Source
r/leagueoflegends•
Kontorted

What exactly are the complaints of ADC players?

So I'm an ADC main, specifically a Xayah main. I've been trying to understand why so many on this subreddit seem to find ADC to be a difficult role. I understand having a bad support can definitely mess up your lane and your scaling, though, at least from my experience, I have yet to actually run into terrible supports on a consistent basis. It's usually once or twice every 50/60 games, sometimes not even once. I also get that ADC requires a lot of gold, so naturally there's a weak early/mid game, and unless you've been fed, you will only be useful after 25 minutes. I also understand that since other classes can spike faster, such as mages and assassins, they naturally feel very oppressive for an ADC, but I think it's a decent trade off for how much late game power you can have. Furthermore, with a strong peel support, it's unlikely even these classes can kill you, such as a Lulu.

I don't mean to criticize, I just genuinely want to understand. I don't think the role is difficult or stupid. I recognize it's quite feast or famine, but outside of that, I don't see how it's bad.

Posted Aug 25, 2020, 1:44 AM UTC

948
FinishIcy14:twitch::cntop:•

My complaint is that without autofill and duoQ parity bot lane can be decided before the game even begins. I'm not sure how anyone can play ADC main + Supp main vs ADC main + autofill supp or 2 solo players vs a duo and think to themselves "Damn why do ADC mains dislike the role?"

Bot lane just isn't very fun when it's 15+ mins of laning in many games and matchmaking can't provide a fair playing ground. It'll never be "truly" fair but it can't even get the most basic shit down - like making sure both sides are mains, both are duos, both have equal autofills, etc.

15
[deleted]•

[deleted]

-5
FinishIcy14:twitch::cntop:•

An autofill support doesn't have to be bad.

Maybe not in low elo but once you get supports who actually play the game instead of sitting 500 units behind you checking their onlyfans messages the entire game it begins to matter and become quite clear who understands the match ups and the lane very, very quickly.

16
Fabulousfungus•

You could say the say thing about adc. There have been so many times when i ping to go in, then go in and im fighting a 1v2 while some jinx is still csing like nothing is happening.

2
lightXXVI:sona: expert kills thief :alistar:•

Yes that always happen but at least we have the option to roam and help other lanes. ADCs do not have that option bcs of how much they need the gold/xp which is why it feels so terrible to play.

1
FilthyMageHunter•

Duo Q vs non Duo Q in unplayable in higher elo, especially when the enemy duo picks champs that synergize very well together and have played together for a while. while your support doesn't and you have no idea what they're doing IMO bot lane duos should only every be matched against other bot lane duos. Even when that's true bot lane is 80% better support wins and only 20% better ADC wins. My biggest issue though is the XP nerfs while mid and top go XP buffs that happened this preseason that mean mid and top laners are 3-4 levels above you while it was only 1-2 last season Throw in no comms for solo Q and you have assassins that don't even bother with laning in mid and just perma roam and 4 man dive bot lane. The XP changes may have helped top lane but it also ruined ADC.

1
SgtThermo•

As a very bad low plat support main, I can promise you that I lose 1v1 against most any solo-laner above Bronze 2. I legit have no idea how to play around the lane without my second zone of control/safety/damage that is my ADC.

I’m pretty aware of what solo lane champs do, obviously, and more-or-less HOW they do it... but I’m fuckin’ clueless as to when, or why, or how often. Literally all I play is the bottom lane, as a support.

Sometimes when I play top I accidentally hit a minion two more times than I should, and my lane is fucked for the next 8 minutes. It’s a bit harder to fuck up bot wave alone, but not THAT much harder.

Logically, most of these things are commonalities between unplayed roles. Support is way different from solo laning, and you have your dogbrain AD to worry about while trying to hide your own dogbrain until lane phase is over.

1
DeathByCudles•

How many of your ranked games do you feel like you actually contribute to the win? Thats my main problem. Usually by 25 min when you actually "turn on" the game is decided despite you coming online. I find "yay I went even in lane, didnt feed, and finally got my third item spike" always is followed by "oh....but they have a 10-0 riven toplane." Or "oh we have a 10-0 renekton mid" and the game snowballs thru them. Very rarely do I feel like I'm strong enough to contribute, either I stay back and contribute 3-5 AA to clean up a fight or I get blown up immidiatly.

