This hero is literally miserable to play against, you can't harass him because that gives him insane damage with which he'll just 100-0 you under tower, and you can't outlasthit him because he has ridiculous str gain.
what kind of a hero doesn't allow you to last hit or harass him ?
Posted Apr 25, 2022, 12:04 AM UTC
onsluaght and trample combo feels like getting hit by the bus and the bus comming back for round 2
The problem is tge damage that's it. No single hero can bring you from 100 % hp to 0% hp in 4 seconds alone.
Some heroes can do it in a long time. Like Bristleback or sky but he needs like 15 seconds for that. Enough time for teammates to react or TP out
I don't mind being punished when out of position. And loose half my hp pool or my whole hp pool if the enemy is timing their stuns perfect.
But if a hero can bring up 700 damage in a time of 3-4 seconds within the first 10 min. That is completly dumb.
Complete madman kombo... inkswell + primal beast.
[deleted]
This is the right move. If you show past level 4 you’re just straight up dead on most heroes. The carry needs to gear up to jungle ASAP, and leave a pos 5 that can shove waves and hug tower, or just avoid interacting with PB altogether.
[deleted]
I find the best 5 matchups against pb are actually heroes that have high hp pools, or saves. It makes the cost-benefit of diving them not as rewarding, if you're not sure you can 1 combo them and get out cleanly.
These heroes also get to a point where they no longer get 1-combo'd, due to item builds or just natural hero scaling, which pb also hates.
Counter intuitively, supports with stuns are often awful matchups against pb, because these heroes typically are the most fragile. If you get charged from out of vision, there's simply no way to avoid getting 1 combo'd.
The problem is the damage that's it. No single hero can bring you from 100 % hp to 0% hp in 4 seconds alone.
Juggernaut
I hope Primal Beast doesn't get nerfed tbh. Safe lane players can get fucked after offlaners have had to suffer Jugg for so long
Does Juggernaut have a 2000 range charge at level 1 though? If you walk into Jugg's spin early game, it's pretty much your fault.
Can deal up to 450/575/700/825 damage to a single unit
thats from the wiki, those numbers are without taking 25% magic res in to consideration. so lvl 3 jugg for example deals around 450dmg which is nowhere near killing a normal STR offlaner (with only one spell, im not talking about right clicks)
meanwhile primal does like 2x that dmg at lvl 1...
PA would like a word.
sincerely someone who constantly gets oneshotted via dagger.
Edit: Yeah that PA comment was aimed for this sentence:
The problem is tge damage that's it. No single hero can bring you from 100 % hp to 0% hp in 4 seconds alone.
In lane?
After she gets 6, yup.
tales from herald
Coup de Grace is a 200% crit at level 1, so I don’t think it’s going to 1 shot a full HP support.
What do you have 200 hp total?
When I tell people what "nonsensical" means, i will direct them to this comment
As a support player I enjoy shadow demon against primal beast in Lane. You can use Disruption on him in Trample and get away far enough during the duration.
Clock is also good, he can trample in cogs but the rest of his animations are cancelled by battery assault, even his auto
SD also counters him hard on his bkb timing as purge completely recks his damage
There are so many supports that can stop him in lane.
He pretty much holds your spells hostage. Say you are Shadow Demon, you think oh he can't do much cause I can disrupt him. Then he just never uses trample, but you can't ever disrupt him either because if you do then he just tramples and kills you. That sounds like a good trade for him. I would love to have a lane where the pos 5 never cast their spells on me. Plus anything you do to him will give him stacks.
Can't you just hold disrupt and spam your other ability on him getting stacks? Surely that would zone hin?
You’re ignoring the presence of the pos 4. At some point you might get forced to use it on them instead but you can’t cause then you don’t have anti trample anymore.
The Problem isnt Trample though, trample kills you once e is stacked, but e doesnt allow you to lane against him. He has 90 base damage Level 1 meaning hell out cs any hero if not harrased, e means if you harras He has 130 damage and 20 armor resulting in you having to leave the creeps until it runs out. Even if trample wouldnt exist He would win most lanes, of course He would have no kill threat but thats not the point. You literally need Oracle to purge his e if you ever consider winning a lane against him
Isn't he very underwhelming past mid game?
Good luck getting to late game having your safelane utterly and completely raped.
In a vacuum, the current version of Primal Beast does fall off quite hard late, but it is extremely difficult to offset the advantage he gets from laning and early game. He has 60% on dota pro tracker from offlane.
He's been holding 57%+ winrate on dota2protracker THE WHOLE TIME. (i check it every now and then) while also getting picked 2900-3000 times per 8 days.(always in top3 by popularity) In 7k+ average mmr games.
Keep in mind that fast win drafts are popular and more feasible the higher you go in MMR and PB is a hero that is very strong for the first 15-20 minutes. With teams starting to 5 man very early sometimes even before the 2nd cart and push heroes also being strong, it's no surprise that an overtuned lane destroyer with a gigantic damage output is crushing face
Edit: I think his design intent is to do a lot of damage really fast then do nothing for 20 seconds. I don't think this will go away, but his damage is too high.
