Source
r/edmproduction•
10weight

I spend too long worrying about individual synth sounds so tried leaving it until last.

I found myself spending 30-45 mins listening to different patches and tweaking them or trying to build something from scratch, then watching videos on how to do it as I was getting nowhere etc. At the end of each session I had accomplished very little in the way of having an actual track, or hook or even a loop...

To try something different I made a single bar drum loop then used the Init patch on the synth (beeeeeeeeep) so I could focus on the actual music and chord progressions.

Very quickly I had a reasonable outline for a track, it sounded like crappy chiptune but musically it made sense.

Going back to it and adding only presets made me realise that I was worrying way too much about individual drum hits and synth sounds etc.

Of course they are important but I found that deciding on them/teaking them/creating them is so much easier if in the context of a whole track.

I still don't have an awesome track but now I can see the endless fiddling and experimentation should be on the actual music... Sounds so obvious typing this but it was a real blocker for me.

TL:DR try making music first, then playing with sounds.

Posted May 25, 2015, 7:31 PM UTC

11633
johnnybigoode•

You know... in time you should start having some basic standard patches. Some specific timbres that indicated the direction you want to take with that particular sound. This will improve your whole workflow a lot.

While having a chiptune into real synths a good idea, sometimes there are dinamics or modultions that are part of the percussive nature of any kind of instruments, sometimes those sounds are more important than the actual melody.

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10weightOP•

Thanks, I can see how this is a great next step!

13
johnnybigoode•

If you really want this approach, I can tell you what I did:

Learn about history of synths and the basics of synths. Websites like http://www.vintagesynth.com/ have lists of these synths and their most important patches.

You obviously don't need all of those, but, for example, my main genre is deep house, I have the classics drum kits (909,808,707,606), some jazz plates drum collections (specially cymbals), several basic factory percussion (maracas, caxixis, congos), plus assorted MK2, Hammond and some other electromechanical patches, a Mr. Fingers bass patch, a simple sub bass, a few Juno pads, and some generic leads. Oh, and a shitty guitar synth to make some plucks when needed.

If you can identify the core sounds you need, you can have these standard synths that you can use when composing. Just google your favourite artist and find out what synth they use, get the patch, and when you move to production, tweak the patches -or change the whole thing for something else- so it's your sound, and not somebody elses.

On a side note, if you're also using simple percussion, I recommend buying a decent mic or a hand recorder (I use Tascan DR-40, it's great for recording ambient sounds to use as background in music, but it works to record some percussion) and then get some crappy ass things to record -egg shakers work like a charm-, this helps making your drums sound less mechanical and adds a massive layer of human groove to the track.

You should remember that you'll need some practice before recording percussion.

6
igorgue•

Thanks for this, really useful!

1
10weightOP•

Thanks!

1
RedzaDSAll the genres•

Dude yes. At least learn how to get a basic saw/square, mess with the ADSR and choose monophonic/portamento or a polyphonic sound.

1
markswags•

Track, then design, then mix, then master. Essentially get your ideas written down or make yourself a baseline or in other words a shell of your song. Then design your sounds, get your filters and automation and each tracks individual emotion written out. Then go through and do the technical work, your mixing, compression, EQ etc. Of course do your own thing. Often times I find myself completing these steps for each section of the song, but just like with film, your songs are a production. What goes on behind the curtain/camera/DAW is yours to fiddle with until the production is ready for the public's eyes.

21
umbringer•

I try to relegate the creative/productive/song writing in the morning after I wake up, and then at night worry about edits, synth timbres, tweaking knobs, sound libraries, tutorials and what have you.

Make yourself a really nice palette at night and then use it in the morning to write directly from your first muse.

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Ragnatronik•

This is clever, will be trying this.

2
imVINCEwww.soundcloud.com/shepherdsofsaturn•

Actually, you're more likely to demonstrate productive creative output when you're tired and drained; this is because the filtering and prioritization mechanisms used to focus your attention are drained and allow you to synthesis new ideas from your surroundings.

Source: I'm a neurophysiologist.

2
umbringer•

That's very interesting because that state is when I'm the least productive. When I'm tired and drained, I go to sleep or distract myself. When I wake up in the morning, however, I feel that I can draw directly from the muse of dreams and the sleep state. I am profoundly more creative first thing in the morning before I "wake up" and go about my day. What does neurophysiology say regarding post-sleep states? I'm fascinated. (I'll add that there is always a window of "letting-go-ness" that is required for creative flow to take hold, so it stands to reason that being tired would help.)

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imVINCEwww.soundcloud.com/shepherdsofsaturn•

Sleep reduces drowsiness and consolidates memory, immune function (which is similar to cortical/cognitive memory on a cellular level), emotional processing, and autonomic functioning. So really, when you wake up, you're ready to engage the world with maximal focus.

