Source
r/IAmA•
Flensed

IAmA broken man.

I'm 37. I have a good job with a major company, I make a good six figure salary, and have savings and little debt. I'm an MBA. I have a son, he's 6. I 'own' a home (to be honest I co-own a home with the bank) and I am not underwater on the mortgage. My family likes me and I like them. I have a small but great group of friends. I like my job, and the people I work with.

I'm broken.

I carry the date 11-14 around with me evey day, and it hurts like swallowing boiling water. That's the day I asked my ex-wife if she was sleeping with other people, and she said yes. It was over four years ago, and I still can see the bedroom and her as if it was this morning.

I've rebuilt from there. I have joint custody of my son, and he is doing well despite his parents choices (and to a great deal due to a huge effort by both of us to give him the best possible life we can, even if we have failed to build the lives we want for ourselves).

Divorce when you have children is very hard, becuase you have to work with the one person in the world that hurts you the most, becuase it is what's best for your kids. You do it, since as a dad you'd walk through fire for your little one, in this case phychic fire instead of physical.

When I have my son (every other weekend, 50% weeknights) I do pretty well. I'm happy, and present, and engaged with him. When I'm at work, I do pretty well, happy, engaged, present.

When I'm not at work, and my son is not with me, I am deeply, deeply sad, and terribly lonely. This weekend I should be doing things, instead I stay home feeling trapped by the walls around me. I know I have options, but even when I go out, I wander trails and malls and resturants and movie theaters alone, watching other people and feeling very, very distant from them.

I wake up having dreamed about 11-14. There's a little voice (metaphysical one, not literal) in my head that points out I'm not good enough, not desirable enough, and broken.

I surf meetup and reddit and the rest of the web, finding so many things I could go do... and I don't. Becuase I'm broken says the voice, becuase I'm not good enough, becuase I'm not a desirable human being.

Friends are hard. When I call them and organize things to do, we have a great time. But they don't call me if I don't call them. I know every group has it's cruise director, apparently I'm the one of mine, and I hate it, because the little voice points out that again I'm the weak link.

I tried dating off on and on, so far it is just painful for all involved. Dating as a 37-year old divorced dad is... not easy. Early on I was dating to fill the hole in my soul, not a great place to date from. I suffered, and so did the few women I dated, which I regret, they were nice people who didn't deserve me. Now I try to date when I'm feeling well and whole, and don't when I'm desperate or needy. It doesn't work well, and the deperate and needy times are growing and the feeling whole times are shrinking. It's been a year and a half now since I've had a date, and much longer since any living being other than my son and and family (many states away) has told me that they love me, or need me. It's been longer since anyone but my son has so much as touched me.

Ever want to start crying when a female coworker you meet for the first time shakes your hand to say hello becuase they touched you? Yeah.

I know. Not the best place to be an attractive man from. I wouldn't date me. And that's the worst feeling of all.

I get through each day fueled by fear and determination. I work becuase I fear what would happen if I did not. Losing the positive energy I get from the office and my coworkers, losing the ability to provide for myself and my son... would be terrible. I deal with the days where I'm not 'dad' out of determination to get to the days when I am dad, becuase I will not let my son grow up without a dad.

No, I'm not suicidal. I dream of selling the house and quitting my job and just driving somewhere, or hopping the first plane out of town, becuase if life hurts so much here, it has to be better somewhere else, right? Only I can't, because my son is here and my job is here and my home is here and even if I left all that and went somewhere else I would just be running away from myself, and you don't get far from you.

At first I could blame how I feel on my divorce, on my ex wife. Now, I'm not so sure. The whole marriage, in retrospect, began becuase I don't do alone very well. So I married the wrong person becuase that was better than being by myself, and what started as an OK marriage turned into an 8 year hell becuse, as two (sucessfully married) friends who rented a room from us for a year described my ex and I: "You loved and adored her, she tolerated you."

When she couldn't tolerate me anymore, she found craigslist and start sleeping with men she found there.

Foolishly I read her journal - if you are ever in a situation like I describe don't do this, becuase you do. not. want. to know. no matter how much you, at the time, do want to know... it won't help at all, and gives 'cannot unsee" a whole new threatening meaning. It gave me another years old memory as fresh as this morning - She wrote about how the married man she was sleeping with at the time was going to be such a great dad for my son, and she wanted him to teach my son how to throw a football, and how she hoped she was pregnant with his baby. I can still feel the paper of the journal.

It's a pretty darn clear statement of what a desirable man I am. The married cheating guy from craigslist was a more attractive dad for my son that she thought I was.

What did I do after I read that? Kept on trying to "win" her back to wanting to be my wife. Pathetic. I remember begging her not to leave despite knowing she was trying to have his child, one of my lowest points as a human being. Ever have sex with a women knowing a) she despised you b) was sleeping with another man and trying to have his baby c) wanted the other guy to be your child's dad? Ever been in a place in a relationship with that woman where you desperately needed to have sex with that women, and she agreed to it? It is a soul eating experience, one that comes back when you are intimate with others.

