Source
r/peloton•
nalc

Anyone want to map a virtual combined GT with me?

I think it would be cool to come up with a route that combines all 3 grand tours, to be raced in September 2020.

Here is my idea so far:

  • Stage 1 (Friday): from Reggio Calabria to Catanzaro, possibly lumpy through the Serra San Bruno mountain range. No real GC development, but opens up a couple gaps and lets a puncheur get in the yellow-pink-red jersey for a couple days. Transfer up the coast.

  • Stage 2 goes along the coast, ending in Salerno. Bunch sprint

  • Stage 3 into Naples after some lumps through Amalfi, reduced bunch sprint

  • First rest day (Monday), transfer from Naples to Florence

  • Stage 4, Florence to Modena

  • Stage 5: Verano to Trento.

  • Stage 6-8: Hit the usual Giro climbs in the Alps, three big mountain days

  • Stage 9 - ITT around Milan / Lake Como

  • Second rest day, transfer from Milan to Basel

  • Stage 10: Basel to Epinal with Planche des Belles Filles

  • Strage 11: Nancy to Verdun, through Parc de Lorraine

  • Stage 12: Sedan to Maubeuge, through the Ardennes

  • Stage 13: Roubaix to Arras and do a bunch of the Paris Roubaix cobbles, in the opposite direction

  • Stage 14: Arras to Compiegne

  • Stage 15: Paris, Champs-de-Elysses, bunch sprint

  • Third rest day, transfer from Paris to Toulouse

  • Stage 16-18: Pyrennes climbs, three big mountain days, ending in Barcelona

  • Stage 19-20: Lumpy transfer stages from Barcelona towards Madrid

  • Stage 21: Madrid sprint

If anyone is better with geography than me, please make some suggestions.

Posted Mar 24, 2020, 3:06 PM UTC

2519
fewfiet:ZubeldiaRFL::CCC:CCC•

I doubt he was the first one to suggest this but Matteo Trentin would support this project!

Why not organize only one GT this year? Start in Rome , passing through Madrid , finish in Paris. All the best on the start and a great way to reunite all the people with a bike race after this horrible time! #3GTn1

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

I decided to spend a bit of time fleshing out my idea from last week

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fewfiet:ZubeldiaRFL::CCC:CCC•

It's a great idea and a fun exercise, coming up with some of the stages!

3
JonNelsonPhotography:JumboVisma: Jumbo – Visma•

I am very game for a pro cyclist version of a transcontinental bike race essentially, drop them off, winner gets there first, but allow drafting and encourage raiding of convenience stores.

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fewfiet:ZubeldiaRFL::CCC:CCC•

Ok, so I've tried to create 7 stages for the Italian week. I'll work on the French week tomorrow!

  1. Alberobello to Castrovillari, 224km, profile. This is the reverse of Stage 7 of the 2017 Giro. It would pass from Alberobello, near Taranto, and finish on a slight rise into a downhill. It could potentially be altered to pass closer to Matera, but perhaps that should be saved for another time. There would be a one hour transfer between the finish and the start of Stage 2. An alternative that would eliminate beautiful Alberobello, but pass through more population centers is reverse this year's Stage 8, from Brindisi through Taranto, with the same finish. And another alternative could be reverse Stage 8 from 1998, Lecce to Matera.

  2. Sassano to Montecassino, 247km, profile. This is the same as Stage 6 of the 2014 Giro, which Michael Matthews won in a sprint from a select group. There would be a one hour transfer between the finish and the start of Stage 3.

  3. Fiuggi to Grosseto, 264km, profile. This is the reverse of Stage 7 of the 2015 Giro. The first guaranteed bunch sprint finish. An alternative could be the reverse of Stage 4 from the 2019 Giro, heading from Frascati to Orbetello and duplicating the finish of Stage 3 of that year. Both of these options would pass near Rome. There is about an hour transfer to the start of Stage 4.

  4. Montalcino to Carrara, 222km, profile. This stage is the reverse of Stage 7 of the 2010 Giro and would cover some of the same roads of Strade Bianche before heading further north and finishing in a bunch sprint. [Likely followed by a rest/transfer day]

  5. Lovere to Ponte di Legno, 194km, profile. This is the same as Stage 16 in the 2019 Giro (as raced, not as originally planned). It would hit some of the famous climbs while not being quite as strenuous as originally planned, and given this is the first week of a GT that's probably ok. There is about a 1.5hr transfer to the start of Stage 6.

  6. Morbegno to San Pellegrino Terme, 151km, profile. This stage is the same as Stage 18 in the 2011 Giro, and passes along the shore of Lake Como before passing through Bergamo, climbing the Passo di Ganda, and finishing at the Sanpellegrino baths. There is a transfer of just over an hour to the start of Stage 7.

  7. Abbiategrasso to Pratonevoso, 196km, profile. This is a simple climbing stage following stage 18 of the 2018 Giro and after departing from Milan leaves the riders near to the French border.

