Source
r/Beretta•
bshacklett

150gr rounds causing malfunctions in M9A3?

I've got a reasonably new M9A3. I put about 200 rounds through it with no issues. Recently, I got a box of 500 rounds of Federal 150gr syntech ammo. It wasn't necessarily what I was looking for, but with prices/availability what they are, I was reasonably happy to get it.

At the range, yesterday, I noticed two distinct issues:

  1. The slide did not lock back on an empty magazine.
  2. I had one failure to feed (similar to this: https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn0.thetruthaboutguns.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F02%2F616.jpg&f=1&nofb=1)

I spoke with the RSO and he noted that the powder charge was likely to be lower on a 150gr round and I might need a lighter recoil spring if I want to use this ammo.

Has anyone else seen anything similar? This is purely practice ammo, so neither of these issues is a huge deal, but I'm concerned that it might be having a negative impact on the gun.

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Thanks!

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Edit:
I got a chance to test out a 12.5# recoil spring today and it functioned much better. Still a couple of failures to lock back the slide, but it obviously improved things. I've got an 11.5# that I'll try on my next trip out.

I also installed a Wilson Combat "Shok Buff" recoil buffer. I don't know if it's really going to help, but I figure it's not likely to hurt.

Posted Oct 12, 2020, 11:46 PM UTC · edited

311
Ag5545•

The RO is absolutely right. The 150gr Syntech rounds are specifically made to be as soft as possible while still getting certain power factor ratings for competition. This low charge will cause FTFs and the slide not to lock back. If you plan on running Syntech a lot, change your recoil spring to 12.5#.

5
bshacklettOP•

That definitely sounds reasonable. I was reading that the stock spring is 13#. Is going down to 12.5# really sufficient?

On another note, is there any other benefit to a lighter-weight recoil spring? I've seen notes that so-called "competition" springs are generally lighter-weight.

2
Ag5545•

I think the m9a3 comes stock with a 14#, at least according to LangdonTactical. Most stock guns are sprung to maximize reliability and go with most defensive and FMJ rounds. For this reason, most aftermarket recoil springs are lighter, to deal with the lighter loads you have in competitions.

If you pair a certain round/load with a certain spring weight, you can make a noticeable difference with your double taps.

3
Previous_Target•

I use 9lb springs with my competition ammo. 150gr Syntech is designed with that velocity/power ammo in mind. I like a really light recoil spring though. I'd suggest you could go about 11 or so and keep 100% function

1
bshacklettOP•

Are there any concerns about damaging the gun if the recoil spring is too light for the ammunition?

1
Previous_Target•

Yeah. You’ll shorten the life of the aluminum frame by battering it if you feed it a steady diet of +p with a super light spring. But I’m shooting a 92a1 with the blue aluminum frame buffer and 130PF competition loads. So I’m not hurting the gun. I just shouldn’t shoot hot stuff without swapping the recoil spring back to something heavier.

3
equivalent_units•

9 lb is equivalent to the combined weight of 3.1 human lungs

^^I'm ^^a ^^bot

0
mmiski92FS•

First and foremost, clean and lube the gun if you haven't already done so. That typically solves most issues. If you've already done that then we can explore other things...

The slide not locking back on an empty magazine is typically a follower spring issue within the magazine itself. A weak or dirty spring will cause that, as there's not enough upward force from the follower to push the slide release up. Shitty aftermarket magazines will also cause issues. Beretta OEM mags are ideal, but if you absolutely must buy more mags on a budget then Mec-Gar is the way to go. If the issue happens with ALL your magazines, then there's a chance the spring for the slide release itself is worn and needs to be replaced.

If you're still having feeding issues after addressing the two issues above, then chances are your M9A3 simply doesn't like 150gr ammo. One thing to keep in mind is that the internals have remain unchanged from the very original 92 series pistols. It's an older design and these guns were designed with NATO spec 124gr ammo in mind. If you deviate from that too much by getting cartridges that are too light or too heavy, it'll mess with the timing and how everything cycles (resulting in the feeding issues you describe). If you can get your hands on any 115gr or 124gr brass or nickel-plated cased cartridges, that'll help you rule out ammo as being the cause.

2
blyat56•

The slide not locking back on an empty magazine is typically a follower spring issue within the magazine itself.

Or a grip issue. I shoot with a high grip and have problems locking open on many handgun platforms unless I am mindful to move my thumb away from the slide release. Failure to lock open or pick up a round can also sometimes result from a thumb dragging on the slide, or robbing momentum by insufficiently supporting the weapon.

However I think the RSO in this case is probably on the money, 150gr Syntech is a load for competition shooters who are playing power factor games. It may not be able to reliably cycle a new gun that is sprung for standard ammo.

1
bshacklettOP•

I cleaned and lubed the gun the night before. I could potentially have done a poor job of it, but at that point in time, I only had about 150 rounds through the gun to begin with.

I'd agree with the suggestion about the mags, except that, again, this is a pretty new firearm with very little use, and all three mags are the ones that came with the gun straight from Beretta. As for the slide release spring, again, I'd think it's new enough that it this wouldn't be an issue, but I'll definitely keep it in mind.

I'm definitely going to try to get my hands on some 115gr (or 124gr) ammo, and try to stick with that in the future. I'm thinking I might try changing the recoil spring for the short term, until I burn through the rounds that I've got.

Of course, if you see any flaws in my logic, here, please keep me honest!

Thank

1
BongSaber_00•

I doubt its anything to do with the lube given the nature of the weapon. It's a combat pistol, there's very little you could do in my mind to make it malfunction especially if its a new pistol. I'm no expert but I can only recall on my own experience with the firearm. I let my girlfriend shoot it out of the box brand new with 124 GRAIN target ammo I think Federal. She's never shot a gun before so I thought it'd be nice that she learned.... anyway with in like the first two shots had that same feeding malfunction brass ejected and it looked like your picture. My only assumption could be is maybe the way your holding it just a loose grip combined with a limp wrist potentially causing the malfunction. Or that it is indeed the ammunition causing it to hang up. But I loaded a new magazine and it was like butter when I shot it and didn't have a malfunction the rest of the day. but honestly I doubt its anything you did.

1