Ukrainian's attitudes towards (some) world leaders
Posted Feb 12, 2016, 10:06 AM UTC
123255
Lithuania can into world leaders!
27
People generally don't like it when you invade a country illegally and face no real repercussions.
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And thanks Canada - whoever in charge now!
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That smug frenchie, right? He's hot.
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multi-pleonasm here.
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Yeah, everyone knows that if he's French he's smug.
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...hence the "multi"
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Uhoh, calling a Quebecer French is like calling a Bostonian Irish.
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The current year guy. He's pretty funny.
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The old member of parliament who hardly ever showed up for his job, rode of the coattails of his father and hailed for making campaign promises that our left wing party had already made a long time ago. His only good point is drive to bring more Syrian refugees to Canada.
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DUDE
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WEED
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trudoot trudoot
thank mr. dank weed man
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Andrzej Duda stronk.
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Not as stronk as Dalia Grybauskaitė
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We need to combine them both for a perfect 100% score.
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Commonwealth stronk!
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TIL her nickname is Steel Magnolia. That's pretty badass.
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It's so cute thinking that Duda is a world leader.
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Duda stronkest leader in the world! He crushes constitutional courts with his left hand and gives 500 PLN on every child with right one!
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mr. Pen in action
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Why on earth is David Cameron not included
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They already have the US, no need for redundancy
^* ^please ^ignore ^the ^Canadian ^flag
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How do you mean redundancy out of interest?
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He's suggesting the UK is just an American lackey that always votes the same way as them and has the same opinion.
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Said the Canadian.
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Excuse me?
1†
no need to excuse yourself, it's not your fault you were born british.
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France bringing the bantz
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fucking rekt
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That is fucking great.
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Oh god, this is turning into an anti UK circle jerk. All you continentals are just jealous my country is more prominent and powerful than yours :)
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Nope, I am pro EU
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Not my point
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You linked me a part of a video depicting how continental Europeans view the UK, shouting and hanging around the exit door (implying the exit door of the EU) without actually leaving.
I assumed that meant you imagine me as someone who is anti EU, whereas I am actually pro EU. If that's not your point then what is?
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Because this is about world leaders, not [obscure football players](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Cameron_(footballer\))
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Even more obscure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Cameron_%28footballer%29
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Perhaps the most obscure: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davie_Cameron
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because Britain lacks a strong foreign policy.
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Lack of a strong stance on Ukraine equals no foreign policy apparently. You know, because Ukraine = the world.
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Yes because Germany, Lithuania, Belarus, Poland and Kazakhstan all have such strong foreign policies ...
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in comparison to Britain? very much so. Come on man, Britain is becoming more insular in it's politics by the day.
Do you have any idea how much our president had to bitch about Russia in ukraine to get noticed by ukranians? a lot.
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David Cameron is a rather domestically focus PM yes, but that doesn't mean Britain lacks a strong foreign policy, certainly not so when you compare to the countries that I listed.
We will take the fight against ISIS as an example. Out of all these countries Britain is taking by far the most active and aggresive stance.
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wasn't she tweeting about russian spetnaz snipers in kiev?
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Nobody in the EU has a strong foreign policy.
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They actually do.
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because Britain lacks a strong foreign policy
This comment will generate discussion.
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it's like you're a psychic, but for things that already happened.
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Why would he be? Ukraine has nothing to do with the UK
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Ukraine has nothing to do with the UK
And here you go: Budapest Memorandum
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well, i bet cameron is depressed he's not in company with Lukasenko, Mutti and the rest of... who ever they are :)
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TBH, not many people would know the name of British PM. It's a wonder that they collected reliant data for Hollande, but maybe that's because France a presidential republic so the president is more clearly recognisable as a leader.
If people would try to associate British's foreign policy with a face, I fell like most people would choose the queen. I know it's stupid.
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It's actually not that stupid
The Queen is formally the head of state of the UK and as such the international representative of the UK. Also, while the British constitutional system is rather messed up, you can certainly argue that she actually is the ultimate (god-appointed) executive authority and merely delegated her responsibilities to the Parliament and the Prime Minister - all policy decisions are made in her name
So even if she has no or very little actual influence over the British foreign policy, it's not completely unwarranted to associate British foreign policy with her face
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[deleted]
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Is that the actual german flag?
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It's the "Dienstflagge der Bundesbehörden". Don't know the proper english translation. It's used by federal agencies (buildings,cars,press conferences). Only the federal agencies are allowed to use it. As ordinary football fan, you buy the ordinary three stripe flag of of germany without the Bundesschild.