So, I don't trust myself around other people, becuase I'm very clear I don't make good choices about other human beings. I'm pretty clear from what happened with my ex and women after my ex that I'm broken inside, becuase the only common denominator is me. I don't choose well, and as I get older and now that I'm divorced and a dad and not terribly emotionally healthy I am not chosen very much. And I don't do alone well, which leaves me in a very poor place.

I'm broken. It hurts. I don't think it's going to change, although I keep hoping that tomorrow it will.

Ask me anything, I'm full of hard earned lessons on how not to fall in love, get married, have a child, and get divorced. I'm very interested in advice from others who have gone through this. Does it get better, do you get numb, or do you just live in pain for the rest of your life?

tl;dr I'm divorced, lonely, really sad about it, and it's getting worse as time goes by.

Posted Feb 6, 2011, 6:00 PM UTC · edited

118183
seanomenon•

Have you talked to a therapist? You need to. She sounds like an awful human being who treated you horribly, and the worst part is that it seems like you have come to believe you deserved it. You didn't, and you don't deserve to suffer for it now.

Go make an appointment with a mental health professional now, for your own sake. Good luck.

85
FlensedOP•

For the first couple of years I was meeting a counselor weekly.

I stopped, becuase I need to survive on my own... part of learning to do alone better. It may be time to go back.

31
furmat60•

That's your mistake.........you don't need to survive on your own. Admitting you need help is a huge step. Maybe she just wasn't the right therapist. Find one that fits, and get the help you need. Do this for your son........he may or may not see right now what it's doing to you, but he will eventually. You may end up hurting someone you love or someone you really care about, so get help. If you need someone to talk to you can PM me.

63
wonkavision010•

I was a therapist for several years, and I agree with this. Some therapists have personalities and therapeutic styles that work better with different clients.

I have known many therapists over the years and they also have different levels of insight and abilities to help.

I would consider trying threapy again with a new counselor.

12
tasteface•

Yes. If you've gone to therapy and you feel like "this isn't what I want or need", it's not because you don't want or need therapy, it's because your therapist isn't what you want or need.

9
EdgarVerona•

I definitely think you should consider going back. Obviously the wound she made hasn't healed. You didn't deserve what she inflicted, and often it takes help from others - including professionals who've studied about and know these things - to truly realize that you didn't deserve it, and not only that but that you can rise up and defeat it.

12
publiclibraries•

Please go back. I am young and cannot give you any advice, but the part of you that I glimpsed through your story is so full of pain... Things can get better, and a therapist can help you.

6
apostrotastrophe•

I don't think teaching yourself how to do alone is working and it sounds like you've been trying that for a while.

The best thing anyone can ever do is ask for help. You should definitely go back, and the therapists can teach you how to be alone and then eventually, not alone.

6
[deleted]•

"counsellor" had better be a euphemism for "psychologist" or "psychiatrist". You need someone professionally trained in psychology, not some social worker mixing and matching the most apllicable definition from her HR manual and a proverbial pat on the back.

4
btafaii•

conventional therapy doesn't work for everyone, but there are other options. whats important is that you find a person or group of people that you are comfortable opening up to, and are comfortable having them console you. for some people the internet works fine, but others like actually seeing people.

surviving on your own isnt what you need to do, you need more than that =)

3
delicious_sandwich•

Please consider going back. You don't have to be alone "better", you just have to be better. Whatever happens, whatever you end up doing, please let us know how it goes! I know story won't slip from my mind for quite a while...

3
zomgsauce•

There are few things more admirable, and no surer sign of a person's self-sufficiency than knowing when and how to ask for help.

"Know your enemy and know yourself, find naught in fear for 100 battles. Know yourself but not your enemy, find level of loss and victory. Know thy enemy but not yourself, wallow in defeat every time"

-Sun Tsu

3
makesusstranger•

Wherever you go, there'll be therapists there. There's no coming road-warrior apocalypse, no matter what patton oswalt says

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZqrHw7YV3Q

Did they ever have you on antidepressants? IANAP but you might should be on some.

It's pretty clear to me your post is dripping with depression that's excessive regarding your circumstances and is self-reinforcing. What do you think about when you go to sleep? That's the point when memories are most easily formed. What use is your depression? Are you done blaming yourself? Are you done fixating on the past? How much do you need to worry about what the future holds?

If holding a hand makes you get all teary, that's a sign that you're not spending enough time with women. You have half your days and a six figure salary to go out and cause trouble.

There comes a point in the midst of a life-threatening depression where you have to say, fuck them, I'll never neglect myself again.

3
[deleted]•

My god thank you for posting this.

