Source
r/FreightBrokers•
packattack3000

Who's At Fault

Hello All -

One of my brokers gave a carrier with team drivers a load yesterday. Pick at 1400, deliver next day at 0700, 1170 miles away.

1170 miles overnight is near impossible overnight, even with the team. Carrier assured broker they could make it and there wouldn't be any issues at the time of booking. Broker says he did not push carrier into the load or appointment, and even said he didn't think they could make it. Carrier loaded and rolling at 1640 yesterday, called in this morning with an ETA to the receiver of 1500.

Now, Carrier is pissed because the receiver doesn't want to unload until next week. Causing an issue with my customer and their receiver.

Who's at fault here - the broker for giving the carrier a load he didn't think could make the transit, or the carrier for taking the load knowing they couldn't make the transit?

My ultimate boss puts 90% on the broker, 10% on the carrier. What are your thoughts?

Thanks

Posted Sep 30, 2021, 4:20 PM UTC

823
JuststumblinaroundBroker/Associate•

Receiver won't unload until next week?

Why the fuck is this load hot then and needed a team?

I swear to god it's unreal how retarded big shippers are.

27
jonnyRocket16•

From what I’ve usually experienced, it’s hot until it’s not. Meaning if they miss a certain window then it doesn’t really matter how late it is after bc it’s already “late”. They then prioritize other hot loads that are within their window. If they do not do this then it causes a snowball effect and everything ends up late.

7
Roguebias•

Yeah it's dumb. Big business always right tho. They probably have reasons people like me can't understand. Lotsa math involved for their delivery requirements certainly. Next level planning!

1
sschlott72•

Shipper here- we run into this situation a lot shipping to distribution houses and big box store warehouses. The product is needed for their milk run trucks to their stores, restaurants, end user. The window to get it on the milk run truck is X. If you miss it, you are screwed and end up having to overnight product directly to the end user, which can be thousands. So yeh, you hire a team for a hot load. You stress the importance of meeting a delivery appt. And then this happens and you are stuck paying layover or storage until they have an appointment. Sometimes we can get the buyer to intervene and get us an earlier unload time, but for some of the distribution warehouses nothing will work. (for what it's worth we do the math and if they can't make it even with a team we don't pursue it- no point in trying if the math doesn't work)

1
lukerobiBroker/Carrier•

I'd honestly say this is 50/50 stupidity. Both should have known better.

24
InstahgatorBroker/Owner•

Shared fault for sure. Both the carrier and broker should have known if this was not realistic. Broker should have notified the client this was beyond means.

12
TheWastedYearz•

This 50/50

Everybody is a yes man when the money is right.

5
JoeDeertaBroker/Carrier•

A truck would have to average about 70mph for 17hrs straight getting loaded instantly and never stopping for anything to make that 0700 appt. It was doomed from the start. Brokers have to know this stuff regardless of what a team says.

9
The_NightbringerBroker/Carrier•

Carrier committed to the delivery window. Broker was silly for giving it to someone who probably couldn't make it, but ultimately the carrier agrees to a contract and that contract included the delivery time, if they didn't think they could make it they should have rejected the rate con. I would say 30% Broker for being a bit dumb and 70% on the carrier for trying to pull their usual BS.

​

Carriers consistently will take loads where they can't make the apt assuming they will get worked in or that the shipper/receiver will bend so they can get the product. Always funny to see this backfire on them.

8
BackWithAVenganceBroker/Associate•

Yerp - I always ask on tight runs - and make sure it's an added line on the rate sheet. "We spoke about you making this appt on time via phone, by signing this rate sheet you agree to the terms, and if you cannot make delivery, I cannot guarantee any additional payment"

5
Auquaholic•

Your boss is correct. The broker should have said no. Instead, he would have had to have lied to carrier to make this pick up happen. Carrier was probably told to hurry up and get there, they'll be worked in at reciever. Broker, at that point, should have at least (after lying) been working on a new delivery time from the get go. The team did a good job on their time for the broker. Now a team truck will lose tons of money sitting.