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It's the coat of arms. The Bundesshild you linked seems to be yet a different thing and it's eagle surely hit the gym, wtf is up with that?
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The coat of arms doesn't go on any flags, the Bundesschild does.
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Only the federal agencies are allowed to use it.
Unfortunately, because it looks more badass imho.
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Now, now. You know you get all rowdy when you get the badass flags. Go play with something in a nice calming blue and yellow.
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If you look closer you'll see it's this unofficial flag with the Bundesadler, and not the Dienstflagge.
/nitpicking
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Ok. Might be that one. Can't tell because too much jpg.
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"Service flag of the national government" or something like that?
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Almost exactly that. Service Flag of the Federal Agencies.
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It's not the official one. The one they used includes the coat of arms, the actual German flag just looks like this.
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Everyone loves Mutti.
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Doesn't the Russian minority in Ukraine support Putin?
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Isn't that what the 10% is?
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Apparently "only" about 17% of Ukrainians are Russian speaking (I thought it would have been higher), so I guess you're right.
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Speaking Russian doesn't make you pro-Russia. I am Russian speaking.
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Yeah of course, but it is probably a lot more common. What I tried to say is that at first I thought the 10% seemed a bit low, but I googled the Russian minority in Ukraine and apparently it is a bit smaller than I thought so the 10% seems reasonable to me now.
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I'd imagine a fair few in the East of Ukraine aren't available to answer polls at the moment though.
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I really doubt the Russian speaking Ukrainians in Odessa and the like approve of Putin, so there's a big part of your 7%
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I'm pretty sure a lot more Ukrainians know Russian.
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I mean that according to wikipedia, 17% of Ukrainians identify as ethnic Russians.
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Most understand Russian due to Soviet Union. Exceptions - old people in very rural areas and etc.
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17% number is people who "ethnically self-identify as Russian".
Virtually everyone in Ukraine is bilingual though.
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I checked wikipedia too. Considering that many of those regions listed with a significant Russian population are now under rebel / Russian control, that percentage is definitely lower.
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[deleted]
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apparently not even in crimea or donbass. he will have to sattle with his fans among right wingers in western europe.
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I wonder why Hollande is relatively low compared to others western leaders.
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Because he is the most pro-Russian leader in Europe now, if you only consider large countries.
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Ending the Mistral warships sale is Pro-Russian?
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damned if you, damned if you don't...
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He was pretty much forced by external pressure to do so
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"forced?" if he didn't stop the sale it would have been done relatively quietly, and no nation would have done any retribution, as the sanctions weren't retroactive. once he interrupted it and tried to use it as a bargain chip, the international attention made it more delicate. could still have achieved the sale if he really wanted, though.
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I wonder why Hollande is relatively low compared to others western leaders.
I guess he makes less noise as a personality than others *shrugs* It's even partly why he got elected after Sarkozy i think
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For some reason, seeing the American flag backwards on the pole like that really makes me uncomfortable.
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Belarus and Kazakhstan as well
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French too
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Why the hell on earth anybody likes Nursultan Nazarbayev?
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[removed]
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Putin last.Never imagined him to be a single place above it.Maybe Kim Jong Un second last.
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What the fuck is up with this data presentation? What do these fractions represent? They don't add up to 100 and the scales seem off. And what happened to 2015?
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green - possitive view
red- negative view
missing - undecided/neutral
i thought it's rather self explanatory
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That makes sense but they should really display the undecided percentage as well in that case. And the irregular timescale between 2012 and 2016 is weird. Oh well.
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what about john mccain? i remember him givin speeches when crowds were charging against parlament. bit ungratefull.
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he's not a world leader...
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need to win President elections first.
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Fuck off Ukraine. Historically you've been a corrupt appendage to Russia, yet we've given you political support when then EU wouldn't (US sanctions went into effect before MH17), we've sent you military equipment, radars, vehicles, we've trained your military, that IMF kid gloves before this week were because Washington wanted it to happen and you like Merkel more than Obama? You just can't win with Europe. You end up with a bunch of people who hate you for simultaneously doing too much and not quite enough for them.
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49% approval for Obama is higher than the latest Gallop Poll in the US, where he reached 47% approval.
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There are always bunch of people who hate USA just because.
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It isn't only "just because" to be fair. You can easily spin the US foreign affairs as evil and bad.
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Your country and mine have been pretty fucked up in history.
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Don't forget us
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How about we talk about how Germany treats the provinces in the EU to be fair?