"Yeah get me right in the dirt-button Mohawk I don't care.. " = chortle

2
runT1ME•

Counselor is not necessarily a clinical psychologist. Get one with a Psychology Doctorate that has extensive experience with people in your situation. Maybe it'll take meeting three or four until you find a good one you feel comfortable with. It will be worth the effort. What do you have to lose? A few hours of your life once a week? What do you have to gain?

2
[deleted]•

Going to a therapist doesn't negate any personal strength or individuality. If anything a proper therapist will help you to harness your own feelings better so you can stabilize yourself on your own.

1
behemuthm•

I cannot upvote this enough. When my wife left me for another guy I was miserable for almost a year until I started going to therapy. After five months of that, I felt like I could finally move on. Only thing I can suggest is to have clearly defined goals. My therapist and I worked through all the issues relating to my divorce and when I felt like it was starting to get repetitive I stopped. She wanted to keep going and deal with other issues like stuff with my parents, and I decided to cut ties at that point or else I'd be in therapy for the rest of my life, like Woody Allen.

5
neilk•

You have created a circular problem for yourself. I know this one very well, because I still struggle with it. But maybe I can help point it out for you.

You have adopted your ex-wife's viewpoint as your own: that you are a weak and undesirable person.

Paradoxically, your biggest evidence is that you endured her treating you as a weak and undesirable person.

I know what you're trying to do: you're trying to confront yourself with a painful truth (even increase the intensity) in the hopes that you'll somehow shock yourself out of this pattern of behavior. This is not going to work.

1 - You have this image that you should be a solitary tower of strength, so when you go to therapy, or seek anyone's help, you think you are backsliding. You can only tolerate support if you imagine it's on a direct route to becoming a "strong" person. This is a mistake because it cuts you off from any help.

2 - You are rejecting who you are, fundamentally. Your good qualities -- like sacrifice and dedication to your kids -- doesn't count for you. You think you're so brutally honest, but what you really did is to accept your ex-wife's values as the "right" values. No wonder you cannot build up any self-esteem and feel hollow inside.

3 - I'm going to take a guess that deep down you believe that passive or doormat-like behaviour is the only way you can have love. I'm going to bet that started with in early childhood? Any similarities to your relationships with one or both parents? Consider that you may be stuck in this state because deep down you believe that if you asserted yourself you would be rejected, or you'd be a bad person, or something like that. You may secretly believe that since submitting to your wife gave her some sort of ego boost, that somehow by continuing to do it you can get her back. In your world, to deny your own strength is what gives you access to love. But since you consciously know that lack of assertiveness led to this catastrophe, you're in a dilemma.

4 - You are going to have to accept yourself if you are ever going to get anywhere. Reject your ex-wife's values. Reject any system of thought that makes you out to be a worthless person. Think about your good qualities, how you are with your kids, anything that you can be legitimately proud of. If you think you're weak, imagine how you would be if somebody threatened your kids. I expect you would go into Bruce Willis mode. Accept the mistakes you made but recast them as MISTAKES, not as expressions of fundamental flaws. If this pattern goes really far back, don't say "I am fundamentally weak", say "Someone should have taught me, as a litle kid, to be strong, but instead they (ignored the problem/made it worse). I have to do this for myself as an adult now." Instead of "people mistreat me", "I made the mistake of letting someone mistreat me for the sake of my marriage". Instead of "I didn't deserve her", "I extended a lot of trust and I was betrayed." Instead of "I am worthless as a husband", "I was a PRETTY DAMN GREAT HUSBAND and it is her loss to have ruined it."

5 - I think you might have a lot of anger in you, that you deny because it's not your way, or it's not your values, or you subconsciously fear rejection for showing it. That self-control is itself a form of strength, but it might be interesting to try accessing it in a controlled way as well. Some martial arts might be great for you -- Krav Maga, or kickboxing, or any of the more aggressive styles. All it takes is discipline and you seem to have that already. Maybe you will look at yourself differently if you are not physically afraid of people, and confident in your ability to confront others physically when it counts.

45
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
superfusion1•

Reject any system of thought that makes you out to be a worthless person

That is Golden. Your words have made a change in my thinking. Thank you.

1
Teknodruid•

Go to a support group for divorced single parents... meet people who are struggling like you, have struggled and gotten past it, or are worse off than you are.

People some times need others who can relate to exactly what they are struggling with to help them heal.

Plus... perhaps the actual Ms. Right is in this group waiting to see you there? Maybe after you get over the hurdle you'll run into your perfect woman?

Your ex, like many women, sounds like a stone cold bitch who didn't deserve someone who would treat her well. She is dating a married man? So she ruined your marriage... and she is trying to ruin another mans marriage... women like that are poisonous to be around - be glad you got rid of her.

29
FlensedOP•

I went to a group weekly for the first ouple of years, it helped me through some really dark times.

