r/Warframe•
HPetch

A Bit of Pointless Math: How Fast Can We Go?

Shoutout

Greetings fellow Tenno! So I was struck by a random bolt of inspiration a few days ago, and for the heck of it I decided to do the math and figure out just how fast it's possible to get a Warframe going. The results have so far proven quite spectacular, so I though you folks might want to hear them, and maybe even try them out. Now, as far as I'm aware there is no upper limit on your movement speed stat, but in the event there is we'll just ignore it.

The first frame most people would think of in a case like this is Volt, and while he is vital to getting the best possible result he's actually a bit slow by default, so he isn't a contender for the top spot. As of writing this Loki has the highest base speed at 1.25, but if we factor in abilities and Augments Ivara (running on a zipline, that is) Zephyr and Nova pull ahead of the pack as well due to the bonuses from Infiltrate, Jet Stream and Escape Velocity, respectively. Jet Stream and Escape Velocity are party buffs however, so in practise Loki and Ivara are the only real contenders.

Now, on to the topic of mods. The main contenders for the Aura slot are Sprint Boost and Growing Power, and while Sprint Boost works better up to a point, eventually Growing Power overtakes it, so all four Warframes in the squad (currently consisting of a Zephyr, a Volt, a Nova and our runner) will be running it. As Speed and the bonuses from Infiltrate and Jet Stream scale with Ability Strength, all the frames but Loki will be equipped with Intensify, Energy Conversion, Blind Rage, Transient Fortitude, Power Drift and Augur Secrets, and all four will have Rush, Speed Drift and Armored Agility. Ivara and Zephyr need to swap one of these out for their Augments, so Zephyr will replace Speed Drift as she's not in the running and can afford the loss, and Ivara will replace Power Drift as the speed she would gain from scaling up Infiltrate is less than what she would gain from Speed Drift. Finally, everyone will use a melee weapon with Dispatch Overdrive attached.

Now, let's talk numbers. Speed, Infiltrate and Jet Stream are the only effects that scale, starting out at a 50% post-mod multiplier and a 25% and 40% mod bonus respectively. This means that the final equation will be base speed x (1 + mod mod bonuses) x (1 + Speed multiplier), as is more or less standard for Warframe. With all that Ability Strength Infiltrate ends up giving a 114.5% bonus and Jet Stream gives a 189.2% bonus, with Speed applying a final multiplier of 236.5%. If you haven't figured it out by now, these numbers are going to get big. It should be noticed at this point that, while Ivara moves at a reduced speed while Prowl is active, she still moves at full speed (and can sprint) while on a zipline, allowing her to take full advantage of the bonus from Infiltrate. We can also get a tiny bit more speed from from the Blight effect the Red Veil weapons give you, a 10% mod bonus.

Finally, to put it all together, our four speed mods plus Blight and Escape Velocity give a combined bonus of 177%, making our ultimate calcualtion "base speed x (1 + 1.77 + 1.892 [+ 1.145 for Ivara]) x (1 + 2.365)." First up is Volt with a base speed of 1, the standard value. Put through all these bonuses, this becomes a massive 15.68, which is already obscenely fast, but it only gets better. Next is Loki at* a base of 1.25, which* comes out as 19.62, and I've still saved the best for last. Ivara only has a base speed of 1.15, but the has the advantage of getting an extra kick from Infiltrate, far more than the paltry 0.1 advantage Loki has over her by default. This means that, when on a zipline with Prowl active and the buffs from Speed, Jet Stream, Escape Velocity, Dispatch Overdrive and Blight, most of which has been boosted by Energy Conversion and four stacks of Growing Power,* Ivara can reach a mind-boggling *speed of 22.51, a full 1857.55% increase from her base speed.

I doubt this would be even remotely controlable, and you'd never find a zipline long enough to maintain it for more than a fraction of second even with Dashwire Arrow, but based on everything I can find that is the fastest it's possible for you to move in Warframe. That's all I've got, no calls for buffs or nerfs or anything silly like that, just some hilariously high numbers. Thanks for reading!