I think seven stages like this would show off some of the cultural and historical places in Italy while also providing the opportunity for a variety of action and fans to see the riders in major urban centers. It would also hit some of the classic climbs and some of the roads that the one day races like Strade Bianche and Il Lombardia frequent. Sadly some of the stages are quite long, and the transfers are always about an hour, but that's going to happen if we're trying to cram three GTs into three weeks.

What do you think? Anyone else want to take over for France and/or Spain?

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

You are a genius!

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fewfiet:ZubeldiaRFL::CCC:CCC•

Here's a map of the route! So it does seems to follow a clear path across a lot of the country. :)

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Vinkol23•

I think a fair format would be:
7 Stages in Spain
Rest day
7 Stages in Italy
Rest day
7 Stages in France

 

Still 21 stages and 2 rest days like a normal GT
You can swap around Spain and Italy but for me if it doesnt end on the Champs-de-Elysses whats even the point?

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

Well, the general format I had in mind was to not make the transfers any worse than a regular GT. As much as ending on Champs is an iconic Tour moment, it's not really conducive to do France last when it's between Spain and Italy. There's no way you could get the teams from Spain to Italy or vice versa without a double rest day or something like that - it's a 10-12 hour drive even from Catalunya to Piedmont. You've got to do France in the middle.

The rough outline I came up works as a kind of greatest hits album that has key elements and iconic parts from all three grand tours, but is still organized as something that could be done on a grand tour schedule - start on a Friday (3 rest days) or Saturday (2 rest days), with ~1 hour transfers from the end of one stage to the start of the next, perhaps ~4 hour transfers on rest days. That schedule doesn't permit a transfer between Spain and Italy unless you have 2-3 stages across southern France in between, and then you end up with just a TdF that spends a bit more time technically over the border in the Pyrennes and the Alps ( since there's no way you could get deep into Spain or Italy in the third week and then make it back to Paris for stage 21). I just don't see how there's any logistical way to cover appreciable amounts of all 3 GTs and still end up in Paris unless you do insane transfers or multiple consecutive rest days that mess up the routine of a GT.

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Mattho:Slovakia:Slovakia•

I think first three stages should be flat and start in Hungary.

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

As long as the last stage is a sprint through a cardboard replica Arc de Triomphe, in Yorkshire

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

Now that I am looking more, I think the Roubaix - Arras stage is a bridge.too far..I think on this limited schedule, getting up into northeastern France just isn't viable and it's just the spring classics fan in me that's suggesting it. Keeping it in the southern half of France makes the most sense. I'm also thinking that maybe Basque country makes the most sense for the Spanish part, after doing some mountains in the Pyrennes.

I also had the idea for stage 13 (a Friday) doing an TTT in Paris on the Champs. Having a Champs sprint that isn't the last stage of the TdF does kinda cheapen it. A flat TTT could be kind of a neat spectacle and a nice twist on it.

5
fewfiet:ZubeldiaRFL::CCC:CCC•

Stage 1 could duplicate stage 4 of the 2016 Giro (departing Catanzaro, but moving further north) (profile)

I'm sure there are other stages that might match up with your proposals! I tried to look for stages arriving in Salerno but got back to the 1995 stage and it starts further south than the 2016 stage from Catanzaro would end..

2
stealthisnick•

It would be impossible, I guess, to organize whole new stages. On the other hand, what about picking 7 stages from each of the 2020 GTs and create a combined GT.

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nalcOP:MitcheltonScott: Mitchelton – Scott•

I think you could probably 'borrow' a lot of stages from past years of the grand tours as well as one week stage races like Tirreno Adriatico, Paris-Nice, etc. I liked the idea of starting in Italy, doing the Alps for stages 8-9 (the big weekend stages before the first rest day - which, in retrospect, would be a bad spot for the ITT I had in the original post), then doing eastern France for the next weekend stages 14-15 with a Champs-Elysse sprint on Sunday, then doing the Pyrennes and Spain on the last week.

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90andtQuick-Step Floors•

Digitise the route in Google earth, share them as KML and I'd be happy to host them in a web map.

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the_gnarts:ArkeaSamsic: Arkea - Samsic•

Stage 10: Basel to Epinal with Planche des Belles Filles

The Planche is a dead-end though, the loop on top notwithstanding. In order to continue toward Epinal, they’d have to split the already narrow road into two directions but the downhill would be carnage even without that.

OTOH with the savings from two GTs that don’t have to be organized they could perhaps pay for the construction of another tarmacked switchback road on the other side of the hill to turn the Planche into a proper col.

1
NBAFO•

Maybe some food for thought: here's my 2020 Grand Tour with the additional constraint of zero transfers allowed. Each stage essentially begins at the location where the previous one finished #socialdistancing https://2020grandtour.wordpress.com/

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Vinkol23•

You could call it:
Le Tour de Vuelta a Giro d'Europa

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