that angel of light they described ^^^^^^^^^yet. He's still that grumpy anti-hero we all know and love.

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CisoSecond•

Where was it said he was going to be an angel of light anyways? Knowing Illidan he'll probably tell em to piss off anyways

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Reithio•

It's in the story from lights heart as well as the Illidan novel that came out last year.

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Canopus_2•

Just give it some time, I reckon. It'll happen, sooner or later.

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sad_over_stella_glow•

Hopefully later rather than sooner.

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AcopoDwarf and Proud•

My ideal scenario: Illidan accepts he is the savior of the universe, continue being snarky, and says things like "told ya so," and "I WAS PREPARED."

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hatrickstar•

Kinda, but while Illidan was trying to protect from a greater threat using unseemly methods, Sargeras is literally only trying to destroy. He wants to destroy all creation to "save" it from the void, doesn't exactly fit our interests.

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Yung_BennieOdyn's Favorite Son•

The Army of the Light will inevitably have the exact same goal once the Legion is done: stopping the Void Lords. If that's the case, then members of the Legion that align themselves with that specific cause instead of just, killing people, will likely defect once Sargeras is dead. I think that's the direction they're going in by showing that Nathrezim can use the Light

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NachoslayerOPReptile lover•

That would be awesome. I still can't wait for that one moment that Velen saw in his vision where we all engage the void in the (what might be) the final battle.

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YearOfTheMoose•

showing that Nathrezim can use the Light

I haven't read the books, nor have I had much chance to play this most recent expansion. Can you tell me more about the Nathrezim using the Light? I'm super curious now.

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Yung_BennieOdyn's Favorite Son•

His name is Lothraxion and he can be found in the Paladin order hall. He's a part of the Army of the Light, and (having not geared a paladin that far) I don't really know more than that. He is, however, a Nathrezim demon(?) infused with the Holy Light instead of the fel

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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S-BRO•

I think we'll go to Argus, on the way see that void-corrupted planet and be like "that shit bad", then Sargy shows up and is like; "I'm trying to stop that shit bruh" and then we team up and form the superfriends

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EquationTAKEN•

I swear to god, if I don't get a Sargeras raid, I'm rioting.

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sad_over_stella_glow•

How would that even work, Sargeras is fucking planet sized and near omnipotent. like, some people think it's a stretch we were able to kill Archimonde at all, but even then all he's always been is a very powerful demon. Sargeras can create and destroy planets with ease. he's got magic far beyond anything we've seen or can even imagine, he caused a massive fel storm to kill the entire pantheon, which means he can create a fel storm bigger than a planet. How the fuck do you even fight that. I really hope that there is some twist to any Sargeras fight and that we do not fight him directly, he should be engaging a temporarily embodied void lord or something while we blow up Argus in his face or something among those lines.

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Aeleas•

What if Sargeras is the raid? We start by pulling off a toenail Spine-of-Deathwing-style and go inside his foot. Then we fight our way through his organs up to a final encounter with his brain.

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Gaulbat•

"I knew I should have stayed home today.."

"ARNOOLD!!"

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ANUSBLASTER_MKII•

What if Sargeras managed to do a Wizard of Oz style thing, and he's just a crazy old Draenei wizard behind a curtain that projects his image and is all rumours?

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dalerian•

What kind of rumour might have slain the entire Pantheon?

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EquationTAKEN•

Yeah, I absolutely agree with everything you say.

Yet, one of the things I'm drawn to in fantasy / sci-fi stories, is the overarcing "bigger fish" phenomenon.

I love that such a being exists, and I want to see it. I want to witness the full extent of his power, even if it means certain death. Shit like this gets me all riled up!

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Amicushia•

I figure, we have like a demon that was made into a being of light. I reckon it's possible to convert what's left of the legion to become one big happy gogetting family and strike down the void lords.

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Scomato•

Azeroth is pretty much the only one that can step up against the Void Lords, when she is 'born' she will be powerful enough to face off against them. There are a lot of big questions though, like, will Azeroth still exist when the nascent Titan emerges from the world? Is Azeroth just going to run off and fight the Void Lords alone, or will she need to reassemble the Pantheon? What about Elune?

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sad_over_stella_glow•

It's doubtful whether Azeroth can even be born at all, since she's sustained so much damage in the Sundering and the Shattering. Like, just riping out Y'Shaarj could well have killed her had the titans not sealed the wound into the well of eternity, and that was a mere scratch comparedto the gigantic devastation the sundering brought.

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mannyrav•

So here's my opinion on this scenario-- similar to Grom Hellscream at the end of WOD, we might find Sargeras siding with us in a "enemy of my enemy" type thing. He is, after all, not evil in nature- he wants to rid the universe of the void lords and corrupted world souls, and has no problem wiping out all life to ensure that this corruption ceases.

I've thought about if Azeroth him/herself would awaken as well and join the fight. But, one thing that isn't clear to me is- what happens to the world the World Soul was dormant in? Kinda defeats the whole purpose of the mortal races if they are extinguished upon Azeroth's awakening, but I don't know.

Long story short, if Blizz decides to carry it out that long, we can expect to see (at least) one titan- be it Sargeras or Azeroth, or maybe both, take on the void. Then....is there a then? Dunno.

edit: I spelz bad

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Gaulbat•

If i could take on the void lords with sarg telepathically berating me the entire time, that would make me really happy.

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PixTronPixTron•

Well yeah, we left for Argus, which leaves Azshara and N'Zoth to fuck everything up.

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Hallidyne•

Which could possibly set up the next expansion after argus, and possibly a second cataclysm scenario where they revamp the world.

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PixTronPixTron•

No, they already announced Argus for 7.3.

The 2nd cataclysm scenario isn't going to go down too well. I was thinking SOME areas getting a revamp or re-texture.

However, it's been stated that there are infact unexplored parts way down south: asked by the very Red Shirt Guy himself

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Hallidyne•

Oh did they? I suppose Argus would be little more than a crumbling rock at this point so it makes sense.

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enimonemo•

The whole plan of the Legion is flawed. It is an unwinnable battle, because for when the burning crusade destroyed everything in the great dark beyond, there will still be demons. As we know, they can also be corrupted by the Void. This means that there will still remain something to be corrupted by the voidlords. So, do the demons just perform a mass suicide when it all ends? It doesn't make any sense.

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JeremyMo88•

I've been wondering if repeated failures to destroy Azeroth will make Sargeras snap. Causing him to realize that his actions have been what the void lords wanted all along. Why not go the rest of the way? Why not wipe it all clean to nothingness?

With the fall of the Legion, and maybe Kiljaedens death he becomes a void Titan. The old gods can't corrupt a born Titan, but they can convince one to fall.

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JeremyMo88•

I've been wondering if repeated failures to destroy Azeroth will make Sargeras snap. Causing him to realize that his actions have been what the void lords wanted all along. Why not go the rest of the way? Why not wipe it all clean to nothingness?

With the fall of the Legion, and maybe Kiljaedens death he becomes a void Titan. The old gods can't corrupt a born Titan, but they can convince one to fall.

1
Wyndove419•

The next expansion is likely something magic focused or the ice crown. On the year of the mammoth release page it showed a theme of glowing blue runes for the next expansion.

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NachoslayerOPReptile lover•

Wrong sub?

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Wyndove419•

Yup my bad oops

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