Source
r/nfl•
LittleKnown

Isn't it kind of stupid to judge some of these picks on highlight reels?

I'm looking at highlight reels of some of the Ravens picks here, like Bernard Pierce out of Temple and Christian Thompson from SC State, and they're playing against scrub teams almost exclusively. I know it's not the fault of the player, but is it really that impressive to see them run circles around opponents far beneath them in skill?

I'm by no means an expert on college football, but it seems to me like the skill gap is wide enough that it makes evaluating players based on highlights. Is there just no alternative?

Posted Apr 29, 2012, 5:18 PM UTC

6268
TheMolecularMan49ers•

Isn't it kind of stupid to judge some of these picks on highlight reels?

Nice try, Dontari Poe.

32
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Your breaking the hearts of KC fans, they're convinced he's the piece of the puzzle that returns them to glory. And we all know Romeo Crennel has had a great history with his hand-picked players.

/s

4
IamadoctorChiefs•

No, we aren't. Only 35% of us approve of the pick. I approve (in Crennel we trust), but I'm skeptical and have made sure to not get my hopes up.

2
jmedRaiders•

I can't blame you guys. I can't say for sure how they've turned out since I don't follow the team that closely but I haven't heard much about Glenn Dorsey or Tyson Jackson recently.

1
brodhenChiefs•

Dorsey and Jackson were probably drafted too high, but they were positions of desperate need at the time. They are both really good against the run (Jackson is rated #1 at his position against the run), but haven't made the attention grabbing stats like sacks to warrant a lot of attention.

1
IamadoctorChiefs•

Isn't it kind of stupid to judge some of these picks on anything but combine numbers?

A boy can dream, can't he?

1
KeepSwingingEagles•

Yeah, obviously the highlight reels are misleading because you're only seeing the good. Try typing in " (insert player's name) vs" on youtube and see what you get. A lot of great amateur scouts will cut up all of a players film from a certain game and slap it together as a video. This will give you a better chance to see how they play.

28
RemnantsVikings•

This is the best advice. They are the only ones that I use to form an opinion about a guy.

8
[deleted]•

[deleted]

2
ZoneBone•

And even that doesn't really mean much. If it did, Ryan Leafs wouldn't exist.

1
IamLevenJets•

What about a punter highlight reel? YearoftheKicker

21
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Oakland just signed an UDFA punter to a 3-year deal. Avg. of 60 yards, long of 80, runs a 4.6s 40-yard dash.

No joke.

18
Honey_OtterEagles•

The fuck do you need another punter for?

23
LittleKnownOPRavens•

Insert joke about Al Davis and a fast 40 time.

24
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Because Lechler has a $6m cap hit, this guy is more athletic than the WR we got out of Arizona, and he has just as much of a leg.

So when that raggedy-ass offense stalls on drives, we can boom it to the other end of the field, run fake punts (he played WR coming into college), and pay about $5m less than the current rate.

Assuming that's what McKenzie plans to do by signing this guy, I doubt he's there just for competition with Shane.

7
Jumbotron9001Jets•

Hey, we need a punter. Stop hogging them!

8
minkus962Bills•

And you now understand the love that Buffalo has for Moorman.

1
tsaihiBrowns•

Why the fuck did oakland offer $6 million/year to a punter in the first place?

1
axel404Steelers•

raggedy ass offense? Your offense wasn't your problem from last year if I remember right

1
key_lime_piePatriots•

It's part of a dynamic new two-punter formation that will leave return teams scrambling for a solution. How can they return a punt WHEN THEY DON'T KNOW WHO IS KICKING THE BALL?!? Also, the chances of a fake punt are now DOUBLE with TWO punters!

1
nicevilleCowboys•

PUNTERS ARE PEOPLE TOO!

2
elfonziSeahawks•

Punter 40 times are now relevent.

10
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Honestly, I'm excited, I hope we can see him get some punts in the preseason. Not just because he could pull of a fake punt run better than the average special teamer, but I was watching a video where he was consistently hitting 60-yarders with 5.1-5.4 seconds of hang time.

Which raises the question- can a Raider go 60 yards in 5-ish seconds? Depending on if Coach Allen uses guys that Davis picked, absolutely.

4
MigratedCoconutBears•

Breaking news from Oakland. DHB becomes super star special teamer. Said one AFC South special teamer from an unnamed team, "He just... came out of nowhere. I was going back, back, back... then the lights went out."

3
[deleted]•

[deleted]

3
TheLoneHollerer49ers•

I'm surprised he would even want to sign with Oakland. Why not another team without a pro bowl punter?

2
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Who knows? But based on what I've seen, I'm coming around to the idea of Marquette replacing Shane. He offers everything that Shane does plus he's agile and will come at a way lower price.

2
TheLoneHollerer49ers•

Yeah from what you say he sounds like a hell of a prospect.

2
[deleted]•

he's faster than brady was

2
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Yeah, but that's like 85% of the league, minimum.

2
rmw6190Patriots•

punters are people too

3
CharlottesWebsterNFL•

HE'S NOT A PUNTER, HE'S A WEAPON!!!!