Edit: up for less than an hour and people are already pointing out things I've missed. And here I thought the numbers were as silly as they could get. I'll try to keep this updated with the latest usable suggestions, and make a comment to recognise everyone who suggests something I've included.

Edit 2: Gold? Well, that happened, thank you kind sir/madam, particularly considering that it looks like I've missed quite a few things and miscalculated some values. The good news is, I've miscalculated them in a way that will probably make the final numbers even bigger. I might continue to update this post, but at the rate things are going I may just make a shorter 2.0 post once I've had a chance to check all my math. One way or another, stay tuned!

Posted Jun 1, 2018, 4:42 PM UTC · edited

7841
Cr4bd0gAmmo thirsty•

Quick maths... no, FAST maths.

Just you wait OP, you claim you're not calling for nerfs, but you've just ushered in the age of the zipline meta. We know what maximum efficiency is now, there's no way we can accept anything else.

Watch as growing power immediately spikes to hundereds of plat as everyone tries to cash in on this supreme speed. Tremble as Perrin Sequence + New Loka/Red Veil become the only viable syndicates, offering access to both Infiltrate and Jet Stream.

When DE finally cracks down on the rampant teamwork and synergy, removes the power strength scaling from Infiltrate and Jet Stream, makes Volt's two a self applied buff only, and deletes Mag from the game... this post will be our only nostalgic refuge to remember what could have been.

Mark my words Tenno, enjoy this while you can, make the most of this gift HPetch has bestowed upon us, create bittersweet memories with your comrades and record the fruits of your labour so that someday in the future we may look at them, they come to this place when they know they are not pure. Tenno use the keys, but they are mere trespassers. Only I, Vor, know the true power of the Void. I was cut in half, destroyed, but through it's Janus Key, the Void called to me. It brought me here and here I was reborn. We cannot blame these creatures, they are being led by a false prophet, an impostor who knows not the secrets of the Void. Behold the Tenno, come to scavenge and desecrate this sacred realm. My brothers, did I not tell of this day? Did I not prophesize this moment? Now, I will stop them. Now I am changed, reborn through the energy of the Janus Key. Forever bound to the Void. Let it be known, if the Tenno want true salvation, they will lay down their arms, and wait for the baptism of my Janus key. It is time. I will teach these trespassers the redemptive power of my Janus key. They will learn it's simple truth. The Tenno are lost, and they will resist. But I, Vor, will cleanse this place of their impurity.

I guess what this post truly teaches us is that we are all Ivara dashing along on the zipline of life, travelling at 1652.73% more than base movement speed through the tileset of our reality.

57
HPetchOP•

I'm... not sure how to feel about this. Bamboozled? Flattered? somewhere in the middle, I suppose.

21
IllumiNoEye_Gaming•

WHY THE ACTUAL HEK DID YOU POST THIS

12
Asphalt_Ship•

I saw this reply’s length, I knew what it was

5
Forma_AddictForma Noggle?•

All speed boost abilities stack additively. All sprint speed mods, Dispatch Overdrive, and Arcane Phantasm stack additively. Multiply the two previous totals with the base speed of a frame for final maximum.

(I am not including the Ivara zipline boost since the point of this is freedom of movement, and restricting it to on a zipline is counter to the entire idea. At that point, Wormhole is a faster equivalent.)

Your ideal squad setup is going to have Volt (+0.5x power strength to speed), and Zephyr (+0.4x power strength to speed). The next candidates are Nova (Escape Velocity, fixed +50% movement speed), Saryn Prime (+0.5x power strength to speed), and Equinox (not sure on exact value of strength buff, but it looks like it might be +0.35x power strength to power strength when Peaceful Provocation is equipped, possibly to a hard cap of +87.5%). For the designated runner, Nova (1.2 base speed) or Saryn Prime (1.0 speed, Arcane Phantasm > Arcane Hemlock (probably)) are both candidates.

You can either run 4x Growing Power for +100% power strength, or 4x Sprint Boost and Coaction Drift for +73.6% movement speed.

This gives a choice of +340.6% sprint speed (including Dispatch Overdrive and 2x Arcane Phantasm) with 373% power strength, or +267% sprint speed with 473% power strength. Note - some mods would have to be sacrificed on the designated runner frame. If Nova is the runner, this isn't the case.

