Source
r/allthingsprotoss•
ddlbb

PvZ - Mid Game (10-15 min mark)

[PvZ]

I am having issues as a Protoss in PvZ. I am actually a Zerg, but have worked my Protoss play into gold / close to plat 1v1.

My usual play is pretty standard - but I get rocked mid game, every time, when zerg goes roach / hydra / corruptor. Here's the usual play -

  • FFE
  • Stargate expand, 3 phoenix out to deter muta / scout / kill overlords
  • quickly into robo / tech into Colo
  • get +2 attack
  • At about the 12 min mark I try to take my third, usually with 1-2 colossus. This sometimes works.
  • If 3rd base looks unlikely, I go 2 base all in.
  • At this point we hit ~14-16 min mark. Zerg has Roach / Hydra / Corruptor mass, and my 4 isn colossus are useless. Roach + Hydra > Gateway units.

What I am finding is that Colossus are easily countered. I have read about other styles - heavy void ray for one, some Day9 stuff (but most was over a year old). I wanted to hear from others who have had this problem. Any builds to recommend? I am not the biggest fan of storm, but would storm without colossus be a good option? Then I fear early muta eating me alive.

Posted Jul 27, 2014, 8:40 AM UTC

27
bgbnbigben•

If you're taking your third by 12 minutes and dealing no worker damage, you should basically be economically dead -- Zerg is going to sit on 3 bases for as long as they want (to your two) and then when they see you expand they can take the rest of the map. You either need to do serious damage with the phoenix -- force attacking units, spores, queens, anything but drones -- or try to trick them into overcommitting to hydra (at which point you build a few sentries, a colossus or two and laugh as your giant lasers of death lay waste to the squishy hydra).

If you want a new build, anything that hits a +2 blink attack near 10 minutes is what you want to aim for -- this can pin the zerg back, let you snipe bases, etc.. See, for instance, u/JayPowerSC2's sick miniguide from a few days ago here.

For more general advice, your phoenix should allow you to react to the zerg. Are they droning like a madman? Make a few gateway units and kill them. Are they looking to 2-base roach all in? Build a void ray or three. Throwing down a hydra den? Put down your robo, expand, etc.. -- try to use the Phoenix to scout and allow you to get your game sense on.

Hope this helps a little!

3
ddlbbOP•

Thank you this is great

1
StacksOfRax•

Blink?

1
ddlbbOP•

From the replies it looks like I need to focus more on blink in general

1
SupplyKing•

Hi, i've been using FFE into Phoenix into Colossus since the past few days, and this is what i learn from my experience :

-You have to get at least 4 phoenix to be able to pick up queen with only 1 lift.

-You can fake phenix with the stargate and go for 1 phenix (to kill overlord/scout) and force 2 spores on each base and then get 1/2 voidray. (With this you can easily take an earlier 3rd at like 9:00ish)

-Take a earlier 3rd against lings play (Fast double Evo) and simcity 2/3 cannons

-You can't really be agressive, if you choose to allin you'll have really bad time since the zerg will already have Hydra and if he scout a late 3rd he'll have a spire ready. If you really want to all in i suggest you the 2/2/2 all in (2 nexus 2 immo 2 Colossus you can find it easily on TL)

-You really need to get drones kill with your phoenix if you don't want to fall behind (pro usually get 10/15+ drone kill)

-The army composition you aim is Colossus/Blink Stalker/few sentry and then when your +2/blink finish you can start being agressive on the map

-You want to scout with your phoenix the zerg's answer to colossus -> Corruptor or Vypers (you'll need HT for this one, so you will stop stalker production to be able to get few HT right after the TA finish). Either if he goes Mutas or Swarmhost. Sometimes zerg will be very greedy (take double expand want you take your 3rd) and there nothing you can do against this...

Sorry for my bad english i hope it will help you :)

0
ddlbbOP•

Thank you. Can you explain how the blink stalker (vs. regular stalker) come into this? What makes them better besides harass?

1
TMKirA•

they are good against a lot of things, if being microed, and they are the buffer when you get phoenixes if the zerg goes muta. And if you ever see swarmhost, get a fast 3rd, blink stalker and drop 2nd robo, go up to 8-10 colossus and mass blink, you'll rekt the swarmhost player.

1