Watts - Guendouzi out, Partey to Arsenal? Arteta facing key summer transfer decision.
Posted Jun 26, 2020, 1:07 PM UTC
96122
Selling Guendouzi to raise funds for Partey would be excellent business and the type of stuff Arsenal should have been doing years ago.
108
The Iwobi sale was on these lines too. They raised a decent amount of money to fund the purchase of Pepe. Iwobi was one of our own but Pepe once settled is a massive upgrade on him
53
Pepe once settled is a massive upgrade on him
That's the theory, but is he 40m better? Arsenal could have used those 40m on a replacement for Koscielny instead.
-3
How long before he 'settles' in. He is not a 19 year prospect. He is 24-25 and at the prime of his age. This sub treats him with kid gloves.
Pulisic came the same time and is already miles more consistent than him. And is younger by 3-4 years.
-21
I think it's fair to give him one season. Particularly given we changed managers 3 times this one.
If he's not performing at a decent level by Christmas, I won't object to some eyebrows being raised. But come on. It's a little early to be coming down that hard on him.
46
Also considering we're not playing as a team yet. Whenever Pepe scores he has to work hard for a moment of magic. We need a stronger midfield to be more efficient and and supplement him in attack.
20
Plus he has 15 G+A across all competitions. Not amazing but a decent contribution for his first season considering the chaos.
I do agree I'd like to have him settle more as part of the team, he seems like he's playing on his own sometimes.
7
That’s a good point you’ve raised, but to the contrary, he’s seemingly had issues with 3 different managers now and he’s the clubs record signing.
-4
We’ve had one interrupted season with a shitshow of a last manager and a new one who’s been handed a ridiculous team sheet, COVID, and essentially no time to really prepare.
1
essentially no time to really prepare.
There you will find yourself wrong. 'no time to prepare' lmao.
-3
Pulisic has tons of international and UCL experience. Pepe had two good years in France....
1
Then why the fck did we spend 72 million on him and Chelsea got a better player for nearly 20 million less.
2
No one is treating him with kid gloves. Dude has had 3 managers, trying to get used to a much tougher league and living in a different country. Most players take a year to get settled. He has never looked untalented on the pitch, just needs to get used to the team, league, manager, etc
0
Most players take a year to get settled.
9 times out of 10, that player ends up getting released, sold, or loaned out.
The ones that stay the distance end up wallowing away on the bench, dipping their toes in the reserves, and coming away with nothing.
1
IMO this is one thing that this management has got it right. We are starting sell well. Its not just players like Iwobi and Guendouzi, fringe players are being sold well as well. We got 8 million for Bielk and even Koscielny was sold for 5 million.
Selling young player with potential and buying bona fide quality player seems like Raul's go to transfer policy to build a team. This suits us well because if there is one thing I know arsenal is good at, it is to find cheap young players. Even before Raul came we used to find signings like Holding from the most unlikeliest of the places. We never used to leverage this to our advantage by developing and selling them well. But now we are doing this more often. Signings like Guendouzi(8 million), Mavrapanos (2.10 million), martinelli (6.7 million) all fits right into this model really well. Combined with the fact that we have an excellent academy we really have a good source of young players to sell to build our team
10
We are starting sell well
Ramsey, one of the top players at the club, was allowed to leave for free.
there is one thing I know arsenal is good at, it is to find cheap young players.
That used to be true. These days not so much:
- Semi Ajayi
- Yaya Sanogo
- Crystian Bielik
- Takuma Asano
- Rob Holding
- Cohen Bramall
- Konstantinos Mavropanos
Those are the players who were under 23 and under 5m when they joined from the last 7 years or so. Holding and Martinelli are the only two who seem to have worked out, but Martinelli was over 5m. That's not a great record for cheap young players.
1
Everyone's really excited about Partey but I really wonder what happens to Torreira if he arrives. We were really hyped about Torreira when he arrived but now everyone's clamoring for Partey with no mention of Lucas.
1
Would much rather sell guendo than torreira, like many speculated on this sub, to raise funds for partey
We aren’t used to making good sales here often lol
78
Yeah lol it's something we've never seen. Except for Ox and Iwobi which were decent sales.
30
Both are valuable, and I think have something left to offer the club. You ask me a couple months ago, I would have been adamant to not sell either of them. That being said, if Guendo isn't fitting into what Arteta wants to build and the right offer comes in for him, ship him off.
I think Torreira could fit into want Arteta wants to do, and at the very least he is a hard worker and seems to take instruction well. Doesn't make much sense to sell him coming off an injury either. His contract is to 2023 (IIRC), so we have another year where he can contribute and still have resale value.
11
Wouldn’t be surprised if both left. I’m not sure Torreira has a place in the 4-3-3 that Arteta seems to be transitioning to.
2
Think Guendouzi has a higher ceiling than Torreira.
2
Torriera is also not good enough for what we want to be I'm afraid. I'd sell both. Our midfield is basically a disaster. Xhaka has his flaws but he's the only player in our midfield with the quality we require to get back where we belong.
-4†
Guendouzi offers far more than Torreira.