Things get complicated when you include Equinox, but generally, you want power strength (after Equinox is equated) to be 2.22x the sprint multiplier if using Volt+Zephyr+Equinox+Nova, or 2.14x if using Volt+Zephyr+Equinox+Saryn. If using Volt+Zephyr+Nova+Saryn, then you also want power strength to be 2.14x the sprint multiplier.

Overall, I think the fastest combination would be Volt, Zephyr, Equinox, and Nova, with Nova being the runner and reaching absurd speed for an instant as she passes Zephyr.

^^^And ^^^you ^^^can ^^^also ^^^still ^^^bring ^^^eight ^^^players ^^^into ^^^Captura, ^^^I ^^^think...

10
HPetchOP•

Yeah, that all sounds pretty reasonable. I'm still going to keep Ivara as a runner in the name of big numbers, but your setup is less situational. Max Provoke buff is 80% with Peaceful Provocation according to the wiki, which for me ends up being a net gain over Escape Velocity. I'll probably factor in Arcane Phantasm as well, although it's frankly hilariously situational for how short it is. I'd say that you're on point for which group would be fastest, although depending on precisely how the speed boost from Molt applies (the wiki is currently ambiguous) Saryn could be substantially faster.

1
Forma_AddictForma Noggle?•

Molt works exactly the same as Speed, but only for Saryn. I listed that above, +0.5% movement speed per 1% power strength.

2
HPetchOP•

Well, that's potent. The question, then, is how it stacks with Speed, if at all. If it doesn't, Saryn stands no chance, but if it's additive she'll clean up, and if it's multiplicative she'll probably be able to break the sound barrier.

1
Forma_AddictForma Noggle?•

Different buff, additive. Again, I said this above.

2
Mellins•

Equinox Peaceful Provocation power strength cap is 50%. I have a build that can hit 45% and with growing power hits 50%. I've also gotten the frame buff from fissures, but it still sits at 50%. still, 50% per frame is a lot.

1
Forma_AddictForma Noggle?•

Just confirming, but that's definitely with the Augment? If that's so, then the mod text is very misleading.

1
Mellins•

No, actually I was totally wrong. Good catch. I was talking about Pacify & Provoke just the base ability, the augment's limits elude me. Sorry for the confusion.

According to the maximization tab on the wiki, my 50% for the ability is correct, and the augment can add up to another 30% for 80% total to everyone.

Apparently, this 80% is also a hard cap that's just coded in arbitrarily, seeing as energy conversion does NOT increase this cap at all, yet works on the base ability.

2
XTQuakeXYou think you know where this is going, but it's much worse.•

What about Saryn under new max Molt as a runner? And also actually jumping off of the Dashwires also imparts some serious boost to speed, for some reason.

5
HPetchOP•

Hmm, now there's a thought, I completely forgot about the new speed boost on Molt. The wiki doesn't really have any information on how that bonus interacts with others, so I can't really do any calculations, but even with her lower base speed it might be enough to push her ahead, possibly by quite a bit. The two biggest questions are A) if it's a 50% mod bonus, a 50% post-mod multiplier or some sort of unique 1.5x multiplier, and B) if, in the case of the latter two options, it stacks with Speed.

3
CasardisVenomous Blossom•

Saryn Prime has a slightly higher run speed than Saryn at least.

1
PoisonSDGoing nowhere slow•

What about Nezha with his slide speed bonus, and Firewalker?

4
Purexec•

My thoughts, but if we're just talking about Sprintspeed then his 1.15 basespeed and 20% from Firewalker won't hold up, probably.

In actual gameplay slides and -friction will make him faster, I'm pretty sure.

1
HPetchOP•

Thanks to u/NekrosP for suggesting Nova's Escape Velocity as something I'd missed.

3
BlastinburnGotta Go Fast•

I love going fast, being super excited to finally finish my volt speed build recently. I've been mulling in my head over what the max possible speed we could reach is for a while now. (As well as how I can drag my clan members into a fissure long enough to get all the conditional effects to line up and break the game.)