I left becuase I realized at one point that the group was more focused on dealing with "newbies" who were really open sores of pain and anguish, and I had gotten to a point where I was... less raw. I needed to expose myself to less raw pain. Not the groups fault, I was a raw person and they got me through a terrible place.

The first rule of the group, and a good one: "This is not the place to meet your next victim"

There is scary math behind it. ~50% of all marriages fail. If you divorce and remarry in the first year after, ~90% fail. If you wait until at least 5 years after the divorce finalizes (which is normally a year or two after you seperate) you get the second marriage failure rate back down to close, but still higher, then the first marriage failure rate.

Why? Becuase to have the best chance of a sucessful relationship, you need to be reasonably healthy. And you are most definately not when you in a divorce support group. There were 5 - 6 time losers there, whch tells you something.

Oddly enough, this makes me sadder when I think about it. Why? Becuase I know I'm not healthy, and I don't think I'm getting healthy. I do not ever want to go through what I did again, so I avoid others in intimate, emotional settings (yes, I own my loneliness even while I bemoan it). It's a circular path to a bad place: Avoid others until healthy, avoiding others creates less health, repeat.

Wow. I just read what I wrote. That sucks.

14
kirbyderwood•

You are correct in that you're not healthy. Then again, most of us have stuff to work on. Many (like your ex) don't even see how messed up they are. But at least you realize it and you can see the circular path you're treading.

So get angry at that circular path, get off of it and move in a different direction. Change one thing tomorrow morning that points you in a healthy direction, then change another and keep going. Yes, it takes work, but doing the work sure beats feeling like crap. Perhaps a good therapist is the first step, perhaps a support group, spiritual counseling, meditation. Get antidepressants if you need them, or get yourself to the gym an start making your own serotonin. Pick something to do tomorrow and start doing the work, everything else will fall into place.

I had a very similar divorce (discovered my wife was cheating by reading her journal) along with similar bouts of depression and grief. Just know it does get better. I used to think the day my marriage collapsed as the worst day of my life. These days I look upon it as one of the best things that ever happened to me. You will too if you do the work it takes to heal.

4
quasarj•

I feel for you. I have never been, and never will be healthy. At least, emotionally. I hope to maybe one day be physically healthy, but I think my extreme wait and loser-ness both stem from my emotional damage.

I actually never got married, but I had a family for 9 years before seperating, and I was certainly not healthy when that started. Bad childhood, scarred for life, all of that fun stuff. It makes me wonder though, is happiness someone like me can ever achieve? So many say that you must find happiness alone before you can think about it with other people, but being alone doesn't make me happy.

Of course, I kinda take it to an extreme, and I don't really see anyone much anymore. A friend at work, a few co workers, my brothers that live with me (on and off), and I spend a fair bit of time with pixel friends (online friends i have never met IRL). That depresses me a lot too.

Anyway, I guess I have nothing to add, haha, but I'm reading through the comments from your post today and.. felt like writing. Good luck with your situation! I do not know the answer, but if you find it, please forward it on! :)

1
hammertime1070•

Awh cute, it's a Pity Me Elmo in its natural habitat. You, the product of a thousand generations of men who built empires with their bare hands and hunted animals much larger than themselves with crude spears. Boo bloody hoo. I'm not a doctor, but I am prescribing you 500mgs of cowboy the fuck up. Tonight you're going to put on a shirt that doesn't say "twenty-three year old virgin", you're going to look up one interesting thing on Wikipedia, and then you're going to tell that interesting thing to no less than three women. Doesn't even fucking matter if you want to shag them or not, you're going to tell them that interesting thing and then you're going to see how long you can hold a conversation with them. If you're rejected, you look that bird dead in the eye and you say "my ancestors ate mutton with their fists", then you walk away and try it on a new one. Don't sulk away, that's expected. That's probably typical of you. You're going to stride away like this happy son of a bitch and you're going to do it with a manly beer in your hand. Ooze testosterone on the ground and proudly declare yourself a studmuffin, because if you fuck this up then I'm going to half-assedly follow you around from comment to comment posting a crude drawing of you in a tutu having your little sissy legs broken by a monster made of dicks.

29
FlensedOP•

Heh.

Thanks.

I do want to see a drawing of me in a tutu having my legs broken by a dick monster. I'll post it on my mirror so when I'm getting up in the morning I remember.

Cowboying up is easy. Sustaining it is hard. Cowboyed up is difficult when doing laundry and folding underwear, for example.

12
superfusion1•

That advice he give you is from Fight Club starring Brad Pitt as Tyler Durden. If you haven't seen it, watch it. If you've already seen it, watch it again, it has more meaning every time you watch it. It's entertaining and it will teach you some lessons that you need to learn right now. And remember, the first rule of Fight club is that you don't talk about Fight Club. Good luck to you.

10
cweave•

I gotta be frank. I was in the same situation, but much younger in life. 2 things will help: time or cowboying the fuck up.

