Is he right?
Posted Sep 19, 2021, 9:33 PM UTC
462193
I agree. If Im jumping online and cant find anyone or am playing the same 2 guys over and over, thr game is dead.
114
No shit he's right, no playerbase = no matchmaking. Any multi-player game only works on the condition of having other people to play against
95
The only game I saw with really NO playerbase was them’s fightin herds, I queued for a few hours and only got against the same 2 pros who kept bodying me. Any other old or niche fighting games I had no problem just finding people right away personally.
And even in a hypothetical world where I didn’t find people, just joining a discord and activating matchmaking notifications would allow me to just play other active games and when theres someone in that niche game I would join them. Again this is hypothetical, never had to go this far
5
that was me on both my alt accounts I got so good at the game everyone else stopped playing
19
I mean I disagree, but its still annoying as fuck to have to use discord to get games rather than the actual in-game matchmaking service. 3rd Strike and other older games still have pretty active playerbases despite being forced to use fightcade. They are all far from death.
93
The problem is that a bunch of retards read 'discord fighter' and think 'Third Strike, Skullgirls, +R, KI, UNICLR' or like a dozen other games that always have 100+ concurrent players half of whom are in matchmaking and you can get a game easily in.
It's really pretty easy to spot some guy who only plays Tekken or Street Fighter and is trying to tell themselves those are the only games alive anyway compared to somebody trying to get matches in some niche-ass-shit by the games they cite.
51
Well fightcade is closer to discord than a game with actual matchmaking. You still have to manually filter and choose a person to fight against where matchmaking does it automatically. I think its a fair enough comparing, but yeah it depends on the game.
14
Yeah maybe Third Strike was a bad example to lead with - even though I'll insist it's plenty active if you wanna play it, and there's a distinction between 'nobody plays this' and 'hasn't had a proper release in a decade' - but like Skullgirls you can get into a match from the steam client no problem.
Won't stop some chud who learned how to do a quarter circle 90 days ago from referring to it as a dead discord game.
25
Third Strike isn't a Discord fighter. You can still find unranked lobbies in 3SOE on 360 and PS3, and usually somebody's on playing. Fightcade and GGPO were around well before Discord.
Most of the other games you mentioned have good netcode implementation so the game can more easily find suitable matches. Even if 100 people are online, it doesn't matter if the game can't put them into playable games with each other.
Example for me: SC6 has 180 people on Steam concurrently, but it typically took me a while to find matches, and that matches I did get weren't good. I think the game is a lot of fun, and if netcode were a lot better, I'd play it.
6
I mean, I literally do not have a functioning last-gen console so I think of it as a Fightcade fighter - the point being that I know, the point I was making is you don't have to go to Discord and @somebody to get a match in any of those games. There are plenty of people playing all of those games imo, at least in NA.
-2
Plus R and KI aren’t discord fighters at all though lol.
1
[deleted]
1
I see no lies here. Not everyone's gonna wanna go the extra mile to join a discord server. If that shits dead, its dead.
62
Seems like he got mildly off topic though? Seems like the original point was that you don't need patches to force metas, a game can evolve for years and years unpatched. He kinda just started going off about dead games randomly. I agree with the first point, people who say a game is "solved" year 1 just have me rolling my eyes.
22
The original tweet was arguing that "dead" means "not evolving." Which isn't correct - at least, it doesn't match the common use of the word. I don't think that anyone would argue that a game can't keep evolving after its final patch.
9
Yeah it seemed kind of random to me too. The original tweeter said “a game is dead if nobody plays it” and then Sonic Sol responded with an opposing-sounding tweet but I think other guy would agree lol
3
Yeah fuck discords tbh, I got booted from the KOF one a while back because they decided to have a purge of low activity accounts and I cbf dealing with some loser admin randomly deciding to delete people in a game I dont even play that much.
And man, fuck those morons who will @ everyone in the server, OH WOW A NEW TEKKEN UPDATE OH WOW YOU CHANGED THE MOD TEAM. No one cares dude jesus, that tekken update is gonnna be all over whatever fgc news source you use, I dont need you sending notifications to my phone about it.
6
THIS^^. A majority of those discord channels, the kids in it are mad weird and have no sense reality. I stay away from randos on discord and just chill with people ik irl. It's never really worth it at all joining one most of the time.
19
You can turn off notifications for @everyone or well, just turn them off completely.
The activity thing was probably the purge command? Server might have been near capacity if it was a main one? Idk. I run a server and have never needed it.
3
nobody fucking cares lmao
-7
Yeah but some dead games are worth it. (Garou, Xrd, Samsh V special, etc)
54
The amount of players playing garou on fightcade is a warcrime
18
Same with VSp
7
Last Blade 2.
