Collteral Murder (Wikileaks video) released on YouTube
Posted Apr 5, 2010, 2:56 PM UTC
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Can't spell Collateral apparently.
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It's a wonder pokemon can spell at all; I've never heard mine say anything other than "PIKA PIKA" and the occasional "DONT PUT IT THERE."
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I am not going to watch it because I just try not watch any video footage of someone dying or being hurt badly. I rather just read a description etc.
For every time people can catch something like this on video, how many times has it happened without any evidence of it? hundreds of times? i dunno
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The soldiers need to be fucking trained properly.
"He's probably, uh, picking up a weapon". Probably? Uh? And thats enough "evidence" to end lives?
If you can't get confirmation then you shouldn't fucking shoot. Any soldier that passes on information like "He might probably uh be picking up a weapon maybe" should punished and then retaught how to observe properly.
In some cases they might be "trying to pick up weapons" but in this case it is obvious that they are not. They say that just so they an excuse to shoot their fucking toy.
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repost
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Watch the 2nd video too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=is9sxRfU-ik&feature=channel
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RAMIREZ: PRESS 4 TO LEVEL THOSE CIVILIANS.
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Wow, never seen this before.
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HOLY SHIT ANOTHER ONE OF THESE THREADS ON THE FRONTPAGE YEAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! downvoted for the infinite repetition of this thread
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zapped!
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This is so fucking stupid. Every single person on the audio that cleared engagement should be locked up for the rest of their lives. War is not a fucking game.
"I see a weapon" - While looking at someone carrying what looks like a camera or case on their right side with a shoulder strap. It is NOT a fucking weapon.
"I see six people with AK47s" - Your fucking point? Its Iraq. It's not illegal for them to carry weapons. Also, there are not six! You can see 2-3 AK's AT MOST in the video and to me, they look like protection for the Journalists. Not insurgents.
"All right I see an RPG" - WTF?!?!?! I CANNOT SEE AN RPG. I see a long stuck like object that might be a boom mic but not an RPG. Plus, you're in a fucking Apache, as if they can shoot you down with an RPG.
"Looks like possibly uh they're picking up bodies and weapons" - While the people from the van are picking up bodies. I did not see them pick up weapons AT ALL. You fucking PRICKS.
"Come on let us shoot" - While the people in the van were picking up wounded. That bloodthirsty to shoot unarmed people?
"Oh yeah look at that! Right through the windshield!" - Impressive you immoral fuck.
34:30+ "You're clear. I'm firing" - Firing at a missile on the street. But there is a civilian walking across the frame in plain view that his spotter MUST have seen and that he can see BEFORE he fires. Dead.
This makes me so angry. Fuck them. Fuck anyone who supports the bullshit wars our governments lied us into. Fuck any soldier that thinks war is a game and that killing unarmed people is acceptable.
Hindsight sure is 20/20 isn't it. That still looks like an RPG to me, maybe we could get some better helicopter optics but then people would just bitch about the cost.
The way he was handling the camera really did look like some form of a weapon, this coming from an untrained civilian eye. The argument that they're in a helicopter doesn't hold water with me, as the whole purpose of these copters is to defend ground troops.
However, all the engagements after the first are brutal, they don't really seem necessary. The eagerness to attack is sad but within the context of war, it seems a little more comprehensible. That said, this is a really disappointing video. Fuck war, and fuck these foreign engagements. They're a waste of time, money, and most importantly, human lives.
I can agree with that
War is not a game..and that is why they are so quick to shoot, because the enemy is as well...You don't think this exact situation hasn't occurred before? Maybe when that camera is an RPG? And who cares if it is legal to have an AK-47 in Iraq, it is a gun and it is war...
Making these judgment calls is near impossible in the situation. It isn't a game, you can't pause. You can't restart because that camera is an RPG and you just died. You can't say oops it looks like there were 3 guys in that van and they just jumped out with RPGs.
They acted in haste and were over anxious. Understand the context of the war they are fighting (insurgent where anyone and everyone could be an enemy at any time). They made a big mistake but it was a mistake and accident of the job and is somewhat understandable given the context of it all.
War is not a game...you shouldn't bring kids to a place where people just got shot. You shouldn't be out with people with guns because you want to shoot some photos.
But these people are in an AH-64D Apache Gunship.
But these people are in an AH-64D Apache Gunship.
It is not understandable. These people are in an AH-64D Apache Gunship.
Agreed.
However the rest of your point is void. These people were no danger. If they were shooting at the Apache or allied troops then I could understand. But this? This is just murder. We can murder people just because they are holding weapons? We're holding weapons yet when they kill us they're "terrorists"?
The Apache was in no danger. They could have circled round several more times to 100% id the weapons
Oh, I'm sorry there are some reporters out, doing their jobs, risking their lives to keep YOU informed. I'm sorry they need bodyguard because they are often kidnapped and hostage.
It is war and we go to it telling ourselves we are the good guys while killing reporters and innocents and then lying to the world:
“There is no question that coalition forces were clearly engaged in combat operations against a hostile force,” said Lt. Col. Scott Bleichwehl, a spokesman for the multinational forces in Baghdad.
ground troops were present. The gunship isn't in danger, nor is it supposed to be in danger. It is an escort for people on the ground. These people were protecting their ground troops. This also doesn't make me support how they carried this out, but just get your fact straight.
Note: I am not taking any stance on the politicalness of this but...
They probably didn't see the civilian in time. They were making two passes and at 34:34 they were tracking to fire and were probably preparing to fire. The civilian made into the frame at the 34:38. Missile was fired between 34:38 and 34:40 and made contact at 34:44.
It was tragic timing for the guy walking down the street.
didn't it kind of remind you of this Family Guy clip?