By contrast, creativity occurs- on a neurological level- when our neural systems start getting noisy. In general, creativity manifests when we begin to form new associations between ideas by cross-referencing patterns stored in disparate parts of our memory. In essence, creativity is the opposite of focus.

This is why LSD and other psychoactive compound are so powerful at inducing creativity: neural systems exhibit firing modes and states of excitability that allow you to easily generate new associations and ideas. The same mechanisms that add resolution to and distort the features of vision and sound apply to cognition.

Of course, each individual is different on genetic, cellular, anatomical, and behavioral levels (and likely others). So what works for you may not work for others, and vica-versa. But these are the fundamental principles. :o]

1
Andiazzzsoundcloud.com/andreas-j-official•

Agreed completely. This together with having a set of categorized sound banks + genre templates I've created myself where a set of tracks are named, grouped, color coded, routed to specific mixer channels etc is what have made the most difference to me.

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GabeMiller1soundcloud.com/gabemillermusic1•

I'll def have to try this sometime. Although many times I've had sounds inspire melodies, so there is a place for sound design first.

5
Deepseabobby•

Pendulum said in an interview once, he (Rob Swire) composed the entire album using one synth sound - for the exact reason you are.

(found link, under MUSIC section: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Swire)

I def agree with you. Saw a video of Avicii doing the same thing with piano then finding the synths after.

more focus on the music than just cool sounds

5
S4tterbrain•

SAVE TEMPLATES!!! My workflow became so much faster when i started doing this; organise them into folders (Leads, Bass, etc) That way you can switch between different templates until you find the perfect one for your track; you can keep a cool patch you've made if its on a track you're not happy with; you can separate sound design and songwriting times, etc. Seriously templates will change your life

5
samarco•

If you want to you can take this concept a little further. lets say you just finished a project, so now you can duplicate the entire project you have just finished, and then just build onto that or completely change what you did to create original ideas on the project you are now working on.

Edit: grammar

1
BIGJomomma•

I do this, and so does Flux Pavilion. He uses sine waves until he's happy with the chords and notes.

5
Geoff326•

Yup, I remember Flux Pavilion mentioning that in a youtube video. *saw waves

Here's the source with link to timestamp

https://youtu.be/lpiNCEwjGl4?t=7m52s

5
10weightOP•

Thanks

1
ZoeBladesoundcloud.com/zoeblade•

This is how I write almost all my tracks these days. If you write it as a chiptune first, you know the melodies and harmonies can't hide behind nice timbres, so you can really perfect them. Then you can play them on nice timbres, and hear the music really come to life.

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4rowawayUrl Updating...•

Draw/outline the picture before you colour it in. Metaphors are fun.

3
eedotensei•

Been there brother, I was very frustrated, had to close my DAW and return back to it only after few hours, and I did the same. I tok the most basic chord/pluck sound and focused on the melody. Then added few layers of synths, edited them and it sounded wonderful =)

2
Litex•

Another thing worth trying is composing with some pianos and strings first... Can be potentially a little more inspiring than init patches.

2
danceplaylovevibes•

i get a synth/pad sound i like and bounce it out to audio, save the patch if i wanna edit it later which more than often i dont. really helps with committing to a vibe and also workflow is increased dramatically. plus ive only got 4gb of ram, so this way my cpu doesnt half die with multiple vsts open.

2
arealzarkinfrood•

That's useful advice. You're right, it does seem obvious but even though I'm stagnating badly (haven't produced a finished product in over a year) I read these posts occasionally, and thinking about my situation I tend to do the same thing. By the time I've exhausted my tiny lifeless creative spark, all I've done is cycle through possible sounds without having an idea as to what I want to do. I'll have to try this next time, thanks OP.

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Runaway_5IS DEAD•

Good idea. I always get stuck in my sound design and need to focus on arrangement a lot more.

2
Real_American•

Yeah I just started this, maybe tweaking the ADSR but leaving the patch a normal sine. I think it's a good idea.

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10weightOP•

Very good idea, ta!

1
jvpitersovnd•

Yes. This, and this exactly. Far too easy to get caught in the twiddling and lose sight of the fundamentals.

1
DeltaHouseMusic•

We start 90% of our tracks with nothing but piano and saw waves. Very similar to what you said but as others users have mentioned it can give a little more direction to the song to have a mix of quick attack/short release sounds (piano) and slow attack/long release sounds (saws).

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Pagan-zawww.soundcloud.com/za-pagan•

I often use only a piano or only a sine to make all the different instruments. If you can make it sound good like that, then once you do the sound design the rest is easy.

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