r/ADHD•
unpythonic

[Rant] Manager upbraided me today for ADHD compensation strategy

Today I had a meeting with my manager's manager who, among other things, told me that people didn't think I "engaged" or "paid attention" during meetings because at pretty much every meeting I take notes.

Where I work we develop tablet devices and pen devices and the software to take notes on them, so I use the tools that we make to take notes during the meeting. I do this precisely so that I remain engaged, focused and don't spend the hour daydreaming. Last week someone caught me after a meeting to ask how I configure everything because I appeared to be so organized.

This manager knows that it is a compensation strategy for ADHD - I have no idea to respond. If I stop taking notes purely for "business theater" then I will probably stop engaging the material but if I continue taking notes then I'm appearing (at least to him) not to engage the meeting.

Anyone ever experienced something like this? Did you find a solution?

Posted Sep 24, 2018, 10:18 PM UTC

2523
glitchy911•

“Yes, I take notes in every meeting for posterity and as a sign of respect for the issues being discussed. Recording the important points we raise ensure that we have documented action items and accountability. I also record informational points for my own recall. I apologize that I wasn’t aware it came across as disrespectful, how would you prefer I document our meetings? There is so much value contributed that I would hate to miss anything”

Yeah it’s manipulative. It’s still right. It still works. Try reframing into how you’re helping the company and what is their alternative suggestion if they don’t like it

52
IshanjiADHD-PI•

This all the way. It sounds like management is only complaining because somebody else complained to them. Meanwhile, you have hard evidence to prove that you're more engaged than any of those jokers. Don't be afraid to show your notes to management. It'll make you look studious and engaged while making the people who complained look bad.

15
krazeevilturtle•

You could even offer to send out a summary of your notes after meetings. I did this for a couple of meetings and still do when someone can't attend. Now no one bothers me about being on my computer during meetings, especially since I totally saved my manager's bacon by being able to give almost a word-for-word transcript from a meeting with a vendor.

It kind of backfires sometimes though because I often write in shorthand, doodle, and even snark in my personal notes. If I wasn't expecting to share, I end up having to clean them up before sending out my notes.

9
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

His accusation wasn't "disrespect" it was more akin to "disinterest". He said that people at meetings felt that I wasn't participating or engaged or paying attention because instead of holding eye contact with everyone the entire meeting, I would frequently look down at the device and make a note about what was said, I question I had about something that was said or a decision made.

1
mostlynose•

Please note one thing: he gave you multiple reasons and instructions. This means you can pick which ones to go forward with. Choose to go along with this part of what be said: to keep eyes at people, not at the screen. If you want, ask for/buy yourself a basic Bluetooth keyboard that works with your phone. Keep said phone in your pocket as you type. All you'll be doing is tappning away at a keyboard in front of you, and you won't feel as "hidden" to the others. If your boss asks again, you can counter that you've already made an improvemeny on his main message from last time, to keep your eyes at people, not your screen.

1
katzekloADHD & Parent•

Personally, I don't reveal to anyone at work that I have ADHD. I don't believe anything good can come out of it.

5
agarath666•

Sounds like the upper management is a bully.

Speak to HR.

4
Andrew_KorenchkinADHD-PI•

HR is evil and does not give a shit about you. HR will absolutely protect upper management and will resort to dirty tactics and manipulation to ensure that YOU, the lower level employee, is disciplined or fired, no matter how unfair or injust your treatment is.

7
katzekloADHD & Parent•

Unfortunately, you're right.

They're hired to deal with lower level employees' "bullshit," not to discipline/fire higher level employees.

1
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

Thanks. The conversation we had certainly "felt" like bullying - to the point that he even made a face and mimed me scribbling away on the tablet. Fortunately it is a big company; it is probably more productive to look into a transfer before looking to HR.

0
agarath666•

You of course would know best. Don't hesitate to let use know how it all goes.

1
canuckpopsicle•

Wait... so your company develops note-taking software that you utilize to take notes at the meetings at your note program company... and someone is upset about this?! What better way to test the product than using it?! Through taking notes you're probably the best person to make improvement recommendations!

I also take notes during meetings because it helps me stay engaged vs. daydreaming, sleeping, etc. so I totally get the why.

It's a shame your manager is dumb.

4
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

Well, we actually develop a LOT of software, but yeah - One Note taking software product is something we develop. I'm usually the only one who uses the pen for note taking in a meeting. Years ago I would type it, but I found that that I could nearly take dictation with my typing and - importantly - that my brain had "routed around" the cognitive areas such that it went from ears to my fingers without making a significant stop in the higher functioning areas. For whatever reason that doesn't happen with the pen.

2
panic_infinite_124ADHD-PI•

Geez, you seriously have my sympathy. How backwards is that to get talked to because you take notes during meetings? That would drive me up the wall because of how pitty/nitpicking it is.

Like u/glitchy911 said, I would suggest talking to this person again and politely explain to them you didn't mean to be disrespectful and you're trying to be as organized as possible so that you can perform well at your job.

One of the safest things you can do to try and fix things is to ask. Ask this manager in order for you to stay organized and not miss any details, what do they personally suggest you do? If they mention about not taking any notes, express that you heavily rely on being able to write things down so that you mitigate mistakes.

3
Johnny_Lawless_Esq•

I'd be perfectly happy to rely on audio recordings if the company could cover the cost of transcription software...

3
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

Well, the company could easily do that. They could even pull it from the funds earmarked for accommodating employees who need accommodation. I really need to be present and attentive to the material in the meetings, and I am - just not in the way he approves of apparently.

1
JohnMarstonJrADHD•

Personally, I'd just try to look more engaged while taking notes. Its easy for me to say that but might not be easy to put into practice.

From your description it doesn't seem worth it to get HR involved. HRs mandate is to protect the business and more than likely complaining about a sr managers comment about "not being engaged in an interview" will end up reflecting badly on you. Whether its right or not thats what is probably gonna happen.

Try and make a habit of scanning the room and making eye contact with whoever is talking. It'll take practice to do this while taking notes but its the right move.

3
LalaDub•

Correct me if I’m wrong... Wouldn’t/couldn’t note taking fall under reasonable accommodations for the ADA?

None of us deserve to be bullied into bending over for asshole‘s just to be able to remain or obtain gainful employment.

3
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

I thought about that for a minute, but as an engineer there are so many options available it doesn't seem like the wisest move is to pick that as the hill to die on.

1
LalaDub•

You think HR would terminate you for bringing a violation of the ADA to their attention? Wouldn’t Human Resources be the ones that want to keep stuff like that from happening/getting out and potentially damaging the company?

2
unpythonicOPADHD-PI•

No, no, my apologies I'm not communicating so well. I'm saying that the drama of going the HR route is way more hassle than just internally transferring to another team with a more reasonable manager. While HR may smack him down, now I'd have a resentful manager directly above my manager.

1
LalaDub•

Ohhhhhh ok. That makes sense. I’m genuinely curious about people’s experiences because I’ve never disclosed to an employer. Initially I didn’t because I didn’t realize how much ADD affected me. Since then I’ve been living vicariously through my sister and her extremely positive results with disclosing. She has some pretty dope accommodations at her current and former employer so it’s hard to see so many people feeling like they have to keep it inside.

1
Gatcoe93•

Start using a notepad instead. Something tiny and classy or whatever with a nice pen.

2