And yes it would be lovely to get a lulu support. Sadly I only get brand, and shieldless luxs who all go pure AP, because nobody wants to play a supportive role, its either carry yourself or /ff for most people.

15
Protoniic:kayn:•

The same thing can go for every single role. Top can be ahead 1v1 but botlane is 10-0. Jungle can farm well and get some ganks off but if laners still lose or int the lead you wont be able to walk into your jungle anymore.

5
DeathByCudles•

In theory thats how it SHOULD be, get an overly fed player, snowball thru them. But its ten times easier for a 2-4 renekton to kill a 10-0 ADC, than it ever would be for a 2-4 ASC to kill a 10-0 renekton. Not even 1v1, most champions can dive, kill you, and get out without even sacrificing their life to do it.

Which goes back to agency in a game. I never feel like i contribute; because my contribution is not based on how well I do, but rather IF my team decides to play around me. That is a very frustrating thing to realize, regardless of if your winning or losing lane. That you could be 10-0 and still not snowball a game because you NEED your team to do their job to enable you. No other role(except jungle to a lesser extent....they can at least go to a different part of their jungle) has these restrictions placed on them. Support top and mid dont NEED anything from the team to do well. They have the green light to solo carry all game.

0
KontortedOPBirb :xayah: :pyke: X•

Most of my ranked games, I win lane and snowball by capitalizing hard on enemy misposition. I guess it happens more often since I'm still in lower elos, but its easy for me to take a lead and push it. However, if I fall behind, I indeed feel quite useless. I would say this is true for most carries, its just that other carries can spike a bit faster, so it won't feel as bad.

3
DeathByCudles•

Damn, well your obviously better than me. I tried for a while to punish the enemies mispositioning. But unless its 30 min the only person I can 1v1 is the other ADC.(IF team follows me its to take the kill, and not to make sure i stay alive) And usually if you step forward to punish them you get jumped on and die immidiatly.

I spend most of the game sitting back waiting for the enemy to use all their ultimates so i can safely step up to auto attack without dieing.

3
ggDusk•

I mean, I have a few complaints overall, but my main complaint with the role is with how much of the power budget actually being in another role.

There's a big misconception about the argument people put up and how people receive it. Bot lane as a whole is in an okay state, but all other factors aside, ADC itself (in a vacuum) is in a pretty poor state lol

9
MALSTROEM_•

The role isn't bad, people would just rather say "hey the role sucks lol I can't do shit" than admit they suck at the game

8
IainG10•

I'm not sure they're even bad (overall), they just don't understand or accept that to carry as an ADC is a different playstyle and has different requirements to carrying as say a Mid or a Jung. Kills are nice, but farm is very important as well (moreso than other roles); you come online far later than other roles, and even when you do, you are less able to do anything wilst solo. I think it's a lot of capable players being filled into a Role they poorly understand, and just trying to play like it's their main Role.

3
SnapCityIsMyCity2•

The role is just significantly less fun than the others. I main adc and it is by far the least fun role in the game. Played a game earlier and had an Evelyn do 1300 damage to me with one Q+E despite me having maw and I just die. Very fun.

1
FratricidePantsuit•

Just play another role or another game. How dumb are you?

2
SnapCityIsMyCity2•

What, in any way does your comment have anything to do with the discussion? You say role isn't bad, I'm telling you it is. Typical league player tbf. Pretty special.

2
TransparentKnives•

He’s saying if you are not having FUN in a GAME then dont play the game or change to a role where you would have FUN.

1
hgrforparadise:gnar:•

I think the biggest problem with ADC is mages are fundamentally better in a lot of elo’s imo.

For instance I would recommend most people below Gold to just play mage bot instead of a marksmen. Marksmen rely on peel and get punished heavily for having a bad support/poor positioning.

There’s a few safer ADC’s like Ezreal for example, but buy in large this is the case. Where as if you just played Viegar, Kayle, Heim, etc. you can do a lot of your peel yourself, and you still scale like crazy.