I've mostly been calculating with simpler numbers to get a rough idea of which frames would be best so I can avoid doing unnecessary math for frames that just don't cut it. That said your post has thrown a few wrenches into my calculations so far, so I'm going to throw a few wrenches your way. :)

First, you missed a very simple speed bonus [Kogake Prime](http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Kogake_Prime) has a passive 5% movement speed bonus when equiped. (Doesn't have to be the active weapon even, though you'll need it to be for dispatch overdrive anyway.)

Second, as has already been mentioned, you missed Nidus which I would like to expand on. Nidus's parasitic link is the absolute [king of power strength](http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Maximized_Ability_Strength#Energy_Conversion_Maximized_Ability_Strength). Granting the target a whopping massive 1238.26% total maximized power strength to the target! If you get enough stacks you can link to each other player (except Equinox since that is hard capped) in sequence before they cast their abilities to spread the buff around.

The biggest wrench that has come out of this thread for me is the calculations on Saryn, I apparently calculated something wrong originally and completely dismissed her as a candidate, as I didn't realize that her buff was exactly the same as Volt's but for herself only. Add that she has an arcane helmet that increases movement speed by 10% and there is no doubt that she should be the runner. Even if Ivara didn't need to use ziplines, her buff is only 25% of power strength instead of 50%.

This leaves the only slot open as either Equinox with Peaceful provocation, or Zephyr with Jetstream. Since peaceful provocation is hard-caped ~80% bonus ability strength, my bets would be on Zephyr's base 40% of ability strength movement bonus winning that out.

Side note about arcanes. The same arcane effects do not stack, but the chances do. This means that swapping out one arcane on volt and saryn for their arcane helmet doesn't sacrifice any speed, only ease of getting the buff.

Between sprint boost and growing power I'm not sure which is better though I would bet against it being growing power like you said. The reason being is that other than nidus, everyone will only be getting a fraction of growing power's buff (And equinox wouldn't benefit at all.), whereas sprint boost will be 100% effective even without coaction drift. That said, increasing power strength and sprint speed together is most likely to result in going faster, so it would depend on how the math works out. (Ex. 1.5x boost on 1.5 sprint is better than 2.0x boost on 1.0 sprint.) Though seeing as how much power we are getting out of nidus, sprint boost is probably better since that would be multiplicative with his additional buff, while an additional 100% strength on top of 1000% isn't that much.

2
HPetchOP•

Lots of good points here, although I've already picked most of it up from other comments or my own realisations. I'll have to check out the Kogake Prime thing, every little bit helps in the search for the biggest numbers possible. I'm thinking about Nidus, it really comes down to whether a really big boost to one buff outweighs a smaller boost to several. That will take a while to calculate, largely due to the sheer number of possible permutations.

I'm not sure what you mean about everyone only getting a fraction of the power from Growing Power, it should apply to everyone the same way such that if all four players get a proc, everyone gets 100% extra strength in total. It also lets you skip out on Coaction Drift, making room for other strength or speed mods. Still, considering how many new variables are in the mix I'll probably have to go back to checking all the different ratios of the two Auras, although the gap has only widened in favor of Growing Power as the base speed has gone up. The new Saryn speed boost is definitely an interesting wrinkle, she'll probably take top banana once I redo all the math with that in mind but I'm a little spreadsheeted out for the moment.

3
BlastinburnGotta Go Fast•

You can use the nidus buff on everyone so long as you have at least 3 stacks, they just have to cast their ability while link is active on them. As an example, link to zephyr (if not using equinox) cast jet stream, link to volt and cast speed, link to saryn and cast molt. All 3 other frames have now gotten the buff from parasitic link, since abilities only care about your stats at time of cast. It's more effort but it is without a doubt the best power buff available.

As for growing power let me see if I can explain better. For simplicity I'm going to only use 1 of each aura, since we can just multiply the results by 4 later to get a full team. (I'm also going to round sprint boost with coaction drift down to 19 for the same reason. Sidenote, only the runner needs the non-aura sprint mods, so the buffers are going to have plenty of mod space open for other mods like coaction drift. Even with every power strength mod you will still have 3-4 slots open.) So what I meant by a "portion" is how much of that increase directly affects speed. Using Volt as an example, Volt's speed bonus is 50% of ability strength, so the 25% buff of growing power only translates to a 12.5% increase in speed. Saryn has the same % as volt, zephyr has a slightly lower 40%, and Equinox gets no benefit since her buff is hard capped ~80% power strength.