2
[deleted]•

Oh absolutely. More than half of these "great" draft picks will not pan out

17
[deleted]•

[deleted]

8
MeatzaManCowboys•

I would prefer to see a highlight reel of the mistakes they make. This would let you know if they are capable of fixing them or if they are who they are.

8
eyeciteFalcons•

I'm not sure who was doing them, but last year there were a lot of videos that had highlights and lowlights which were good to watch.

1
WeaponexTEagles•

yes but don't ruin my rosterbating.

5
gthec9909Dolphins•

Sometimes, you can find footage on Youtube of every play a certain player was involved in in a certain game. This is how I judge new players.

Here's one of the Dolphins new Wide Receiver B.J. Cunningham. It shows his drops as well as his catches.

Edit:

Here's the video, I'm a twat. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZRnpk5RIEY

4
rasherdkEagles•

... where?

10
StabbyMangoCowboys•

Do (Player) vs _____ It should auto complete to a game or just search and it'll bring up games.

Since I know you want to see some Cox plugging up the middle,

Fletcher Cox vs Alabama 2011

3
bytor_2112Panthers•

Cox plugging up a hole? NSFW TAG PLEASE

14
gthec9909Dolphins•

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZRnpk5RIEY

1
PresidentJonStewartBears•

Sure. Unless your guy dominates Obama's secondary in those highlight reels.

4
StabbyMangoCowboys•

wat.

12
PresidentJonStewartBears•

I meant to say Alabama (in reference to Alshon Jeffery), but I guess I just brainfarted. I'll leave it in and go down with the ship for shits and giggles.

22
Bronan_the_BrobarianChargers•

I'd like to dominate that secondary, if you know what I mean.

4
SpayorneuteryourkidsCowboys•

I do know what you mean. I wish I didn't.

1
elfonziSeahawks•

Yep it makes you think poe actually did anything as a player, oh wait most of his highlight reels are of the combine anyways.

4
[deleted]•

The highlight films show what they are capable at their best, you have to weigh that agains't their "lowlights" and their average plays also. They show highlights during the draft because, why shit on someone on draft day?

3
NeckwreckerJets•

I'm not sure what your point is. Who exactly is making any meaningful evaluations based on highlights?

3
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Homers, homers everywhere

3
NeckwreckerJets•

I said meaningful evaluations... as in consequential ones.

2
GaggleofgeeseRaiders•

Oh, well then I would say the Dolphins' FO spent too much time watching Gucci Mane-accompanied YouTube videos of Ryan Tannehill. Couldn't be anything else.

2
NeckwreckerJets•

They were actually doing research for bringing Gucci Mane on board as another celebrity part-owner, they just sort of stumbled across Tannehill.

3
dudleymooresboozeTitans•

Why? Mel Kiper has made a damned good living doing just that.

2
s_sBrowns•

"Tremendous athlete"

2
dudleymooresboozeTitans•

"A real reach here. I didn't have him on my Big Board (tm) until round 3. And fuck the entire staff of a major professional football franchise, I'm right despite all past evidence to the contrary."

3
df1Steelers•

NFL coaching staffs watch much more tape than just the highlight reels and put more importance on the tape than on Combine stats. At least that is the Steelers way.

1
redcthulhuRavens•

We've had success with one Bernard, might as well go for another one. I think Thompson is gonna be solid, and of course Upshaw is gonna dominate. He has the "learning" mentality already, and the best teachers from Sizzle, Ngata, and Lewis. In Ozzie we trust.

1
jonny_lubePatriots•

I actually do find it somewhat reasonable to judge a pick on their highlight real. The real shows the ceiling of the player, what they have to offer if everything turns out well.

The best example in recent memory for me was the 2008 draft. I looked at Derrick Harvey's reel and saw a guy who was just barely making these sacks. Shoe-string sack here, arm pull-down there... frankly, he never looked dominating. I instantly lost faith that he would be anything. On the other hand, Jerod Mayo, whose pick confused the hell out of me, won me over instantly with his reel of hard hits, patience and general domination during those given plays.

This year I looked at Bruce Irvin and saw a guy whose only move seemed to be to sprint around the tackle. If the best your highlights have to offer is the same move being used (and a move that just won't fly in the NFL most of the time), I am inclined to call out bust.

With the Pats picks, Hightower's play was instinctive and flat-out brutally physical. Every one of those highlight plays was Hightower imposing his will and being the best player on the field. If that is his potential, he and Spikes make for one of the most physically imposing LB tandems in the NFL. Chandler Jones' highlights offered me more of a mixed bag. On one hand, that first move is unbelievable. He has a tremendous arsenal of moves and will choose the right one, execute it and disengage from the defender before the defender knows what hit him. On the other hand, he consistently hesitated, broke his stride with stutter steps when he had a clear line on the QB/ball carrier. If those are his highlights, I can't help but worry that his hesitation will consistently make him a split second too late to the play. While it is a correctable problem, and that initial burst is tantalizing. That said, while I see an infinitely high ceiling, the fact that there is such an obvious flaw with his play at it's best suggests that without hard work and change, he risks being another Jermaine Cunningham (rookie year, not his disappearing act in his sophomore campaign). Always just barely missing that sack.

tl;dr: Yes it's more important to see the full body of a players work than them at their best, but "their best" can give you insight as to their ceilings as well as potentially game-busting flaws.

1