BMW E46 M3 CSL: The M3 Masterpieces Ep.3 | Carfection 4K
Posted Apr 29, 2019, 1:18 PM UTC
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Controversial opinion; the CSL is being let down by the SMG and a standard M3 with CSL mods drives better
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Talking shit about the SMG is not a controversial opinion.
The SMG, without doubt, is faster around a track, like for like. People may not like it, and they may prefer a manual, but the SMG, for its time, was great and can be great fun to drive, in addition to being faster.
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The SMG, even with CSL programming, is not good enough at rev matching. It's good for track work up to a point, and then it's better with a manual. I had an SMG car and put in CSL shift programming. It was better than stock, but still not good enough. The slight delay and close-but-not-close-enough rev matching made for dangerous corner entry.
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I just got off a track in my CSL software SMG M3.
It was freaking perfect. Mid corner rev matches and everything. Never once unsettled the car. Its possible your SMG system wasnt working 100%. They often arent.
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Yep, that's a distinct possibility. That doesn't make me any more inclined to use an SMG, though. I prefer a transmission that isn't often broken.
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The SMG transmission is hot doodoo flavored garbage. I've tried it on three separate occasions and even flat out it's jerky and cannot rev match to save its SMG pump.
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It takes a bit to get used to it. It has to be driven in a particular manner. A couple days with it really isn’t enough time to get it
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Have you ever driven a VW GTI dsg or golf r dsg
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I used to own a 2015 Golf R. The SMG is no where close in terms of refinement to the DSG.
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The SMG, without doubt, is faster around a track, like for like. People may not like it, and they may prefer a manual, but the SMG, for its time, was great and can be great fun to drive, in addition to being faster.
Not true in the slightest. The CSL is only 0.1 seconds faster in the quarter mile than a non CSL 6 speed E46 M3 which is easily attributed to it's ~300 weight savings.
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The quarter mile is not "around a track"
I wouldn't expect the SMG to be any faster in a straight line, really.
Where the benefit is going to come in is with quicker, most consistent, and more reliable shifts while going around a track.
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Where the benefit is going to come in is with quicker, most consistent, and more reliable shifts while going around a track.
Automatics are garbage on the road course too, I just used that as an example to show how its not actually faster, maybe if you're terrible at driving it would be better, but not otherwise. I mean, if it were faster everyone in GTS would be using it, but they all use either a sequential six speed, except for one guy using a stock 6 speed, and one guy using an SMG because he's cannot drive stick.
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The asymmetrical bumper openings bother me, too. If I were building a CSL for track work, I'd have to cut a hole or go back to a regular M3 front bumper to get good brake duct inlets. I think I saw an aftermarket bumper with symmetrical CSL openings and no fog lights. That was pretty cool.
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Yeah from bumper has always bothered me on csl, everything else is great and I love CSL style wheels
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[deleted]
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The thing with the CSL is that it's extremely rare, BMW made very few of them hence the insane prices. M3 with CSL airbox and suspension work would also be my pick for 25k all in for an uber clean one
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Yeah you can make a better car for less with a normal E46. They cost a lot because they are rare, a bit special etc. Cheapest one in the UK atm is about £40k, the cheapest manual coupe is about £8k.
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Catchpole seemed pretty disappointed the E36 was the last manual M3 he's doing in this series.
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The E46 M3 gets a lot of praise, and I think its one of those cars that deserves every bit of it. Its performance, looks, and everything else is well documented, but there are lots of cars with better numbers.
But the beauty of the E46 M3 is just how common it is. This means this car is within reach to most all enthusiasts. Its quite unique in that way.
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A friend just bought a nice one in the UK for about £7k. Full service history, under 70k miles, drives brilliantly.
he does know his way around them, but even so, it's a bit of a find. Huge amount of car for the money.
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Holy fuck they're cheap over there ... Maybe you can get one with 140k miles plus for under 10 USD but might be sketchy
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Nitpick: the sport button doesn't actually do anything other than change the electronic throttle's map. The sound and performance are exactly the same.
But really, he nailed why I love the E46. The S54 may not be the most powerful (or most reliable) engine, but it has an insane sound and loves to rev. It's balanced, but tail-happy -- it breaks away hard but it's easy to control it in a slide with throttle. It's clearly not a new car, but it also doesn't feel dated.