As an example let's do some very simple math: with a theoretical base sprint speed of 1.0, a volt speed buff with 100% power strength, and either sprint boost or growing power.

  • Sprint boost gives 15% sprint speed for 1.15, 50% speed boost gives us an increase of .575 and a total speed of 1.725.
  • Growing power gives a 25% power boost so volt has 125% total power for a 62.5% speed boost (since the speed boost is 50% of power strength), apply that boost to the base 1.0 speed and we get an increase of .625 for a total speed of 1.625.

As you can see in this simple example at least, growing power is less effective, but why is that? The reason is that any power strength bonus has to be fed through the 50% conversion from speed. A 1% sprint speed bonus is going to outclass a 1% power bonus which only give 0.5% speed.

The only way that growing power could ever be better with this team setup is to keep both sides of the multiplication as close as possible. When multiplying having 2 similar numbers will give better results than 2 disparate numbers. (Ex. 4x4 vs 6x2) Unfortunately for growing power, our power strength is going to be significantly higher than our pre-ability sprint speed thanks to nidus. An addative 25% on top of 1000%+ isn't a big difference, but a 15% that gets multiplied by that 1000% (or 500%, since it gets filtered through volt) is a much bigger deal.

All that said, it's entirely possible that growing power does work out to being better, and I will use whatever makes me go fastest, but I wouldn't bet against sprint boost.

Edit: I just took a look at my notes and I don't think anyone has talked about Octavia's Vivache speed boost. I have no idea how well that compares, what I do know is that it will be a huge pain to pull off.

1
AGU100•

Assuming this is on a flat plane, you might be able to go faster by maximizing melee attack speed. Each melee attack moves you forward 1 body space. If you attack fast enough, with Volt and Valkyr's attack speed buffs with Growing Power and Equinox buff, and maximize attack speed on your melee weapon, I think it may be possible to go faster. Of course, at that point, you are limited by how fast you can spam melee attacks and your frame rate.

2
Fire2xdxd•

INITIAL D MUSIC STARTS PLAYING

2
NotPanda•

I don't see any mention of Nidus. His Parasitic Link is a multiplicative bonus to power strength and you can use it on all the other frames.

1
HPetchOP•

Hmm, interesting. I'll have to look into that possibility, thanks!

1
FlameVisit99•

Wouldn't a max duration Tail Wind still beat that?

1
HPetchOP•

Possibly, but it isn't nearly as funny. It would depend on how the Warframe speed units convert to meters per second.

1
EzbiorTrapframe is bestframe•

meters per second

Does anyone have to conversion rate on that?

1
Honnou•

What about the 10% sprint speed boost from red veil weapon proc?

1
HPetchOP•

That already struck me (haven't factored it in yet), but thanks for mentioning it!

1
kuhvir•

Rhino is pretty fast. I have a 1.77 sprint speed I think. Plus some slide mods. You can really move with him

1
SaxPantherPM_ME_NEW_WAR_THEORIES•

Sprinting, sure, but won't Nezha ultimately be faster by sliding?

1
Orkekum•

Does teleportatiom count?

0
HPetchOP•

I would say that's cheating, personally. Teleportation isn't so much moving fast as it is moving quickly.

3
NekrosP#1 Ass Eater•

I think he meant Nova's Augment which increases your speed after leaving the portal. Not sure if it scales with PS.

1
HPetchOP•

Ah, I see. Quick wiki check indicates that it doesn't, but it's a party buff, so while it wouldn't be enough to make Nova herself a contender it would certainly push the cap higher. I'll have to add that to the calculations.

1
Forma_AddictForma Noggle?•

Nova is a contender as a runner, since she has 1.2 sprint speed, second only to Loki and Vanguard Rhino.

1
random11714•

And there's also Nova's Escape Velocity augment

1