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r/handtools•
boythinks

Plane set up question: how to reduce slop in blade advance/retract knob

Hello all,

I did several searches for this on this sub and on youtube but didn't get many answers.

Basically my number 4 smoothing (Luban) plane has a good bit of slop on the knob that moves the blade back and forth, which makes micro adjustments difficult. my initial assumption was that this was to do with the level cap being too loose but it feels quite appropriately tight

What should I be doing to lessen the slop? or is this just unavoidable?

Posted Nov 30, 2017, 12:13 AM UTC

515
GiveEmThaClamps•

This probably has more to do with how the depth adjustment knob and the yoke (the y-shaped piece behind the frog) fit together. Tighter tolerances will give better results. As far as I know, there is no way to adjust this, short of buying a better quality plane.

4
boythinksOP•

Hmmmm, I have never used the really premium brand planes ...I am hoping someone who does own some can confirm that they don't have any slop.

The Luban plane otherwise works really well, and a pleasure to use

2
ender323•

Lie Nielsen planes definitely still have some lash. With the bedrock or Bailey design of plane you always advance the blade to where you want to cut. If you have to retract it, retract it further than necessary and then advance it into its final position. This is essentially the same with most tools, from bench planes to table saws.

3
jncc•

This.

1
similarityhedgehog•

you want to use the knob to lock the yoke, i.e. your last adjustment should be a clockwise turn on the knob to set it against the yoke

1
pfharlockk•

I wouldn't worry about it. Every plane i own has slop between retraction and feeding the blade (hopefully that made sense). Because the blade won't move while you are moving between the two,it ends up not mattering. The one thing you want to be sure of though is that the adjustment knob is putting forward pressure on theblade prior to starting to plane. If you don't the blade will start to sink back into the sole because it isn't properly supported. Be sure not to over tighten the cap iron. You want it to be snug but still allow making adjustments with the forward adjustment knob without having to apply undue pressure.

3
boythinksOP•

Thanks for the explanation, it makes sense

I am glad I am not missing out on some magic feature of an expensive plane ...I am quite fond of my second hand planes

1
SoftwareMaven•

It's called thread lash, and all threaded things have some amount of it. Manufacturing tolerance affects it, as does the use of the threads themselves as the metal gets worn down. The tighter the tolerances, the more likely you are to have threads under tension binding, which would be really annoying for a hand plane, so no plane will have no lash, no matter how new and expensive, but old, well used planes will have more.

All that said, thread lash is not a problem. All you need to do is always adjust the adjuster forward until the threads catch after backing the iron off. It takes about an evening of thinking about it, and then it is habit. With the threads engaged forward, the iron will be held against the forces pushing against it when planing.

3
boythinksOP•

Thanks for a good explanation

This is exactly what I have been doing

...but was hoping for a magic cure

1
CU-tony•

I dont think there is a magic cure or anything. My first plane is a Buck Bros from HD and there is a fair amount of slop or thread lash with it.

I never really thought about it much until I got my hands on my grandfather's Stanley #7 which has such minimal thread lash, its made my Buck Bros planer much less fun to use.

From my experience, I think the only recourse to fix my buck bros plane would be to somehow make the adjustment hole in the plane iron a bit smaller so there isnt so much slop in between the small pieces. Hardly magical and hardly an easy fix.

1
mradtke66•

There will always be slop, there's no way around it. Nicer planes have less, but they don't have zero.

The rule is to always adjust your plane down/for more depth of cut. If you need to take less of a cut, back off more than you need and advance the iron forward to the desired depth.

3
AhabFXseas•

As others have said, that slop is normal.  Add a bit of oil to the depth adjuster knob threads so it moves easily between the push / pull engagement points.  Most of my planes will let me spin the knob with one finger between those points, and once it starts to engage the resistance causes my finger to just slip off.  That makes fine adjustments pretty easy.

If you want to see where the slop comes from, remove the lever cap and iron, and then wiggle the top of the yoke back and forth.  Any movement there is slop between the bottom of the yoke and the sides of that groove on the depth adjuster knob.  Now, back the depth adjuster knob all the way off the stud and replace the lever cap and iron, with the iron at a normal depth.  Then grab the bottom of the yoke and wiggle it back and forth.  Movement there is slop between the top of the yoke and the edges of the hole in the chipbreaker that it fits through.  The total slop you feel when switching between in and out is basically the sum of those two slops.  

2
bobasaurus•

Theoretically you could somehow add material to the depth yoke or sides of the matching hole in the chipbreaker to take up any gap. But it doesn't matter... as other replies here have said you typically only advance the blade when doing fine adjustments. If you go too far, just back off completely and start advancing again. So the slop doesn't really come into play.

2
boythinksOP•

Yeah I thought about that too.. but decided not mess with it

1
thejunioristadmin•

A side question I'd like to ask if thats okay relates to bevel up planes and being able to adjust them with the cap iron locked.

I have a woodriver low angle block and a low angle jack. For both of these to advance the blade I have to either unlock the cap or loosen the screw on the LAJ. Is this normal and is it a "feature" for all low angle planes or just for woodriver? I just find that I'm apt to mess up the blade side to side setting or something else when all I want to do is a simple blade advancement when I have to loosen those items.

Also, since those two planes don't have a side to side lever I am fine tapping the side with a hammer to make those micro adjustments right?

1
oldtoolfoolTool Coot•

In the case of the block, your lever cap is too tight; it should be firm, but not overly so, you should be able to adjust the iron forward with the lever cap engaged. Those caps produce a lot of pressure.

On the LAJ, the same sort of applies, but you should only have to loosen the cap screw a little bit.

All this sounds sort of vague, I know, but if I could show you in person it would be an "ah ha" moment. So play it by ear but these principles should guide you.

OH, on the lateral adjustments, yes, tapping is just fine, actually, I am a tapper and eschew the lateral adjustment levers altogether; I just use a scrap of hardwood as opposed to a dedicated plane hammer.

2
thejunioristadmin•

Thank you, I'll try giving the block and jack some adjustments this weekend and see how things go.

I kind of had a plane ah ha the other day while messing with a cutting board thats been sitting for a few weeks. I think my expectation had been that after planing the surface needed to be laser flat. Granted I had played with my planes but not really used them on a project for flattening yet so I started with the LAJ and when I got full width shavings across the whole board moved to the old stanley #4 that I had kind written off (for various reasons) and was pleased at how it performed. It gave a better surface than the LAJ and I was able to check flatness with a 12" rule without light coming under. I cut it again and glued it end grain up so now I need to go in again and plane it flat.

I guess the TLDR is that my expectations of a well planed surface were unrealistic. Its done when it passes the rule test.

1
handtoolrescue•

You could shim the gap in the adjustment knob if you want less thread lash.

1