Source
r/politics•
jonask84

Help me understand Ron Paul, if you have a minute

As a imigrant living in the US for a few years now, and as a conservative (at least economically) I am trying to understand what so many people here on reddit see in Ron Paul. If you have a minute, would you debate with me?

I understand he has a lot of good policies (i.e. policies I agree with), but some of his talk of complete deregulation and removal of government seems to me to go way too far.

I was having a pretty good back and forth with this guy the other day, but he sort of stopped responding when we got down to the core of it. And from other people, instead of explanations, I got downvotes (maybe I was being a moron without know it).

If someone has a few minutes, and wants to take me to school on this Libertarian's policies, feel free to jump in.

Thanks

Posted Dec 16, 2011, 5:57 PM UTC

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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jonask84OP•

heh, I think you hit it dead on...

For fun I invite you to come back here, to this thread, and have a look around. Check out the exchange between 'zeron5' and 'Psionx0' down there.

Can't make a coherent sentence (let alone an argument)? Add more exclamation marks.

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wdjm•

I agree with you. He has some policies I agree with, some I think are completely nuts and really bad for the country.

However, when compared to the rest of the GOP bunch...at least he has SOME policies I agree with...

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[deleted]•

Consider each state to be its own little country -- that's kind of the base idea.

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Psionx0•

When you get down to the core of what RP wants to do, not only does the POTUS not have the power to do such things (complete deregulation of the market, abolishing certain portions of the government, reducing the pay of the POTUS) but some of them would be downright horrible for the health of the nation (Destroying the Dept. of Ed would be a disaster for the number of future engineers and doctors we need).

I'm sorry, but the most you'll get from the RP crowd on here are RP talking points (taken from his speeches, not any of his published writings). They aren't interested in really knowing their candidate. They are very happy with the nice wool blanket he is pulling over their eyes.

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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Psionx0•

A single trick pony should not be president. And that is all RP is. As I said in my reply. All the OP will get is RP talking points. Thank you for proving my point.

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ProudLikeCowz•

Yeah. The only anti-war presidential candidate running right now.

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Psionx0•

One trick ponies shouldn't be president.

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ProudLikeCowz•

Yeah. Fuck freedom and Civil liberties!

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Psionx0•

My gods you people are dense. HE ISN'T THERE FOR YOUR LIBERTIES AND FREEDOMS HE SIMPLY THINKS THAT THOSE FREEDOMS AND LIBERTIES SHOULDN'T BE PROTECTED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND THAT IT'S COMPLETELY OKAY FOR THE STATE GOVERNMENT TO FUCK YOU.

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pygmyjesus•

To understand Ron Paul is simple. He wants the US federal government to function as it did in the 18th and 19th centuries. Whether that's good or bad, you have to decide.

I feel he would be ineffective as President anyway, since congress would never pass much of what he speaks about, and I doubt he could ever actually get enough votes to be President anyway.

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drdesignz•

You can also try r/ronpaul and r/libertarian

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[deleted]•

You probably weren't being a moron if you got downvotes. Ron Paul supporters downvote anything slightly critical about Ron Paul.

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[deleted]•

And Ron Paul opponents downvote anything slightly positive about Ron Paul. The real question is which downvote squad gets there first, as that will determine if your comment is buried or not. It's a crapshoot, in my experience.

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[deleted]•

If you look at my post history I'm VERY critical of Ron Paul and I don't downvote anyone unless they are personally insulting me or breaking rediquette. I had an account before this one where I was also critical of Ron Paul and after a while I started realizing within 30 minutes of posting something (even if it was in an obscure thread) it was downvoted to -5 or more. The reason I started anew was because of the constant downvote stalking and private message harassment by Ron Paul supporters.

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[deleted]•

Private message harassment is one thing...

but in posting pro- and anti- paul comments here (usually pro-, FWIW), I notice that either kind is sometimes buried and sometimes upvoted very quickly. I think things may be tilting more to the pro- side the past couple weeks though, as Paul has been gaining a lot of momentum in the polls, not just on r/politics.

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Psionx0•

I must not be critical enough of the RP supporters. I get downvoted to hell, but never had any private messages.

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zeron5•

I understand he has a lot of good policies (i.e. policies I agree with), but some of his talk of complete deregulation and removal of government seems to me to go way too far.

He's running on a Constitutional platform. There is no loss of local and state govt and regulation. Just reduction at the federal level. He's planning on giving back to the states a lot of of their sovereignty.

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Psionx0•

No, he is planning on removing the protections the Federal government has in place so states can't ultra fuck their residents. That is his plan, that is is goal. He is hiding it behind the "I'm a constitutionalist" mask, and his supporters are buying it up like arsenic laced kool aid.

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zeron5•

No, he is planning on removing the protections the Federal government has in place so states can't ultra fuck their residents.

OMG!!! You mean to tell us that those residents cannot vote and or change their own laws!!!!

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Psionx0•

OMG you mean those residents could be doing things like voting for PROP 8, and taking the rights of others away?!? OMG?!?! You mean the Federal government is the only protection against that?!?!

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zeron5•

Homosexuals have the same laws on them as everyone else. Straight people are banned from marrying the same sex too.

And what, you don't like Democracy!!!!

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perrycarter•

I live in California and vehemently opposed/voted against Prop 8. However the voters voted the way that they did. That is democracy. I don't like it but accept that is what the people in California want.

Fighting the majority of the people by overturning popular vote is a step towards tyranny. States should democratically determine their own laws and fate. This is a good idea even if I don't always agree with the outcome.

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hblask•

but some of his talk of complete deregulation and removal of government seems to me to go way too far.

Example please.

Getting rid of the Dept of Commerce, Energy, Education, and Homeland Security are all long overdue. We'd be better off flushing the money down the toilet, at least then it wouldn't be wrecking people's lives on the way.

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ticklebub•

I don't get why people think that the federal government protects them so much. I don't know why people just disregard the constitution so easily. The constitution and the rule of law are the only real protection any of us have. Some of us so easily shrug off Ron Paul, your mind may already be made up. Personally, I've decided that I'm not going to consider myself to be free just because the news channel suggests that this is freedom.

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