Hello,
for context I am quite new to using bench planes
I bought a second had #5 Bench Plane. it needed do some work to flatten the soul and sharpen which is fine.
How far back do i set the frog?
What is the effect of moving it forward or back?
And is it something I "set and forget" or should expect to readjust frequently?
Posted May 3, 2017, 6:13 AM UTC
Where you set the frog will also depend on how you set your chipbreaker. For really fine shavings and no tear out, you want the chipbreaker set very close - REALLY close - to the edge. You'll also want to sharpen it to make sure it seats properly on the iron.
Once you've done that, you'll find that you can't set the frog too far forward - the chipbreaker will get in the way. It seems counter-intuitive that you might have to pull the frog BACK a lilttle to get the finest shavings, but it's true - the chipbreaker does a lot more to help you get really fine shavings than the mouth opening does. A plane with a super-fine mouth, but the chipbreaker pulled back will be more prone to tearout than a plane with a slightly more open mouth, but wiith the chipbreaker set to just a hair from the edge of the iron.
That said, this IS a #5. Typically, you wouldn't be looking to get super fine shavings with it. You'd use it to get your workpiece flat and square and dimensioned relatively quickly.
This may have just clarified why I was having issues whenever I set my chipbreaker really far forward. I don't know why I didn't think of it. But I was trying to smooth some curly maple, so I really put it as far forward as I could and couldn't get anything out of it. I didn't think to readjust the frog back a bit to make sure I had enough clearance.
This makes sense.
I have the chip breaker about 2-3 mm from the blade but am noticing it needs work as it has a tiny little gap... I am going to take out the gap so it sits flush with he cutting blade
If it's closer to 3mm, that could be an issue for figured wood. Closer to 1mm is what you'd want for that. I really mean about a hair - practically touching the edge. Then, you first flatten the inside edge of the chipbreaker so it marries well with the iron when the screw is tightened. Also sharpen the outside edge of the chipbreaker so that it's kind of a wall that the chips hit and break on.
I'm glad someone pointed out it's a #5. I keep my #5 wide open. . . since it is a rougher working plane. My number 4 is pretty tight but I've also found better luck getting the chip breaker closer to the cutting edge (vs. having a tight mouth). I'd even say 1mm is kinda too much. I shoot for 1/64" (aka 0.5mm) it's obviously not exact at that size but it does seem to help. . . I'd really like to compare a high angle frog side by side but I've only "borrowed" a plane with a high angle frog for a few minutes 2-3x to try it. . . on the list. . .
For me it's definitely been set and forget, but like Bazzatron, I don't really go from super fine to super heavy shavings on the same plane. I tend to adjust the frog to where it lines up with the incline inside the mouth. I basically just make sure it's straight, and not too weirdly positioned, and if it takes a nice shaving after, I consider it good enough.
My logic is, I just want from the top of the frog to the bottom of the mouth to be planar.
Though I'm sure there's some logic behind how forward or backward it ought to be placed, I've not personally tweaked it and tested it on my own, and haven't really noticed any major issues with basically just eyeballing it based on intuition.
Thank you
i am going to spend less time worrying about the set up and just try to get nice thin shavings out
It's for adjusting the opening of the mouth. It should be wide open for coarse work and almost closed for fine smoothing.
It's a "set and forget" type of thing. If it's the only plane of its kind you've got, then you might want to adjust it for a specific task but that would be very infrequent.
If you've got two #5's, set the other one with wide open mouth and the other for finer shavings. Or whatever you intend to use them for.
flatten the soul
*sole. Like the sole of your shoe. Somewhere I heard that early "planes" were actually adzes, and the worker would use the sole of their foot to hold down the wood and hit the adze in front of their toes.
rough work - set it back. fine work - set it close to leading edge of mouth I've been able to do both with a #5 and 2 different blades, the finer blade being a thicker newer variety (hock) . This allow the cutting edge to be close to the leading edge. the rough work blade doesn't care much as I radius it and it's not biting the full width anyway .If you like to keep your tool box light for traveling I find this helpful
Not a great deal of travel involved but I do have a very small work space in my garage so having a different blade rather than a different plane is really good for me.
kind of feel stupid for not thinking of this earlier ...lol
thank you internet stranger! I am off to find a think blade
Ron hock. Lee valley. Lie Nielsen. Probably some others. Maybe gramcery tools. You are going to pay $30 minimum for something new
When you set the frog, you are setting the distance between your cutting edge and the opening on the mouth.
I believe the general preference is to set this as small as possible - however I don't really sweat it, and just go for it. Works fine for me - but ymmw. For me it was set and forget, but I don't really make massive adjustments to my depth of cut. I imagine if you set a really fine cut and the switch to a deep roughing cut - you might need to realign.
As for its purpose, Virginia tool works summarises it nicely.
Why do I need it? The value of having an adjustable mouth on a plane is the ability to increase or reduce the space between the leading edge of the mouth opening and the cutting edge of iron. If you’re making a heavy cut and taking thicker shavings, you want more open space in front of the iron for the shaving to pass. If you’re making a fine cut, taking thin shavings, you need less space in front of the iron. In fact, you want the opening to be just marginally larger than the thickness of the shaving
https://virginiatoolworks.com/2012/07/28/open-vs-closed-mouth-the-adjustable-plane-facts/
Thank you muchly! for a very clear answer
Its mostly for taking fine cuts so I will adjust it for a small opening and go from there.
Cheers
Apply that logic to everything going forwards. Easier to take off more than to add it back!
yup same thing my hair cut guy says
Much harder with hair than wood! Haha!