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r/startrek•
Welmark

Downer endings in Star Trek

This will contain TOS spoilers - most of you have probably either watched it or don't care for it, but I figured I'd let you know nonetheless.

I'm finishing up TOS, and just watched the Season 2 Episode 19 'A Private Little War' (I caught Season 3 when it was on TV a while ago, and then worked my way back around with the DVDs).

I've also watched all of Voyager and half of TNG - obviously very few episodes have downer endings, even moreso with TOS.

A Private Little War might be one of my top five TOS episodes, just because of the way it dealt with the idea that there was no 'right' solution. The part with McCoy preaching to Kirk about how wrong he is to give the 'Hill People' flintlocks was great.

This stood out to me as it's probably the only thing where nothing is resolved - even in The City on the Edge of Forever, with its downer ending, the timeline gets restored.

Haven't watched any DS9 yet, but from what I've heard it'll have its share of downer endings.

Anybody have any thoughts on this?

Posted May 23, 2012, 11:20 PM UTC

624
railfanespee•

I'd say that VOY:"Course: Oblivion" qualifies as a downer ending. It's the one where the crew of the Silver Blood copy of Voyager (from the episode "Demon") discover they are not the "real" voyager when the ship and their bodies begin to degrade. Upon discovering their true identity they try to make it back to the demon planet before they fall apart. At one point, with only a few crew members left alive and the ship crippled, they come within range of another ship, the real Voyager, which has picked up their distress call. They try to hail them, but can't get a message through, and shortly thereafter the ship is destroyed by a failed warp core ejection. A little later, the real Voyager arrives on the scene and finds nothing but formless debris. They make a brief note of if in the ship's log, completely unaware that they came so close to discovering the fate of their doppelgangers Pretty dark, especially for Voyager.

9
eph798•

This episode is why I dislike Voyager. I adore this episode. Great pacing. Great tension-building. Interesting ideas were brought up, one even as a result of the stereotypical "shitty Janeway decision". Great character development--"Harry Kim" even gets the chance to step up to the plate and put on his big-boy trousers. And then the writers effectively hit the reset button in the last few minutes so that next week we return again to the status quo. Woo hoo.

1
UESPA_Sputnik•

How did the copied Voyager even manage to catch the real Voyager? The real Voyager found some shortcuts home between "Demon" and "Course: Oblivion". I remember that they used the Borg transwarp coil to cut off 15 years(!) off their journey in "Dark Frontier" and I'm pretty sure there was another shortcut (maybe in "Night"?).

Then again it's not exactly the episode's fault but a general ST:Voyager problem.

1
OpticalData•

Enhanced warp drive. I can't remember, but wasn't it said it would get them all the way to the Alpha Quadrant in 3 weeks?

Also, they probably found shortcuts of their own.

1
UESPA_Sputnik•

Narf. You're right, now I remember. Alright, I take back everything I said.

1
OpticalData•

The one thing that bugged me about this was they insisted on launching their probe.

Seriously, with the ships systems that buggered, I would of just pushed it out of the Shuttlebay.

1
Deceptitron•

I just had to say this post intrigued me into rewatching that TOS episode. I'm afraid I can't think of any episode off the top of my head (that hasn't already been mentioned) to contribute, but I have to agree with you that "A Private Little War" was a really good episode and a treat to watch again. Thanks for this post.

3
fuzzy_dunnlop•

I'd say TNG had plenty. I remember several endings where I just sort of sat there like "What? THAT WAS IT!?"

Not knocking them, they usually worked out. Some were just depressing though, like the one that focuses on the lower ranking ensigns where the chick just dies at the end....talk about a downer.

2
evirdrevo•

That episode only worked because you got emotionally attached to her, her relation with worf. If she hadnt died in the end there wouldnt have been a point in making the episode. The scene where Worf gets forced to sit with the other ensigns in the end brought a tear to my eye :') Still take my upvote, I like to see different oppinions out here.

1
osmedex•

The Ensigns of command.

0
maybelying•

Lower Decks

6
osmedex•

You are right. I got them mixed up.

1
Omaromar•

I was rooting for the Sheliak.

2
osmedex•

I like the Sheliak. Mostly because they frustrate Riker.

1
eph798•

I'd argue TOS: "Requiem for Methuselah" is even more of a downer, perhaps even a little bit more than "The City on the Edge of Forever". (I'll try to speak in generalities to avoid spoilers.) The ending of "Requiem" is beautiful, especially in that the ending was a tender character developing moment in the friendship of the two we see on screen. But the fact that it was necessary--that the events of the episode emotionally destroyed one of the two characters--is such a huge downer. And the nature of the remedy itself is absolutely heart-breaking. (If you've seen the episode, you might make the connections. If not, just enjoy this hauntingly beautiful song.)

2
WelmarkOP•

That's a good one too, I hadn't remembered the ending until you mentioned it.

1
BromanBrolanski•

In The Pale Moonlight- best episode of anything, end of story.

also Ashes to Ashes on Voyager really bummed me out.

1
Deceptitron•

I'm not sure if "In the Pale Moonlight" is really that much of a downer episode. A positive outcome is reached in bringing the Romulans into the war as allies and the only thing that is really lost is a Romulan senator we don't really care about and Sisko's personal integrity (which he decided not to care about in the end anyway). "City on the Edge of Forever" was also mentioned as having a downer ending but a positive outcome. "A Private Little War" really had no positive outcome whatsoever.

3
BromanBrolanski•

i don't think sisko decided not to care about losing his integrity. i think the inflection on the way he repeats "i can live with it." and even his whole body language throughout that last scene seem to express the opposite.

1
Deceptitron•

That scene has been interpreted a number of ways. Some people say he's trying to convince himself. I've also seen people say that he's coming to terms with a darker part of himself that realizes he really can "live with it". He doesn't have to learn to do so. Like it's not really an issue for him after all.

I rewatched the scene and could see either interpretation. In any case though, even he admitted "a guilty conscience is a small price to pay for the safety of the Alpha Quadrant" so it's not that big of a loss in the grand scheme of things.

2
maybelying•

I know it's not relevant to the various TV series, but I'd say that even compared to all of them, Wrath of Kahn still had the most cataclysmically downer ending I've seen. Completely shattered my adolescent psyche.

I remember there was a comedian that said there were only two movie scenes where it was acceptable for a dude to cry: Sonny dying in the Godfather, and Spock dying in Wrath of Kahn. Not ashamed to say I did for both.

1
Omaromar•

Star Trek: ENT Season 2 Episode 26 The Expanse coming out 2 years and a half after 9/11 very downer of an episode.

1
Glenn_From_Perch•

I would say that every episode of Voyager has a "down ending". They are still stranded.

1
OpticalData•

They never even make it into Earth orbit.

2