-18
I’m not a football genius, but I don’t even remember guendos last very good performance for us
14
Could say the same for Torreira tbh.
None of our midfielders are the quality we need really.
3†
He was good vs Chelsea and united, tbh I agree though. If we can sell and upgrade then I wouldn’t mind it. Lucas isn’t a great epl fit
6
Villa at home where he single handedly got us three points.
2
The MVP of Arsenal YouTube content
35
imagine if Ornstein/Fabrizio had a youtube account lol. He does have his own podcast for talking in more depth so it's a bit useless though.
6
Didn't he used to do a qna or something like that?
0
I think they're only on the athletic now.
3
Selling Guendouzi for any decent amount would be the best business we’ve done in years. I love his passion^TM but he doesn’t really have any standout attributes besides his engine. Yeah yeah I know he’s young, but the likes of Fabregas, Wilshere, Nasri, Theo, etc. were making major contributions at his age. That’s the standard we need to return to.
25
He's an outstanding ball progresser, profiles among the league's best at it statistically, at 21.
15
Can't be true, he only passes sideways /s
0†
[deleted]
2
Guendouzi wants to leave and we have the opportunity to get a good price. Don’t think there’s any interest in Willock but if a team offered 30 mil I’d bite their hand off.
1
Thank god this one is only 11 minutes. I really like his videos but he mumbles way way too much.
12
He rambles a lot in this one as well don't worry lol
18
Mumblecore
1
Would like to keep Guendozi and sign Partey. I think he's going to be a really good deep lying playmaker . He just needs time to develop and cut out the bad habits. I hope Mikel can teach him those things.
9
Actual question. Who would buy guendouzi for 40m? I can’t see any prem clubs. The only club in France who could afford would be PSG. Would they want him? I think the valuation for him is fair I just struggle to think of clubs who have the cash like that pay for him.
4
PSG would love him
13
PSG spent €30m on a 29yo Gueye with little resale value and mixed performances out of the box. 40m for a 21yo, still with potential, and who had only slightly worse all-round metrics in the PL last season for his first top flight season ever compared to a three year "veteran". That would be chump change for them, and a bad deal for us.
PSG spend €40m on Paredes, who came from Zenit.
5
Leicester have been heavily linked to him but don't think they would splash that much on him. Everton could be a possible destination and maybe Newcastle if they finally get new owners. Other than the PL, it is possible Barca may want a new central midfielder, although they would definitely want someone more established. And maybe, Gazidis fancies bringing him to Milan. Overall, PSG seems the best match for sure.
3
This just popped up on my Twitter https://twitter.com/ffspod/status/1276517690853785600?s=21
3
This is likely similar to that thing where you could see Messi on like United via their website.
Nothing in it I would bet.
3
Seems like Photoshop. The rumor mill will go into full overdrive seeing this but unless a reputed source reports it, it's just the transfer rumor generator
1
Inter maybe? They’re one of the clubs linked. I don’t believe the Barca or atletico rumour at all. This is only the first day the rumour came out so maybe we’ll hear more soon
1
If we assume Partey is leaving, the Atletico rumour makes the most sense.
2
Simeone does seem like he’d love a guy with guendos attitude
1
Rumor goes that clubs like Barca, Atletico, and Inter are also interested. Who knows.
1
[deleted]
3
?
3
[deleted]
4
We'll regret selling Guendouzi in 5 years time but I guess that's just what we have to deal with if we want to compete again. We need the money more than we need him right now.
1†
Why wait for him to run his contract down? Lots of dead wood we can sell to fund our midfield additions
1
[deleted]
1
[deleted]
1
This guy popped up on my feed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Nu6QyExb1U&list=TLPQMjYwNjIwMjAHrVAhgOiu7Q&index=1
1
Is it Arteta or Edu who is facing the key summer transfer decisions?
1
Edu with artetas involvement. Edu and arteta discuss what the team needs, edu finds the players that fit that and then arteta had final approval.
Edu won't sign anyone he disagrees with but edu can force anyone on arteta that arteta disagrees with
1
Where are all the haters who downvote me to hell for selling Guendo for 50m?
We should be doing this kind of business if we want to rebuild.
1
How does his channel only get 4K subs hahaha.. he is a legit source
0
He only started it recently tbf
1
He’s still young but I would sell him in a heartbeat. He has a great engine can go for days but honestly at 21 any player can do that. A few things I’ve noticed from watching film is he plays more like a 10 without having the quality of a 10. If you notice once he recovers the ball he tries to dribble and hangs on to the ball far too long instead of making the quick pass. Also he is often to high up the pitch leaving the other midfielders covering for him. A perfect example is casemiro he knows he’s not gifted with his feet so he decided to learn the DMF position and all he does for Madrid is bully, recover, pass quick and from time to time take a long range shot. That’s who Guendouzi needs to model his game after.
-1
I actually think he should model himself after kovacic. He has the dribbling flair to juke past players and then make a line breaking pass and can also do long switching plays. I dont think he will ever learn to become defensively astute enough to be the main DM in the team. Young players like sangare or papa gueye can. Their physicality makes up for it as well as their engine. They also have dribbling flair and technique and the ability to bully players into losing possession. Thats not guendouzi at all he is more of interceptions, i rarely seen him stop a guy dribbling straight up or shield him out of play like xhaka/ torreira does. These players are more suited to screen the defence, recover the ball as well as progress the play all from deep.