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I disagree, its definitely dated. Drive a new M3 and come back to the E46 and say it doesn't feel old.
Its definitely old, but that isn't a bad thing. It offers something unique and the experience of it is what doesn't age.
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Drive a new M3 and come back to the E46 and say it doesn't feel old.
"Dated" doesn't just mean "older". If someone drove an E46 and a brand-new F80 back to back, they would definitely guess that the F80 is the newer of the two. But if you asked them how much newer the F80 is, I'd be willing to bet that they'd underestimate it. Unlike the E36, which looks and feels like a "90s car", the E46 doesn't look or feel like the rest of the industry left it behind in 2006.
Most people who think the E46's handling is dated have only driven E46s that really needed some maintenance. With new bushings and shocks, mine doesn't feel like an old car at all. And when people ask me what year it is, they're always shocked when I tell them that it's a 2003.
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Tbh same with e36, people think they’re poor handling, because of 20+ year old bushings that are screwed.
Did a full refurb on my 36 328 a couple years ago, every single bushing on the car replaced, used OEM, with a mix of upgrades, like m3 offset lollipop bushes for more castor, m3 balljoints in the rear hubs, e30 front lower arms for solid balljoints etc.
Now? With the coilovers I’ve got it out handles many many newer cars on tight roads, friends with e9x m3s can’t corner as fast (obviously way way faster on the straights) but handling wise the chassis is amazing
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Just curious how much does it cost to replace all those?
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I still need to do all my rear bushings and subframe but definitely need some coilovers too
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I did it all at once, and it made a huge difference.
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on the CSL the sport button also makes the big induction flap open at 3000rpm instead of later (I can't remember when, I took my flap out fully)
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One of my friends sisters had a CSL from new. No idea why, she said it was 'too loud'. Sold it right when they were at their lowest pricing too!
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Really? Even new I think you had to go out of your way to buy one. I wonder why she got it?
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They're rich, and I think it was just 'the best option'. I.e. most expensive.
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The CSL is a car I will forever be thankful for. Not because I ever got to drive one, but it got me into cars and hence changed my life.
When fast internet came to my neck of the woods, I searched YouTube for it and found the glorious Top Gear Clip on it. Which instantly made me a Top Gear addict and made me want to get into the car industry.
15 years later now, working for an OEM (not BMW) and if I won the lottery tomorrow, the CSL would be pretty high up on my shopping list. How often I drooled over the CSL at the BMW Museum in Munich...(and how I curse the guy who put it there for choosing a black one as the carbon roof isn’t as pronounced on it...)
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is it this one :)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/vi2yat3nfwybtxi/2014-08-29%2012.24.19.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/j58vktaqtlug1a9/2014-08-29%2012.25.11.jpg?dl=0
i fell in love with a dtm e30 m3, my good that car.
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Yeah It's one of my attainable dream cars but I can't see them staying round 40/50k for much longer.
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Well...I need to get another change of pants.
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My dream car, but in hellrot red
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I love these cars, but I'm still happy that I decided not to get one because of the vanos and rear subframe issues. I have 4 friends that have had one over the rears, and all has at least one if not both issues.
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Best to tackle those problems before they become problems. It's a good chunk of money up front but it's less headaches down the line.
After those (and rod bearings) are addressed, they pretty solid cars (besides the usual BMW quibbles like window regulators).
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Or, hear me out.... Buy a more reliable car without thousands of dollars in preventative issues. I went with the s2000 and never looked back. 115k miles and a decade later and I've replaced an alternator, and a single faulty electrical component.
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I'm not saying you're wrong with your decision not to get one. Those issues are things you have to know going into an E46 M3.
Your point makes logical sense...but car enthusiasts don't usually follow logic. Some of us buy what our heart wants.
Curious if your friends bought theirs new or used?
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I believe one new, three used. Also, not exactly like I bought a Prius. It was still an emotional buy.
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If you're really into a car you'll fix the issues anyway though
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It's boring as fuck change my mind
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Perfectenshlag
*Perfectenhagen
Same thing.