In fact they can work together. Time + cowboying up = looking at this situation in your review mirror. If you are done with the therapy/counseling this is the only way.

PS - Completely understand being done with counseling...

3
quasarj•

Some parts of this seem like pretty good advice. I would just warn to be careful about being a douche. Sure our ancestors were some pretty manly men, but I'd rather die of hopeless depression than turn into a douche.

Also, your comment totally made me think of Mr. Prosser: A direct male-line descendent of Genghis Khan, though intervening generations and racial mixing had so jobbled his genes that he had no discernible Mongoloid characteristics, and the only vestiges left in in his mighty ancestry were a pronounced stoutness about the tum and a predilection for little fur hats.

Also, he liked axes.

1
EdgarVerona•

I'm so sorry to hear that. I hope that you will mend from this in time... it's going to be a hard path, but I hope that you're able to walk it and come out on the other side grateful and happier for having stuck with the road to recovery.

Do you have friends close by that can help to provide you emotional support?

EDIT: Also, don't read into her journal as being a realistic criticism of you. She obviously was wandering, and in doing so she's going to inflate her new target of affection as much as she can in her own mind, and deflate you as much as she can. It is NOT you, it is her trying to justify her actions to herself. People try to justify things that they know are wrong by pretending that the situation they were in is terrible, or that they were the victim, or that this new situation will make them so much happier... but it's not real. It's them trying to find a way to explain to themselves that they are still the "good guy".

Do you see what I mean? I hope that this helps. =(

14
FlensedOP•

I do, if I call them. The thing that scares me is I don't. They are also a scarred or distracted bunch at the moment: One family is divorcing now, and bellyaching about how I'm feeling seems odd in a house where the dad is moving out, the boyfriend is moving in, and their boy is runnign around. My best friend is older, single-er, and not happy about it either but won't admit how depressed he is (I see it becuase I feel the echoes in myself). Other close friends just had their second baby two days ago, and are a) justifiably occupied and b) it seems wrong to ask for help talking about my messed up life while they are adding to their pretty good life.

I know, excuses.

I'm not always this down, just when I'm alone. That's why I yearn to be at work or to be dad, gives me the meaning in life to be ok. It also scares me, bucause if something happened to my work or my son I'd be a flipping disaster case right when I would need to not be one the most.

6
SpenceMasta•

you got two friends who sound exactly like they need your company, the friend whos divorcing with whom he can relate to, and the single unhappy friend who you can be single with

6
EdgarVerona•

Yes, listen to Spence. He is right.

3
WaterMist•

Gosh you're in a terrible environment...

I know you feel you cannot get away from where you are, but you NEED to. Your son's spring break should be coming soon, take time off work and just GO SOMEWHERE FAR FAR AWAY. Take your son with you. Go to Europe. Go to Asia. Experience some culture shock. TRAVEL.

There is nothing more hurtful for a child than seeing their parent in pain. I cried from just reading your story- imagine how your son feels? Children are very acute. I could read my mum from a very very young age. I could tell when the smile didn't reach her soul. I could see the distant look she gets in her eyes. And WORST OF ALL, I COULD TELL when she was TRYING SO HARD FOR ME. When she FORCED HERSELF to be cheerful, FOR ME. I realized it from a VERY young age. And it HURTS SO MUCH! It hurts SO MUCH to see how hard a parent struggles for you.

Do it for the sake of your son. He needs you. If you cannot find your way out of this, your son will find it very hard to have a good relationship of his own in the future. Your son will learn to feel distrust towards relationships.

But you cannot fake it. You cannot just 'bear' it.

You need to do WHATEVER YOU CAN to get out of it. Try EVERYTHING you've never tried before- EVERYTHING! Until you can smile and genuinely love yourself. Until you accept that that period of your life is over. That you can change your situation. You can change your mind.

You can do it.

5
EdgarVerona•

I understand, and I'm very sorry that you're going through all of this. That is a sucky, sucky situation. Please take what I said about not listening to her criticism to heart, and listen to Teknodruid as well: a support group might be extremely helpful in this situation.

Also, don't be afraid to hang out with your friends, and contact them just to hang out with them: even if you don't feel comfortable yet really talking with them about the issue for the reasons you've stated, even being with these people who care about you will be extremely helpful.

1
JohnnyDread•

Let's start here:

When she couldn't tolerate me anymore, she found craigslist and start sleeping with men she found there.

Your ex-wife is a selfish piece of shit. Regardless of your faults, she doesn't deserve any feeling you may still have for her. At all.

12
leetdood•

Yeah, your wife was a cheating ho. Relationships end without cheating all the time, she made that choice and did horrible things to you.

Cheating ho.

3
jda06•

Go buy a golden retriever. It won't let you be lonely and it will give you lots of things to do. You'll need to walk it, feed it, train it, play with it. And your son will love it very much.

Having something alive in your house that loves you sounds pretty obviously like something that would be helpful. Won't fix everything but seems like a no brainer step one.