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Well they don't bomb them or support terrorist groups, so there's that
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Haha, Americans who get pissed because Obama doesn't have a high enough approval rating in x country. It's so personal for you guys.
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- approval rate for Obama in the US: 47%
- approval rate for Obama in Ukraine: 49%
Fuck off Ukraine! You corrupt appendage to Russia! Why do you hate us? We are the greatest country in the world!
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[deleted]
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It just makes no sense, we help them so much at our own loss and they still act like this, ungrateful bastards
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Haha. Well, to be fair, they still seem to like him more than Americans themselves.
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Some people, who like USA here, don't like Obama too much, because "if the POTUS was a Republican, eveything would be much better".
Oversimplification, but general idea is smth like this.
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Yeah, don't get your hopes up about Trump, he'll happily give Russia half of Ukraine in exchange for some oil/gas collaboration.
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Why think of the future, when we can look in the past:
We have a kinda exaggerated image of Republicans, due to people like John McCain.
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Sanders isn't much better though. With the next US elections Putin can only win.
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Republicans and Democrats are both quite divided on how to do foreign policy, and this is especially clear regarding the attitude towards Russia.
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Funny how this is also the general attitude in Poland. People absolutely adore Reagan here for example.
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Historically you've been a corrupt appendage to Russia
So you mean like russia?
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Ukrainians thought American soldiers would fight with them against Russia when Crimea was taken over. Look. But Americans did not arrive. Germany is more reliable to Ukraine.
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USA was the biggest proponent of sanctions.
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Fair enough.
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Of course it was. The US doesn't have much trade comparatively to the EU with Russia so the sanctions are largely symbolic, nor Russia or the US will lose much from sanctions upon one another, as well as this the US might actually benefit from the sanctions as some European countries seek to distance themselves from dependence on Russian Gas/ Oil.
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There were zero sanctions on buying oil and gas, so what are you talking about? What you think America competes with Russian products in EU? Does Ford have nightmares of Lada competition? They sell oil and gas and nothing else that matters.
Getting away from oil/gas dependence on a country that uses fuel commodities as a political weapon is smart, PERIOD.
Last I checked the alternative looked like Norway. I suppose the USA always has to be pushed like some conniving mastermind playing everyone to their benefit and it couldn't be that Russia is acting badly and should be punished to hopefully prevent it from doing worse.
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Are you trolling?
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Hey, we are not all like that, some of us love you guys :(
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Take a chill pill bro. Obama accidentally mentioned that Ukraine is a "client state" of Russia in his State of the Union address, and the Ukrainians got upset.
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Nothing what the US president says in his speeches is "accidental".
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eh, its Obama. He needs a teleprompter. It's not the only time a US President made a mistake. Bush made plenty of "Bushisms."
Many Puzzled By Obama's Reference To Ukraine As Russian 'Client State'
Speculate as you will. The reality on the ground doesn't reflect Ukraine as a Russian 'client state.' Far from it.
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He's not calling Ukraine a client state right now. He says: "client states that they saw slipping away from their orbit". I don't think it's unfair to say that before Euromaidan Ukraine was indeed very much in Russia sphere of influence. Russia saw that status slipping away and intervened, thus propping up eastern Ukraine through military intervention.
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Many of those who don't like Obama in Ukraine is not because he is US president, its because of the colour of his skin. So don't take it personally.
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Dont confuse Ukraine and Russia - it is the last one which is extremely racist. People in Ukraine may not like Obama because they think he could do more, and he also blocked lethal weapons supply to Ukraine.
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There is no major difference in mentality regarding racism between Russia, Ukraine or even Poland.
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Yup - and homophobia in Ukraine is not as bad as it is in Russia, but it's basically the same attitudes sans the official -anti-homo legislation.
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between Russia ... even Poland
I beg to differ. We don't beat up people just because of their skin color and we don't call them "monkeys" all the time either.
I'm not saying we don't have racist assholes. But it's certainly a different level than Russia. And we're safer for people of color than for example east Germany. (Hell, we're probably safer than most places according to the OECD ranking recently released).
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Thank you that you, russian, one more time decided for us, ukrainians, that we are the same.
-3†
Haha, oh cmon, Ukrainians are just as racist and homophobic as Russians. And I say this as a Latvian - and we have a metric fuckton of racist homophobes.
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LOL at thinking culture changes that quickly at the border.
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are you sure? i can think of at least a few good examples
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[deleted]
He's been pretty sympathetic towards Ukrainians, and hosted the peace talks in Minsk. Mostly he's wary of Russian domination and ending up like Ukraine, so he wants to play both sides without endangering his position too much.