3
Miizurin•

Mages aren't necessarily better as much as they're much easier to play. Imagine having to right click the enemies and kite back and forth while dodging skillshots or just stand in the back and throw spells until something lands. You can play really passive on a lot of mages and still deal a lot of damage while ADCs wants to constantly auto attack.

1
hgrforparadise:gnar:•

Yup, more or less what I was getting at. The ADC requires imo to master attack move. I bet there’s so many players who barely use it/don’t even know about it.

1
Mrcookiesecret•

I think this is correct, but you don't mention the biggest reason mages can outdo adcs at the adc game: the buff mages got to damage on turrets. To me, one of the adcs' main purposes was siege/turret taking, but once mages got comparable damage why bother with a squishy, no-cc-having, immobile adc?

1
WarringNation•

I think the main problem is just a lack of agency. Most of the time, it just feels like I'm here to hold the enemy bot lane, and if I do get fed, it doesn't feel like I can take over the game the same way other champions can. That's because I'm just super dependent on the support and the team in general. Support has to be near me most of the time because anyone can kill me, and I need the team to play around me if I want to win the game. I literally cannot walk up to clear or push waves by myself because if three people from the enemy team are missing on the map, you can bet they're going to come after me if they see me alone.

There have been countless games where I'm literally just getting carried by my topside to victory, even if I'm winning lane. My role just seems to be super dependent on other members doing well, and it feels like I don't actually have an impact in the games.

3
afk10min•

It’s a hard role because the champions lack mobility compared to other champions who have gap closers. A lot easier to punish ADCs who make positional mistakes while they also die instantly. Lots of people suck at the game so lots of people make many mistakes on ADC and end up dying instantly all the time.

2
KontortedOPBirb :xayah: :pyke: X•

ADC was, from my opinion, never fundamentally balanced around 1v1s, unless it's against another ADC. They were balanced around being able to kite around while the enemy is kept busy by your frontline. It's actually a big reason why I chose to main Xayah. The self peel is very helpful to keep myself alive, especially if I misposition.

3
afk10min•

The only 1v1 scenario an ADC should be in is against another ADC or you’re solo laning and bullying a melee champion. People are just dumb and think they can 1v1 khazix or xin Zhao as Ashe or Caitlyn before they’ve even completed a second item.

2
cubewanos69:sett:•

Ah yes the classic picks a fight with the 12/2 Irelia as a ranged champ and then complains when he gets solo killed

2
yeerth:tristana::kaisa:•

It's not exactly an issue, but usually even a 0/6 irelia would solo kill you if they land their stun.

1
Miizurin•

How does adc lack mobility when they can kite pretty much every champion in the game? Unless they have some fed assasin and your team isn't peeling at all you're pretty much unkillable if you positioned properly. Let's not forget the infinite range some adcs have (cait, senna). If you want mobility pick ezreal but even other adcs have a good kit for surviving people trying to kill them. For example roots, slows, traps, gaining a lot of extra movement speed out of nowhere and being generally really tanky stat wise considering they're supposed to be somewhat squishy.

-5
afk10min•

The use of hyperbole in almost every aspect of your argument just makes you look stupid. Learn to be rational for once.

1
Dark-Dragon:kindred: Lamb is pretty cute•

I don't even play bot carry and I still think marksmen are extremely weak. They blow up in an instant and even in their best times they barely deal more damage than a mid lane ap carry. So many things have to go right for them to actually have a decent impact on a team fight whereas an assassin or ap carry or even tank have so much power just in their own presence. An assassin will dish out just so much damage and usually comes with a built in "oops I fucked up"-button that gets them out of many sticky situations. An ap carry brings more crowd control and zoning or straight up deals similar amounts of damage but as an AOE. Tanks and bruisers while not dealing as much damage over a long time, still have enough damage to easily win an encounter with a marksman. Add to that how much more damage they can absorb and the unnatural amounts of CC they pack and it's apparent that they bring a lot more value overall, at least in most situations. Sure a marksman can do really well if they win their lane and don't get caught and have a lot of gold and have a team that plays around them and position perfectly and not get popped in an instant.... but those are a lot of conditions when you're opposing them to something like "don't go 0 6 in lane and then just walk straight at the carry and press all your buttons at once"

2
[deleted]•

As every pro and their mom has been saying: the recent nerfs to adcs and their builds have left the role in a more utilitarian place. Meta adcs currently (mostly in proplay) are Senna, Ashe and maybe Jhin? Idk i dont watch much but its what i gathered from what i hear.