11
sonynp•

completely agree. a dog can liven up a house like few other things can.

6
japaneseknotweed•

Here's something to think about: sometimes, when we've been sad long enough, we get stuck being sad. Our brain keeps making sad chemicals even thought the original event/cause is long gone.

Honestly, it might be time for meds. NOT because you can't cowboy up on your own - you still have to do that - but because this stuckness is something physical that you simply cannot change by will.

Please think about trying meds.

That said: here is why we women cheat. And it's not about you.

When we're young, we gush about wanting to sleep with "someone who truly knows me."

When we get older? We sometimes wish we could sleep with someone who doesn't know us well -- who hasn't seen us screw up -- who doesn't know our weaknesses.

We want to present our best image, put our best foot forward -- get all dressed up, wear the push-up bra, say the confident, witty things, talk about the sparkly plans -- and be with someone new enough to buy this image, accept it as the whole story.

YOU know the whole story. You've seen your wife when she's down, or vulnerable, or when she's blown it. You were understanding and empathic and forgiving. And secretly? She hates you for what you've seen, for what you know.

Sleeping with a newcomer is about getting to feel powerful again, feeling in control, feeling like we can craft an image of ourselves and have that image be the reality -- after all, what is more real than sex?

She had to be her true self with you. She wanted to be her best-version of herself, her idealized image. She couldn't do that with you, since you knew too much.

The more you forgave, the more you begged? The more you were accepting her as she was -- which she couldn't handle.

She didn't have to choose between you and him.

She had to choose between the REAL her and the "best" her.

She chose the "best" her, the sparkly image that she wants to be real, but deep down knows that she can't keep up forever. The version that you can't buy because you know the truth - that she's human and fallible. She wanted a chance to start "fresh".

Now go hit the gym, and good luck!

11
poopmachine•

Wow. Since someone else hasn't said it, I suppose I will.

Fuck all you cunts.

This is why I honestly hate most women. You'll use such bullshit to rationalize horrible behavior. All this blah blah crap about best version of herself, who the fuck cares. She's a liar with no integrity. When you make a commitment you stick to it. It's that simple. When you're dealing with another person you make sure you're fair to them, even if it means coming clean and taking a hit yourself. That's normal decent behavior and you have to make sure you act that way in all your relationships.

When a man cheats, any guy will call it what it is.. "he's an asshole". When a woman cheats you get shit like this.. "oh she just wanted to be the best version of herself". You need to get your head right, women don't cheat because they're looking for self-actualization. They cheat because they're cowardly cunts who want to have their cake and eat it too.

-3
japaneseknotweed•

Um, you do realize that we agree, right?

A rationalization is a way of explaining or justifying something to oneself. It can be valid, truthful, noble, inspiring... or a steaming pile of horse crap.

And actually, most women DON't rationalize cheating to themselves this way. Their need to be seen as their "best" (notice the quotes?) self is what drives them -- they can't stand to remain with the person who knows their flaws, they want to be with someone who can be fooled into accepting the "window dressing" version. That need is the true driving cause.

They way they rationalize it? "He's boring."

And BTW? We women who don't cheat really hate the ones who do.

6
morecleverer•

You are a very articulate, intelligent man, who is also very self aware and very very sad right now. You know exactly what's going on:

"Im broken. It hurts. I don't think it's going to change, although I keep hoping that tomorrow it will."

Thats exactly what you need to do. Keep hoping that it will change. It will change if you stay honest with yourself and work at it. Obtaining your MBA was a process, and so is this. There just isn't a syllabus for the program you are now enrolled in. Its self-study. If you work hard to get through it, you will graduate.

10
apreotea•

Incredibly well-said, the last paragraph alone is golden.

I won't speculate on your gender, but you are yourself quite an articulate human being.

3
[deleted]•

You're loaded and 37 isn't that old. Do you really want to live 40 more years lonely and dwelling on that cunt who fucked you over?

Because that is what is going to happen unless you snap out of this!!

It's obvious what your problem is: no female companionship. You can find somebody. There are plenty of nice single moms out there who are creaming their jeans at the thought of a guy like you, who has proven he can provide for a family but lost it through no fault of his own. You could get a Brady Bunch thing going.

Fix up your appearance and start dating. You don't need to have any expectations. In fact it's OK to hope that it doesn't go anywhere. Just find a woman you think is attractive and invite her to dinner. If she says no, go find another woman.

Just do it. Stop thinking about it and just do it. Go on OKCupid right now and send an email to any woman who even looks halfway attractive. Just say 1 nice thing about her and ask her out.

9
syd1977•

The OKCupid advice is good advice. I'm divorced and am in love with a divorced man with one child. We just moved in together and are very happy. We met on OKC. www.okcupid.com

Good luck.

3
_Dimension•

I know exactly how you feel. Ever since I got divorced I feel the same way.