5
I tried Garou for the first time some months ago. The game is messed up. Did the devs actually expect people to do this feint canceling nonsense? It’s cool but fuck me is it hard.
5
A lot of SNK games are ROUGH on inputs
5
SonicSol is a fucking idiot and doesn't deserve any of the desperate attention he is searching for.
49
But is he right tho?
24
Yes
6
No, because discord fighters are poverty, not dead. If you can't easily find someone on the discord, then the game is truly dead.
2
I agree that matchmaking through online being inactive certainly hurts a community but I don't really think you can quite call the game "dead". Remember this is the dude who came swinging into the melty discord whining and then left cause people clowned his ass cause he was acting like a bitch. Chances are you will find a game on most servers except the ultra niche shit. Discord fighters aren't dead they're generally just unintuitive to play compared to something like Strive even if that game takes 5 whole ass minutes to start.
Now what's actually stupid about this tweet is that SonicSol being the absolute dipshit he is responded to something entirely different to what the original tweet was about and that's why people are clowning him.
45
I agree that matchmaking through online being inactive certainly hurts a community but I don't really think you can quite call the game "dead".
I think "dead" in this specific case should be observed as a spectrum, not as "either it's dead or it's alive" thing. So, "how dead is this game" etc.
A game not being able to perform one of its important services and requires out-of-game intervention by the user is at least "somewhat dead".
28
SonicSol changes games like I change my underwear. As soon as the new FOTM drops, he's on that shit ONLY until he gets washed by most of the online playerbase then dips. Was the same shit for SS7 and Granblue.
17
My problem with playing people from Discord is the skill difference. I'll get a reply from someone in the main +r discord and more often than not they're new / newish to the game. Dunno if they enjoy the experience but I don't, makes me feel like a scrub that likes picking on weaker players.
For the same reason, I don't bother asking for games on the melty discord, despite me thinking that game looks neat, because I don't want to get bopped for weeks by mostly veterans (presumably). I'll just stick to games I already like instead.
2
He's 100% correct.
43
Dead Game > Modern Day Bullshit
35
The games not dead, there's just 4 people in a discord server giving it CPR. But only on weekends 10am - 12pm depending on their work schedule.
35
This guy's reply has nothing to do with what the first guy said, at all. Fucking retards I swear
24
I've been trying to write up something about how Discord and Fightcade are similar but honestly I have nothing. He's wrong and everytime I see a tweet from him he's saying some stupid shit.
19
Nah what he said isn't debatable whatsoever. I have all my FG servers muted until I'm looking for a match but I often forget to turn it back on regardless. Then you gotta worry about maintaining a rapport, get personal with people, all that to play a set? I don't even know if I wanna ft15 a peacock main in SG but I'd look ridiculous if I tried to duck the set.
Publishing companies don't look at how many people are playing on discord. If it takes longer than 10-15 minutes to find a match, the playerbase is dead, no matter where you get it from. If 10 minutes to find a match in shooters is considered unplayable by the FPS playerbase, why would it be good for us?
40
Add to that the soft factors, such as, say, inability of the game to provide adequate matching by itself, which is perhaps not "dead", but close to it, depending on who you ask. More rigorous players when it comes to that, would regard something like that enough for the game to be declared dead - and since the term itself is flexible, they won't be wrong, from a certain standpoint.
The "I'm looking for a match" is already quite deep in the "dead" territory, because you yourself have to look for a match, instead of the game using its embedded channels to do so.
22
Yep. To be fair though, it hurts to talk about your favorite games in that light. I hate slinging phrases but there's no better way to describe it than copium
14
That's my pet peeve with these discussions, someone will get butthurt and label you as a "hater" because you used that term on his favorite game. Which is understandable from an emotional standpoint, but it's also incredibly lame thing to do.
I don't like when a game I like and play is called dead, but if it's true, then I try to not react like an emotionally driven teenager, but simply deduce that I play a dead game. Nothing wrong with that.
Especially since my current situation doesn't allow me to play "dead games", basically. My schedule is scattered during the day, so I might have like, 20 minute holes in it, which might be unknown to me before they actually happen. I can't play a game that can't provide a smooth in-and-out MM. Like, "let me queue while the taxi waits for me because 5 minutes isn't much for queue+match" type of thing. This info is very important for me, as I literally throw money away if I buy a multiplayer game with even a hint of being, not dead, but "mildly sick".
15
It's not that discord doesn't work for these games, he just doesn't wanna do it. which is fair enough, but just say that instead of pretending discord doesn't even find games.
18
Fightcade doesn’t have matchmaking per se but at least everyone there (who is online) is active and most likely looking to play. Not to mention it’s an easy & automatic process to challenge someone and boot up the game if they accept.