Didn't Belarus all but become a province of Russia like 10 years ago?
That's what they say on r/Europe anyway. I know jack-shit about Belarus myself but I wonder are Russians saying the same stuff about NATO countries becoming provinces of America.
Russia and Belarus have been in a Political union for more than a decade now, called the Union State. You don't hear much about it, but it exists none the less.
Russia does say stuff like that. Or rather Putin and his cronies say that because they've convinced themselves that everyone behaves and thinks like they do.
If you ask Russians, Ukraine is not a state, you can wonder what is the status of Belarus.
Reality differs from what (some) Russians believe.
A lot of Ukrainians like the idea of a 'strong hand', 'enlightened dictator' or whatever you call it. From both camps, left and right. Lukashenko has this image here. Putin actually had the same image until he started the war.
Whatever you say about his social policies, Lukashenko is quite decent with his economical policies. It helps that Belarus is comparitevely small, so he can run it like a CEO would run a corporation. He makes deals with various parties (EU, Russia, China) depending on market trends and his managers (directors of plants) are reporting directly to him.
He is a bit crazy but does not have a inferiority complex or anything like that. AFAIK, there is no ludicrous palaces with hookers riding on tigers or whatever.
Smart populist as a leader and GDP per capita is two times higher than Ukraine's. What's not to like?
not hard to accomplish when ukraine has become worse than africa
I'm confused about crucian. I understood aboveshit and schweine part. But why crucian?
What a high bar.
Individual liberties and a lack of independance toward Russia?
I guess human rights and freedom of speech?
You'd be surprised how little that matters there.
[deleted]
makes sense.....seing him with his son at the un makes the circle of power complete......for good or bad
Strong, independent leader who don't need no Russian man.
[deleted]
a single parent too, balancing work and childcare
as Ukrainian - I have no idea who liking this guy.
I think it might be more of a combination of Belarus being a "brother nation" and no real reason not to like him.
Belarus is brother nation, just like Russia, but right now most Ukrainians hate Putin, while Lukashenko is ,, neutral,, never openly supported Russia in this Russia-Ukraine conflict. How others mentioned,, he hosted Minsk conferences. He helped many refugees, what else yes he is ,, strong leader,, something that many people in Ukraine see as good thing, because of their oligarchistic political system this is better alternative for most than the way Ukraine political system looks like since dissolution of USSR. Only thing i missedmin that poll, is more leaders to show, but must admit that probably average Ukrainian can name or at least judge only few leaders from strongest countries and neighbor countries. I wonder how our leaders would end up in such poll. President Kiska would be very positively seen i think with his anti russian statements and supporting Kiev. On other hand PM Fico more negatively, because of his neutral position, even some harsh comments on Kiev side. While it was his government that helped Ukraine more than probably any EU country- which is never mentioned in western press. The fact we went through with reverse gas flow deal and saved Ukrainians hundreds of millions USD, while Hungary and Poland account only for i think 5% and Slovakia for 95% of this reverse gas imported from EU.
Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. I can understand why our current regime is disliked in Ukraine (the whole Putin comes to Budapest in the middle of a war fiasco), but hating Slovakia? Fico was always wary of russian agression, and supportive of Ukraine.
I think you meant Hungary right? You dont have flag but hungarian sounding nickname and that Budapest comment.
You mentioned Fico. I wouldn t call him supportive of Ukraine. He stated many times harsh words on Ukraine-and he was right. He is trying to be neutral, but manh here acuse him of pro russian stand, which is not true. He clearly said Slovakia won t accept Crimean independence, he even said and was again correct that Slovakia as one of few countries has the moral right here, because we never accepted Kosovo and the samd goes for Crimea. How i said gas deals that helped a lot to Ukraine and other things, yet some id..iots call him harsh names. On other side we have President Kiska, who is anti russian and very pro-american and if Ukrainians heard his comments they must love him...
So if it goes for our official foreign policy concerning Ukraine i am proud and i am not Fico voter. We are neutral here, helping Ukraine how we can, yet trying to remain at good terms with Moscow. Very wise and good balancing foreign policy i believe.
Thank you for your insight. If you don't mind me asking, what is the current political landscape in Slovakia? Will Fico win the next elections (it will take place in autumn if I am not mistaken)? And yes, I am from Hungary, I enabled the flag now :D
For not entirely sucking up to Putin. It's a matter of expectations vs. reality.