I don't have any useful advice, but I just wanted to let you know there are others who understand how you feel.

8
FlensedOP•

I am very sorry. You and I have membership in the one club nobody ever wants to join.

7
[deleted]•

[deleted]

8
FlensedOP•

I made the deliberate decision not to.

As it was all unfolding I was gripped with the most horrible fear my son was not my son. I struggled with what to do, and if I should get him tested to see if he was mine.

I found my way out of that place be deciding I would not care. I have a bright, articulate boy who looks at me with love in his eyes and the word 'Dad' on his lips. That's what matters, and what would I do if I discovered he wasn't mine? Kick him to the curb and teach him a dad is a person who leaves and love is something a scientific test can destroy? No.

Family is a deliberate act; I choose my son - it isn't a byproduct of genetics. Everything else is just little stuff.

27
adelaarvaren•

You have already "won" at life by making this decision. This shows that you have a soul.

Time will heal the pain. But I have no doubt that anyone who has made a choice like this will honored, loved, and respected for who he is. It may take a little bit for the right person to enter your life, but it will happen.

10
straightcrooked•

That's a good thing to stand for. Now you just need to build on that. Realize that there are other things in life that can bring you happiness and stand for those things too. Pretty soon you'll realize how strong you are even in your "broken" state. Shit sucks, but it could be worse. Do the best you can with what you have. That's all you can do and it sounds like you are doing very well. Keep it up

3
puddinhead•

Guy, first, I can get that you feel unlovable, but you need to be as objective as you can be about this (what would you tell your son). One person rejected you and treated you horribly. Just consider that it might not be due to your value but due to her issues. Just because one partner is a ho-bag doesn't mean the other one necessarily deserves it. I know that you know this in your head, but you have to start applying it to your life. Know why? I'll tell you! (lucky you!)

Right now you're pretty much existing for your son. He's the reason you drag yourself through the day. But another thing you have to think about is that you can't just exist for him. You also need to set a good role model for him. He learns much of "how to be a man" by what he sees in you. You used to not be this defeated person that you are now and you can leave that person behind.

You made a bad choice in her. You don't make bad choices about everyone. You were horribly wounded and you have a right to stay wounded and to keep reopening that wound. But you know it's not the best thing for you nor the best thing for your son.

A few years ago something horrible happened in my life and I went into a very dark place. Eventually I had to talk to my family doctor about it. He said I was severely clinically depressed, "I can see it on you as obvious as you can spot someone with a cold," he said. Clinical depression is a real chemical imbalance that happens in your brain. The serotonin levels need to be balanced and until they are, you see things through a black cloud. I was on an anti-depressant for 6 months and then, the clouds cleared away and I was me again. (I also did take positive steps to improve my life: exercise, be more social).

Trust yourself with other people in small ways. Your lessons with your exwife will help you to evaluate people better. And most of all, please see your doc to see if it's possible you're in clinical depression.

(And by the way? I'll bet you $10 that Mr. Married Guy from Craigslist doesn't last either)

6
FlensedOP•

Thanks. I hear you. Its good advice.

Did the anitdepressent route until I wan't clinical anymore. Did therapy until it was time not to.

I guess it may be time to check again. It does come back.

Oh? Other guy? Didn't last as long as the divorce process did.

6
puddinhead•

Ack! See? See what you did there? You blame yourself and see yourself as being some kind of cause, when he didn't even last as long as you did. (Hmm, that makes you how much more worthy than Mr. Jaguar?)

She is a self-centered, well, I call them "emotional vampire." I got very suckered by one of them in my lifetime too. I used to think I was such a good judge of character too. Honestly, I think about him (my emotional vampire) at least once a week and it's been 10 years now. But I see it as a him issue and not a me issue. Be objective when you look at your ex and objective when you look at yourself. Who is leaving a path of burned bridges in their wake? (I have the barest knowledge of things, but I know it's not you. You should know that too)

2
EdgarVerona•

YES! Please Flensed, listen to puddinhead. Do not let the things this lady said and wrote hurt you! She's out to blame the whole world for her bullshit nonsense and irresponsibility, and because you're a good guy who got too close you've been willing to take the brunt of it. Don't take it any more, push it aside. Defeat her and her willingness to throw the blame for her own selfish and irresponsible actions on you.

3
WRad•

I'm sorry to hear that, man. I recently went through something similar, so I know where you're coming from. Reading the written words of an adulteress is an incredibly hurtful thing and tough to forget. Getting the thoughts out here is a good start. What will really help the most is getting professional therapy - and I'm dead serious about that. You have the resources to do so, give it a shot.
Good vibes your way, bro.

5
klenow•

You put too much stock in the opinion of an obviously deficient person.

You're the "cruise director" and therefore the weakest link? Dude, as a guy in a group like that you are the ONLY link.