So anyway, they hate it, or something.

2
stumpyrail101:bard: I like a challenge :thresh:•

If I play mid and I fuck up that’s my fault if I play adc and my supp goes 0/3 in the first 4 mins then I have to play safer because they have item advantage and I lose more cs making the gap wider and suddenly they have a full item over me because my supp fed them early.

2
TeamAquaGrunt:jax: Imagine if I had a real flair•

90% of it is just people looking for excuses as to why they can't climb, plain and simple. They'll hear a streamer talk about adc being a bad role and think "ahaha yes, I knew it, that's why I've been silver for 4 seasons!" and proceed to get 50 cs in 15 minutes while the enemy adc gets 120. They'll proclaim that the better support determines the lane while both supports are also silver 3, and that anyone who claims to be able to climb solo as an adc is lying.

1
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
Protoniic:kayn:•

ADC is teamreliant class.

1
Hallowiner•

The problem with ADC isn’t the champs. All the champs that aren’t kog are fine. It’s that they can’t do anything in their own line since all support champs other than braum (which still has a lot of presence in pro play) are so strong. It’s partially why adcs are doing well mid and top. And sona lux botlane works.

-1
KontortedOPBirb :xayah: :pyke: X•

Marksman have always had advantages against melee, which is why marksman are played quite often in the top lane, much to the anger of top mains. ADCs would still have the same weaknesses there though. ADC is the items, a marksman could choose to build more bruiser styled and dish out damage while also taking it.

0
Hallowiner•

Don’t think that true imo. Crit items are super cheap, and Bork and DD are still pretty OP. ADCs just don’t have enough say in the lane. It’s the reason why Caitlyn, jhin and Lucian are top tier since cait can poke people out of lane and jhin and Lucian have really strong early all in potential.

1
laptopguyi7•

im a mid main, but like to play adc here and there.

the biggest complain is that ADs can win lane going 3/0, and still lose a 1v1 to a solo laner.

in my opinion that is fine, because a well farmed bruiser/mage should beat an adc early game if they play it well, due to how ADCs scale.

but mostly because getting kills bot lane is much easier than in other lanes, because its so action packed.

a complaint I have is getting 4 man dove in high elo, but im not good enough at bot lane to counter it so I accept it.

I think the key between good ADC players and these who steamroll lane and then troll, is that good ADCs know how to apply global pressure without chasing kills like monkeys, early-mid game pushing for towers and catching waves is safer and nets you more than ARAMing and looking for kills.

-1
fox112:council:•

There was a few months where having a Marksman on your team wasn't 100% required for every team and every game.

-3
KontortedOPBirb :xayah: :pyke: X•

Truth be told, I can still see games where they aren't needed even now. Since ADC spikes late, closing the game early is the easiest way to not need a marksman on your team.

A carry also doesn't have to be a marksman. Yasuo and Master Yi can both branch into ADC items and do exactly the same thing. Both actually have better agency and self-peel, and Yasuo can spike way quicker, so that's another way to be super strong

1
jubilee414404•

It's pretty bad because of the meta we are in. We aren't in ADC meta right now and that's ok.

-4
Kazeshiri:eug2: It starts with success...•

ADC role isn't meta, also if anything breaths on u you die.

-5
KontortedOPBirb :xayah: :pyke: X•

Every carry is this weak, ADC players only feel it more since they spike later, so everyone else has time to level up and deal higher damage. It's the same reason why Yasuo can feel so oppressive, because he can do ADC level damage significantly earlier than most ADC.

1
MangoCrouton•

I’m only saying this because I just had a recent experience but playing ADC just feels terrible. And seems to be super team reliant. I had 300 CS 6 items and it’s impossible to step up against a rumble to deal any damage. You just get melted/slowed to death. If you aren’t getting peel you have to be positioned perfectly at all times. It’s just stressful

1
Wernailion•

?? If the rumble steps up to you HE Gets melted. That one change in mentality is crucial.

1
MangoCrouton•

It’s not reality though

1
VoxRex6•

Fucking L o L

1