Fact Check: Cordray not responsible for Ohio Job lossee
politifact.com/ohio/statements/2018/oct/29/mi...
politifact.comPosted Oct 30, 2018, 9:52 PM UTC
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politifact.comThe bulk of GOP advertising I get in the mail is "vote against {Democrat opponent}."
The bulk of Democrat advertising I get in the mail is "vote for {Democrat}", and/or "thanks for registering to vote/Go vote next Tuesday."
It's fairly telling.
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"X candidate is TOO LIBERAL for Ohio"
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Bush recession was due to Clinton's FED bubble..
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Clinton did contribute to it, but Bush's policies are the main cause.
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Again false - there would've been a depression if Bush didn't bailout the economy via the FED, which only prolonged the day of reckoning. Everything done up until today is a result of dealing with Greenspan's machinations that have misaligned the business cycle.
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False. Credit default swaps, approved by the Bush administration, and a total collapse of oversight, led by the Bush administration, led to a massive housing bubble and pop.
If you take over a company and it fails you can't just blame the manager from 8 years ago. The buck stops at your desk. They could have acted and prevented it.
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No kidding...the DeWine advertisements have gotten comical. Still think he is going to win unfortunately, but the dude is pure poison.
I'm terrified frankly. Oh you defended pre-existing conditions seven times Mike? Bullshit. Any politician actively rallying against the protections that literally saved my life and millions of others should be required to go to our funerals once we can't get coverage. Period.
It's sickening. And we (the "we" on my side at least) need to start getting a hell of a lot more mad than we are. I'm not dying on DeWine's account and his GOP handlers. Not happening without one hell of a fight.
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Don’t give up hope yet. Forecasts for the governor elections declared our state as one of the closest in the country, and now, inching more towards the side of Cordray: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2018-midterm-election-forecast/governor/
I think people are going to be more than mad if DeWine actually wins, especially as more and more people push for Cordray. At least, so I hope...
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DeWine said, "During the Strickland-Cordray era taxes were raised by $800 million and Ohio lost 400,000 jobs."
This is a case of misplaced blame. The ad tries to scare voters into portraying Cordray as a tax hiker responsible for job losses when in fact there is no evidence he deserves any blame.
A classic case of PolitiFact subjectively picking and choosing how they rate statements by invoking context when they please or judging on the pure merit of the statement.
"What he said is right, but we don't think it's fair because other reasons, so we rate it mostly false."
Political ads on both sides are going to be garbage grasping at straws. Don't blindly subscribe to the words of a "fact checking" authority because they say so, practice independent critical thinking.
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I see two points to your comment. First, about Politfact's subjective scale:
A classic case of PolitiFact subjectively picking and choosing how they rate statements by invoking context when they please or judging on the pure merit of the statement.
"What he said is right, but we don't think it's fair because other reasons, so we rate it mostly false."
I accept that their rating is subjective, but I also comment them for explaining their reasoning and citing their sources. This isn't them opaquely labeling the DeWine camp liars. We are free to reach our own conclusions.
In my personal opinion, I think Politifact was too easy on the ad. I would've rated it Pants on Fire. Cordray's position was only slightly more accountable for job losses than he is for which way the wind blows.
Political ads on both sides are going to be garbage grasping at straws.
Yes, both sides run ads that cite things out of context, or try to imply guilt by association, etc. This particular ad I called out and posted here about is one that I couldn't tune out and kept thinking back to. I'm not trying to single out DeWine or one side. There's just something about this ad that bothered me more than the others I'm mostly able to ignore.
Don't blindly subscribe to the words of a "fact checking" authority because they say so, practice independent critical thinking.
This echoes your first point and my response that I agree, and Politifact shared their raw material so that we can practice our own critical thinking. We can examine their reasoning and their sources, and go beyond and read other opinions and sources beyond what they cite. The fact that Politifact is open like that actually raises them a notch in my book, even if I don't always agree with their rating.
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How can you rate it pants on fire if what he is saying is the literal truth? Cordray was a part of the Strickland administration that oversaw tax raises and job losses. Now why those things happened is a matter of debate, but that is a deflection from the original statement. That's why it's stupid. That's why these "fact checkers" are stupid, they're politicized themselves and go out of their way to rope in subjectivity and obfuscation.
I'm actually surprised this was the ad that triggered you, I thought the rape kit one was more crass and below the belt. "Democrat will raise taxes" is a recurring election theme.
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What portion of jobs were lost in Ohio? What portion of jobs were lost in the nation at the same time? That delta is what would be arguably attributable to Ohio's leaders.
Now, who had the most power to affect jobs and taxes on Ohio at that time?
- Strickland? Yes.
- The Ohio Legislature? Yes.
- Cordray? Hardly.
It's clear the commercial is trying to suggest electing Cordray would lead to job losses. I'm saying it's not even clear that Strickland or the Ohio Legislature had a significant impact because the whole country fell into a recession because of national and international problems, not Ohio decisions.
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Taxes weren't raised.
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This statement pertains to a decision by Strickland in late 2009 to freeze a scheduled 4.2 percent income tax cut, the final year of a five-year cut.
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I wonder if it's implications from when NCR and a few others packed up and moved out of state?
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Blaming a governor for a national recession is idiotic.
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It's what Kasich ran on and won. Turns out we are not very smart.
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Exactly, what annoys me about blatantly false or misleading political attack ads is that I know that a huge segment of Ohio's voting population will believe them and parrot what they say to their friends and family. Information literacy is low among the general voting populace and understanding of macroeconomics is even lower, so it galls me to see politicians deliberately exploit the ignorance of the population to get elected. If you can't win on your ideas, and instead need to rely on deliberate misinformation to "trick" voters into supporting you, then get the hell out of politics.
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If you can't win on your ideas, and instead need to rely on deliberate misinformation to "trick" voters into supporting you, then get the hell out of politics.
Agree 100%! But it's not just tricking voters with misleading propaganda, but also gerrymandering and voter suppression tactics. All tools to overcome the disadvantage of unpopular policy opinions.
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It was a simple question related to how/why someone could claim such a thing. There was no 'blame' assigned to the expected conversation (that never happened, because apparently it struck a they-must-be-the-enemy nerve).
Perhaps I should have prefaced the question with my disdain for the current governor to avoid being seen as the enemy, but I 'assumed' that wouldn't be necessary. Silly me...
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Question why do people honestly care so much about NCR? It ended being like 300 jobs that left Dayton. NCR had basically been in the process of moving from Dayton since the last 70's.
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I try to tune out ads, especially political ads, but the anti-Cordray ad blaming him for Ohio's job losses during the national recession has been grating on me. I was about to find concrete facts to corroborate by recollection, but Politifact beat me to it.
Any ad that talks about our leaders "depleting the rainy day fund" during the Great Recession gets on my nerves... of course they used up the rainy day fund during the most severe economic downturn since the Great Depression, that's what it's there for - to continue funding Ohio's government and public services in the event of a sudden loss of revenue.
Not to mention, Cordray was Ohio AG at the time. What was he supposed to do about the rainy day fund as AG?
You're right. It wasn't even just a rainy day. It was a monsoon!