I can only imagine the pain of going through what you're going through; I'm your age, married with 2 kids....holy crap. I don't even want to think about it. That's got to rip your soul out.

But any person who would do what she did, for any reason whatsoever, is not a person whose judgements you should respect or even listen to. Even if you are the most pathetic excuse for a man that ever lived, going behind your back like that is cowardly and beneath contempt. Especially with a kid in the picture.

4
FunnyUsernameHere•

I am so scared that I will be writing this exact same post in a buncha years. One of my biggest fears in life.

4
FlensedOP•

Really? If you are really worried about it take action now, instead of later.

If you are not in a relationship but afraid it will work out like this, talk to somebody now about how to pick a relationship. I certainly wish I had found wise counsel while I was single instead of after.

If you are in a relationship but really are afraid, get help now, don't wait.

Sick fact: I knew this was happening for years, at least in retrospect I knew we were in trouble before we had my son. I would not let myself know it, if that makes any sense.

I was astonish I blurted out the question "Are you sleeping with somebody else?" but it came from somewhere inside of me. I knew, or suspected, and I wouldn't admit it to myself because that would make it real.

So if you are in a relationship, talk to your partner, talk to somebody else. Do both.

6
MexicanRedditor•

If you're sad and lonely, that means she is winning. Don't let your skanky ex-wife win this. There's a lot of great women out there that can make you happy. Where's that picture of a wolf that says "She dumped you... In to a sea of cock hungry women"?

4
freemonicaconyers•

Stop dwelling on the bad and think about the good. You have all the pieces to ejoy your life.

Also, can you tell us some more things she said in her journal?

3
FlensedOP•

To be honest, those are the big ones I remember. There was other stuff, but it pales in comparison to "he's a better dad" and "I want to have his baby"

There was stuff about how many years she's been dreaming of going outside the marriage (lots), how she felt bad about what it was doing to me (apparently not bad enough to make different choices), and suprisingly little about what her choices were going to do to our son (other than "other guy will be an awesome dad").

Other guy was a ~45 year old married guy, with three kids. This was his second affair that he admitted to, apparently my ex figured she was special enough he would leave his wife this time. She did spend a lot of words excited by the fact other guy drove a Jaguar.

The other guy's wife found out, ended up calling me. We met once for coffee to try and figure out what our spouses were doing, as both were, for a while, not seeing the other person and trying to make the marriages work, for very specific and dishonest values of "not seeing" and "trying to make the marriages work"

It was a really messed up cup of coffee. Essentially we both compared stories, detected the various lies her husband and my wife were telling, agreed to call the other if new evidence came to light that they were again seeing each other, justifying to the other how now our spouses were going to live up to their promises of "making it work" with us, and apologizing to each other for the actions and pain our spouses were causing the other. We compared notes on how crappy we felt. At one point she said "I should sleep with you to get even with my husband". I left at that point.

That's another lesson I learned: Don't meet the other person's spouse.

6
YOUDONTEVENKNOWME•

That must have been the strangest meeting of your life.

6
FlensedOP•

It definately tops the list.

Here's a gem of wisdom I learned: When you spouse is cheating it has nothing at all to do with the person they are cheating with. It has everything to do with your spouse, and you. Once wife makes the choice to cheat, it is a statistics game who they end up with... just open up craigslist casual enounter MfW and see the hundreds and hundres of "lonely? look at my big cock shot!" ads every day... when she decides it's time it's a roll of the dice.

The issue is her choice, not the other person. The more you learn about the other person, or their family, the worse it is for you.

3
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
ericthecro•

you should've banged her

2
[deleted]•

Other guy was a ~45 year old married guy, with three kids. This was his second affair that he admitted to, apparently my ex figured she was special enough he would leave his wife this time. She did spend a lot of words excited by the fact other guy drove a Jaguar.

Fuck her. Fuck that goddamned cunt. You know, it's so easy to become misogynistic hearing things like that. This is why every day I lose my faith a little more in womanhood and trust people less and less.

I only wish the best for you. Just know that you're never really alone in this world. And even though there's a lot of ugliness and horror, there's a lot of beautiful things, too. I hope you find those beautiful things.

3
piggless•

Sounds like you're already misogynistic. Maybe that's why you read that paragraph as an indictment of the entire gender rather then one person who happens to be an asshole... like yourself, but not all men. :)

-1
addictedtosugar•

Sounds like you don't practice what you preach. Maybe that's why you read his one comment as an indictment of his entire character rather then one particular thought that happens to be wrong... like yourself, but not all women. :)

*edit

1
Versailles•

Have you come to realize that she made terrible decisions and treated your marriage and you poorly?

Are you considering seeing a therapist/counselor to help you "work through" this depressive period of your life and help you develop tools for better relationships?

I wish you an excellent future, and congratulate you on choosing to make the best of things for your child.

3
[deleted]•

Volunteer somewhere. Life is short. Make it count.

3