12
Yeah this is what Fightcade does over discord, if someone's on Fightcade you know they're down to play and you can just send an invite, you dont even need to talk to them if you don't wanna. Discord you're always risking interrupting someone's day or you're not sure if they're even actively online.
5
any decent Discord should have a matchmaking role that you can ping, so no one can complain if they get pinged for that. Ideally the role should be easily toggled by clicking on a reaction too
7
That's still way worse than just a lobby of players with direct game integration.
7
A lot of the time you don't need to join a Discord to play. A majority of older titles work on programs like BEAR and Fightcade. The only games now that you really need to join a matchmaking server to play are games with shit netcode and a small population like UMVC3, BBCF, and KOF XIII as well as games with 3rd party casters like Melty Blood (with Concerto you really don't need to join one anymore but the population is really low) and Eternal Fighter Zero.
11
ironic as fuck when he was in the samsho VSP discord @ everyone for games. mans is weird as fuck
19
It’s not ironic, it just proves his point. He tried to do the whole discord shit that everyone recommends and it didn’t work so clearly he’s gonna be cross about it. Not saying he’s necessarily right just that his point isn’t wrong.
54
Was about to say, seems like he has first hand experience here
12
no totally agreed, i just find it juxtaposed that he’s the mf saying it considering his involvement in the discord for a game that it doesn’t seem like he wants to play from this tweet.
broken clock is right two times a day type beat
0†
i think the point is that he wants to play the games but has to resort to discord shittery and that frustrates him
Sometimes you come back from work you just wanna hit matchmaking and play a few random games
14
oh yeah it’s frustrating as fuck and i can tell u coming from someone who’s been trying to get into a fightcade game it absolutely blows but at the end of the day the alternative of not being able to play at all isn’t much better
4
Nah I feel that, I think it’s more a frustration thing than a disagreement thing
3
A game being dead doesn't mean that you don't love it or don't play it. It's not a value judgment. It's not a contradiction to call a game dead, and still play it via Discord.
7
he mentions that in the post as well lol
5
Sonicsol zzz
16
If you don't like having to ask people to get games and you'd rather stick to mainstream games, that's totally fine. I totally understand if people don't want to do that, and they'd prefer to just have games lined up in matchmaking for them.
However, it's stupid to leap from that to saying that the game is dead. A game is dead when you can't find anyone to play it with. If a game has a community of regular players, it's not dead, it's just a smaller game. Have at least a little nuance for once in your life, please.
15
Yeah, you're absolutely right. A lot of games people call dead have active communities and tournaments and other events all the time. I mentioned in another post that I wish I didn't get fooled by dead game talk when I was too new to know better, and that's really my issue with it. People get turned away from games when they're told they're dead, even though there might actually be more than enough players.
5
Just because you dead game. Doesn’t make you Dead game.
14
Stating the obvious, what a brave take.
13
Hyper DBZ online will save the fgc. But it's mugen so that's never happening lol
7
Parsec will save the FGC once again, first with UMvC3.
4
Nibbas be calling a game dead If it doesn't get any form of update in a week
7
This kind of dead game bullshit kept me from trying some games because I didn't know better at the time. Now those games are more dead than back then but I play them actively and they're some of my favourites. I wish I never listened to anyone who talked about games being dead.
Oh no people called a game dead that was actually dead but you still enjoyed it anyways
Dead game =/= bad game, it just means you're gonna have a hard time finding people to play with
a lot of people dont think dead = bad, its more like 'am i gonna spend time learning this game and getting better when nobodys gonna be playing it in a month?'
but over time ive come to realize, just play whatever you find interesting and fun. if theres 10 people total who play it, who cares. valve literally killed Artifact but theres still players on reddit & discords playing with each other
This is the right attitude to have. I learned Alpha 2 because I wanted to learn Alpha 2 and it is so fucking fun. Do I have to play the same 19 Brazilians on Fightcade? Yeah, but it's worth it. Also, finally more people started playing it.
i know how that goes, im playing against the same bunch of brazilians on BF;BC2 lol
How do you actually get good at the game when the only people you’re playing against have been playing for years? I’m having this issue with +r atm
You shouldn't rely on that info if that info doesn't affect you as a player. You should rely on it if it does.
There are plenty of people who play "dead" games and that's fine. But, the info isn't necessarily false (unless we're talking about some moronic "apex is dead" quote), it just means you have no problems with playing "dead" games. They're still dead and that is important for some people (lack of free time or free time being scattered during the day in small instances etc).
Bro at some point my PC was out of service for 2 weeks so I bought GG +R for Switch and it felt like that game had a playerbase of like max 5 people, I never saw more than 3 people in lobby at the same time and yet I never waited more than 2 mins to play, I could play whenever for some reason
Switch bro...
Exactly my point haha, its where you expect to find no one, and yet! The game doesnt even have rollback
[deleted]
What game are you talking about?