[deleted]
I've played him 11 times as a Pos 1 now. I've won 9. As long as the enemy does not have AA or stacks multiple healing reduction items, the 50% spell life steal talent makes you literally invincible with radiance. I usually go double bracer, Kaya sange, BKB, radiance, heart. If the enemy has high magic damage I slide in a hood at some point. At level 25 it is almost impossible to die. This hero scales very very well if you want him to. That being said his damage is on a decently long Cooldown, so I recommend picking him with a scaling mid, like ember, storm, TA, etc.
How is his damage on a long cooldown? His only real cooldown is BKB. His spells are all at 25s cooldown range. I mean sure that means he only casts once or at most twice in a single teamfight, but then the enemy also can't ever play around your cooldowns like how they would play around Chrono or Epi. You're literally always ready for a teamfight.
What I meant was that the moment your press trample and they counter with BKB you don't do anything for 20s in a teamfight. So it's nice, but not necessary, to have a mid that can scales and does consistent damage.
Not really, he scales pretty well damage wise, has good mobility, and good CC.
I mean, hes not like a melee Medusa or something, but he scales pretty well. Not insane, but decently.
Don’t worry he goes from god tier early to merely above average late game
Just all the more reason to pick tiny every game for free mmr
Edit: it was sarcasm guys, primal with a blink and bkb doesn’t fall off that hard late game because he has instant catch and free backlined access
Nah man u wrong, u just need bkb refresher on him, and he gives u a 5 sec/10 with refresher disable aoe stun in late game
I play in a bracket where late game does not really happen, so do i have to keep suffering because of that hero? And enemy primal wont let you play past 30 minutes and just when he becomes weaker their carry will come for round 2.
The laning phase and like 10-15 minute farm fest matters a lot rn lol
Agree. Primal is stupidly strong early for no reason.
Pb is trash late game. That's why.
Oracle @_@/ (maybe viper)
[deleted]
I swear valve has only one concept on creating heros: make him a str hero + tanky + shit ton of damage
You forgot mobility spells that can go through objects and across the half map
I have about 50 games on the offlane with him now. All i can say is that shadow demon, oracle and dark willow feels really strong against him.
Pick Viper like the rest of us
[deleted]
[deleted]
haven't played dotes in ages, but is there no way to outpick him?
Does oracle's buff removing spell works on him? Jug has a 50% win rate against him, so I suppose he can use spin when PB tramples. Huskar also has a positive win rate against PB and should easily win over PB in lane.
[deleted]
If it weren for the fact that jugg is utter trash.
Naix works good for me. Like jugg you just use magic immunity when he initiates you. And you can trade okayish with him..
Yep. Naix, Jug and Huskar seem to have the highest win rates against PB. And as a support I think Oracle should make life very hard for him.
in a mid matchup Leshrac dumpsters him. One lightning storm + lesh’s movespeed and PB is a sad boy.
It could go both ways TBH. Lesh is pretty squishy in the laning phase and he has no way of stopping the charge. Lesh could easily die to him if he gets uproar stacks.
what kind of a hero doesn't allow you to last hit or harass him?
Juggernaut?
I shaman his shiz, not even once do i get scared.
Undying?
Even undying gets trampled tbh, you need to play the lane very carefully because you cant escape or stun him if he ever gets in range
Clockwerk is good at keeping him at bay.
Omni can make the beast feel useless if he maxes heavenly grace and uses it on the target that gets harassed
And ogre straight up denies him from ever harassing you
No, its actually nice to have lane dominators. Just like its absolute ass to play against viper with a lot of heroes.
If you are someone like juggernaut/lifestealer, you just ignore or kill him if he goes for you, simmilarly you can turn on him with dazzle, or just ignore his go with shadow demon. As long as there are ways to counter play it im fine with him being strong.
Primal beast absolutely rapes jugg
Oh is that why dotabuff is giving primal a disadvantage vs him? Odd, trully odd.
Also for a lane dominator like primal beast, partners are giga important. So if you stack someone like jugg who is already decent vs primal beast with a support that is also decent vs him its a pretty easy lane.
Neither Jugg or Dazzle is favored against Primal Beast on D2PT, both are slightly worse than average. Jug doesn't get picked much either because Primal gets first phased a lot and carries don't pick Jug into that.
Have you ever played the matchup?
Jugg vs primal beast one? Only with primal on my team and it was 50/50. Then again in one game the jugg seemed to be tilted from before since he ended up going for glimmer forcestaff...
So i wouldn't say that beast is some miracle vs jugg.
Jugg is dogshit hero for real, i almost cried because of its damage output. And when his blade fury wears off everybody is ready to jump you, miserable carry hero.
But isnt the magic immun. Ez vs trample. Also maybe omni 5 ?
Thats why i listed jugg and ls, both can go magic immune and punish his trample or just ignore it.
Not sure about omni 5, probably won't do enough and would get bullied by the other laner too much. Also heroes like Mars as well counters him well both by spearing him away, or rebuking him away and slowing him, Oracle is really good vs him too, but then you have to be a good oracle.
I said it because many here downvote you or say they are weak against him. Just would like to know why they think theyre weak against him
Not until the arcana is released.
battlepass level 650 arcana*