5
Nommo917•

Broker, def... you are the middle man for these exact reasons, and ultimately the blame falls on u and your company's reputation for not knowing ur ishh or not knowing the carriers

5
packattack3000OP•

I like the way you put that. Thank you.

4
mindsc2•

In terms of best practices, a broker can't rely on a carrier to be honest and accurate. They often are, but you can't rely on it. You need to use your brain to make judgment calls. Sounds like the broker just felt like he/she had plausible deniability of fault and that's a pretty fucked up way of doing your job. "Carrier said they can do it, who am I to say they can't?" If you book that load with that carrier on that timeline, from a brokerage perspective it is nearly 100% the fault of the broker. Carriers will say whatever they have to win the load they want - once the load is on their truck, they are most likely going to get paid for it. All the bullshit that can happen prior to delivery is irrelevant at that point, so there's minimal incentive to be honest. If I booked that load, my CEO and manager would be all over me asking why I booked with that carrier. If it endangered the relationship with the customer, I'd probably lose my job.

At the same time, account reps need to be honest and manage their customers' expectations. If they want something that's impossible, you need to be up front about it. You shouldn't even accept that tender if you know it's impossible, unless it's with a giant caveat that it may not make timely delivery.

So yeah, from brokerage perspective, 90% broker, 10% account rep fault. Carriers gonna do their thing; you can't rely on them to be intelligent, accurate, or honest. To expect all of that is just being naive.

4
ScallyWag-IdiotBroker/Associate•

Fault of the Broker.. especially knowing the risk of receiver not being so accommodating.

3
SnarkstoomuchBroker/Associate•

Surely you’ve met a carrier who tells you that, right? Ownness falls on the broker not telling the customer that it’s impossible.

3
TzeentschCarrier Dispatcher•

Carrier for booking stupid loads to win stupid prices, there are a lot of loads posted that are literally impossible to make due to appointments and brokers usually get very angry and tell me that my driver doesn't know his job when I tell them that 700 mile run for solo evening pick morning delivery is BS. Even more angry when shipper takes their sweet time loading the truck and when after putting the first pallet my driver tells to unload all that crap back because after 4 hours chilling at the loading dock our delivery appointment is impossible.
And broker because average driving speed is 55 miles per hour, average loading speed is 2hours, so safe ETA for this load is 2pm next day if receiver is in the same time zone. Who schedules crap like that, just do the simple math, and if "it's only appointments they had" then work it out with the shipper, roll to the next week. But honestly I have a feeling that this load was for a solo, then was rolled next and you just found a team around noon for strict appointment. Boss is yelling and you go to reddit to get some mental support. Look for a crossdock

3
TzeentschCarrier Dispatcher•

Sorry I'm not trying to be rude, just the thing is that you failed the customer, who is probably the shipper and they expected top notch impossible service, it's your job to do the math, not them. And carrier failed to deliver the service to you because dispatcher probably thought same as you, that team can fly through traffic, there are no 30 minute breaks and other stuff, infinite fuel. Instead of thinking who's fault is it try to resolve it and find a way out with the carrier and the customer involved.

2
packattack3000OP•

Thank you for your response, all of this is already done and over with. Just interested in seeing the differing opinions from carriers and brokers in this situation. Load was for a solo, carrier just happened to have a team and said they could make the already set appts instead of pushing them back. Bad all around, but definitely more so on the broker for allowing this to happen. It is his/our customer at the end of the day.

2
TzeentschCarrier Dispatcher•

You're welcome, stuff like that happens, sometimes big distributing centers can even cancel delivery appointments when the truck is loaded and en route without giving a new one and telling anyone about it.

2
stjhnstvCarrier Dispatcher•

I agree with those saying it’s 50/50 or damn near. As a carrier, I never over commit. Why would I? All it does is damage relationships. No, we’re not 100% on time, but when we are late it’s legitimately due to something beyond our control and/or unforeseen. Poor planning is just not ok with us.

2
Insertrelevantjoke•

Feels 50/50... The carrier should have never taken the load; but customers pay brokers to weed moron carriers like this out. Kinda the point in having a middleman.

2
[deleted]•

[deleted]

2
[deleted]•

Doesn’t matter, pay the trucker a fair rate for layover and bill your customer

1