3
Guendouzi can't defend, there's no way he can become Casemiro.
0
I said Casemiro as an example and to model his game after him. Casemiro was actually an 8 but he said there was too much completion for that position so he learned how to become a DMF. I’m in no way saying Guendouzi is like casemiro, simply states to study his game.
1
There’s no way he can learn how to defend? Lol
1
I hope we get rid. Sure he's had some good performances and he's young, but his bad attitude is exactly what we need to stamp out imo.
-2
[deleted]
1
Apart from recently telling Maupay he earns more than he ever will and the subsequent 'bust up' that apparently occurred presumably due to the discipline he received for that. He was disciplined for bad behaviour during the training camp abroad. That 2-1 hand gesture away at Watford. He has a well known history of petulance at his previous clubs. When I've watched him play he is often whiney and arrogant. Obviously some of this is just stuff that has been reported and my own opinion so who knows what the truth is but I get the impression he is one of those who cares about himself above all else.
0
[deleted]
2
All valid points, but i'm totally disagreeing with his idea that our midfield is the most crucial part of our team that we need to work on.
-2
Genuine question but why do you think midfield isn't top priority?
2
Because the defence is by far the place we lack most, and it has been this way since before we had a bad midfield. It is an area we have said to ourselves over and over and over again "we need to bolster our defence with some proper centre halves" and we never, ever get it right. We need to build this squad from the back forward. Midfield isn't to blame for the fact that we just leak goals left right and centre.
2
While I agree that we need a CB overhaul, I respectfully disagree that it's the most pressing area and the main source of our woes. Our midfield is completely incapable of retaining the ball or properly defending the area in front of our defense. The more we have it or win it back, the less we put our CBs under undue pressure. Don't forget we also have a big piece coming in at CB this summer (even if I do think its a terrible idea for Gooners to expect Saliba to fix everything day 1). Bringing positional awareness, robustness and technical ability back to our midfield should be priority number one IMHO.
1
Something Charles brings up in this that I very much agree with is that Guendouzi only has 2 years left on his contract and it doesn't look very convincing that he would want to sign a new one. If we don't sell him this window then when we get to the next window he would be entering his final year and we all know how that goes at arsenal. We should 100% sell him this summer.
He’ll be in line to receive a pretty big raise because now he’s a pretty high profile player, and tbh I don’t think he offers enough for us to justify it
I don't think he does either, but I also think Guendouzi and his agents will almost certainly think he will.
The epl appearances at his age, as well as French national team interest will definitely be some good leverage for them
Is Guendouzi a "pretty high profile player"? He's relegated to 4th choice under Arteta, might soon become 5th choice if Arteta is willing to play AMN in the middle.
I think he is, 57 appearances for arsenal and he just turned 21 as well as a French national team call up. He isn’t amazing or anything for us but that’s nothing to scoff at. Some teams will look at our midfield and think they can get the best out of him in a different role or with different teammates
We really need to
Personally I just don't think his style of play suits the Premier League. It's not that he's not talented or doesn't have potential, because I think he has both. But the physicality and tempo of the Prem isn't for everyone, and I think Guendo is one of those players. I think he could really push on in Spain or Italy where the game is a little slower and he can rely more on his passing range and vision
This is said about 99.9% of players that aren't performing at their best in the Premier League
If you only read my first sentence then sure
No, exact word for word. Replace the 'passing range' and 'vision' with the better qualities of whatever player.
This seems like a bad take to me. Guendo has some limitations, but he’s had several games where at the end of a tough match he’s the player on our team still driving, looking to make things happen, and taking advantage that other players are getting worn down. He’s not a big strong guy yet, but his mentality and stamina really allow him to hold his own here. The strength bit he may grow/work into, too.
I’m not saying we should hold onto him, but he’s got good tools for the EPL.
If you look at the best midfields in the league (Pool, City, and Chelsea) he doesn’t fit a role any of them utilize. I think that’s telling. Somewhat similar players like Gundogan and Jorginho are much better at quick short passing, while someone like Henderson is a much more physical prescience and good crosser of the ball. Maybe he can play like Rodri but even he has been the weakest link in the City midfield this season
Fair enough.
But Guendouzi is fucking 21 and in the second year of his top flight career. You just compared him to guys in and around 30, in the primes of their careers.
I'm not saying he will get to their levels, but it's not like how he plays now will be how will play at 29.
He must adapt to Arteta's style, and he probably will with a less disruptive season, but his current dilemma has nothing to do with his ability or his potential and everything to do with being a bad professional.
I personally think he is quite close to Kovacic in that way. Good at dribbling and playing the ball forward. Passable defensively. Don’t forget he is only 21.
extra credit if you said this last season when everyone was praising or earlier this season.
Guendouzi signed a 4 year contract when we got him?
Iirc else signed a new deal in the summer only when the team was in preseason. How was that only three years ?