Source
r/Warframe•
SirVolOpt

Stealth in a post-Deception world

Discussion

What are you guys and gals thoughts on stealth since Deception was removed?

Personally, I loved being able to endlessly stealth a Grineer ship and just pop the objective and leave whenever I wanted. Stealth killing a few hundred Grineer with my dagger was my zen time.

Since Deception was removed and enemy respawn became non existent outside of Defense, Survival, Interception, and Excavation (Where can't be stealth killed. Stunned and killed with a finisher yes but it's not the same), it feels like the whole point of the stealth multiplier has fallen flat. My normally entertaining dance of cloak and dagger has now left we wanting.

I understand one of the main issues with the old setup changing was to prevent loot/focus farms springing up beyond DE's control but I feel I'm lost a key element to why I enjoyed being a space ninja.

On the plus side, I get to stroll to extraction and look back on a now empty ship and know my localized genocide will leave true silence in my wake. So there's that.

So I'm curious what some of you have come up with to fill that void in your little Tenno space ninja heart.

Posted Aug 12, 2016, 3:04 PM UTC

3143
The-Darkling-WolfShut up, Meg.•

I enjoy the fact that I can sneaky beaky my way through a ship and not need to worry about enemies spawning on my face, I enjoy stealthing using non-stealth frames, which has become considerably easier now as a result.

I still want more support for true stealth though, busting in, doing the objective, and getting out again, without killing anyone, breaking anything, or leaving any trace of your existence at all.

Pretty much impossible to do that at the moment without using one of the dedicated stealth frames, due to enemies either standing staring at a door forever with no way of getting them to move, or just randomly patrolling around with no rhyme or reason.

20
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

I need to start playing like that again. I just got annoyed by the two or three enemies blocking a hall like you're back in high school talking about who knows what. Even get the fourth enemy freaking out and walking in circles because even he can't get by themselves!

My clan actually had a little competition a little over a year ago that was based on the pure stealth mission run. Fastest winner won about 800 plat. The main rules that voided your time were if you were spotted (one or two of us ran as stealth frames to monitor), if you used a power, or if you took damage of any kind. Gear was restricted to a rank 0 frame with no Aura mod and only unranked MK-1 weapons (for the intention of keeping the game fair for newer players). This was about the time the MK-1 Paris got a nerf and apparently could no longer one shot the lowest level Grineer without any mods...

3
The-Darkling-WolfShut up, Meg.•

Something else I really want to see is a change to how stealth kills work, it really shouldn't be a binary, there should be a maybe half/three-quarter second window in which case follow up hits count as stealth.

Mainly because it's pretty much impossible to rank up stealth kills with burstfire weapons, because the first hit in the burst doesn't instakill the thing.

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SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

I agree. I don't think it would be unreasonable to execute two people right next to each other without raising an alarm. Although it doesn't necessarily alert the other enemies, it makes the stealth combo multiplier seem way too fragile.

Speaking of multiple executions, I wonder if they could add that as an option. If you are in range of two enemies and initiate a stealth kill and it becomes a dual kill animation. That would be some extra entertainment.

5
The-Darkling-WolfShut up, Meg.•

AssCreed style drop assassinations too, if you're falling towards an enemy and hit the execute prompt you drop on them and take them out silently.

Really, just port most of Assassin's Creed's stealth mechanics over, if we're wall latching below an enemy let us hit X to grab him and toss him over the railing.

I think slow and methodical stealth is one of the most enjoyable ways of playing Warframe, but there's just so little support.

Another thing I'd like to see, if they move towards improving stealth, is some optional hardcore stealth style missions. Like the rankup challenge where getting spotted is a mission failure. Couple it with Warden Eximus style enemies who are very tough, but reward sneaking up and backstabbing them, and it could be really fun.

6
Valquirias•

I miss deception a lot too. Most of my melee weapons are maxed simply due to deception + Ivara's sleep arrow. Since then, I've found stealthing high level capture missions as an OK alternative if you can kill the target fast and not alert too many enemies in the process.

3
Foxboy93Remember November 6th 2013•

I miss it (or I will soon: console) because it's just a quick in and out.

Speed run: the mission!

Great for syndicate medallions and for easy alerts!

2
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

Yep yep. When they first added Cephalon Simaris, Deception was the best mission to run to for syndicate target scans. I ran a few hundred of them for about 8+ hours straight before I had to leave for work. Temporarily made #3 on the first leaderboard until then.

1
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

My second favorite build is basically just a range/duration Ivara with Ceramic Dagger + Covert Lethality. Put an army to sleep and start executing. Although you lose the fun on sneaking up on your target and executing them at just the right time that the other enemies around you don't notice (but they turn and ignore the body...)

1
fountainhead777PC/PS4•

Why not capture? Or just exterminate multiple times instead of one? Or spy where only one or two vaults are required.

3
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

I've actually been bouncing between all of those as well as Rescue and Sabotage. I keep running into a weird issue on Captures, Rescues, and Sabotages though. Once I enter the room with the objective or free the target, I can't initiate a stealth attack from that point on. I even tried waiting up in a vent several rooms away for about 15 minutes and enemies were still in an alert state. No alarm or anything. I figured it's a normal attribute to those missions once you have the objective.

So I'm avoiding Capture, Rescue, and Sabotage for now and focusing on Exterminate and Spy. Spy missions are actually my current favorites. I love that there are usually multiple ways to complete them too. Dodging alarms and lasers all sneaky beaky like. Fun stuff

1
ShadowSlayer74My Little Rhino•

I usually play spy when I want to be sneaky, especially fun with a non stealth frame.

Or use Ivara but don't use prowl, that is an interesting challenge. Not very hard mind you but kinda entertaining.

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SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

Yep, Yep. I have endless fun with her dash wire arrow alone.

1
TheShadowAdeptTenno are tenno and frames are frames•

Actually Deception is still in the game, but they've been reclassified as a type of Sabotage. I know there's still a Deception-like Sabotage mission on Ceres for a fact.

3
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

The last Sabotage mission I've done involved sabotaging and then defending cooling systems (not my idea of a stealth run what with so many alarms going off). Although those were probably from the earlier planets. I need to go back and re-explore Ceres again then. Thanks for the suggestion.

1
DareephBanshee is bae•

Head to Ker, Ceres. It's labeled as a sabotage but plays as a deception mission.

Went there recently to get Simaris scans (as I prefer planetary reactor sabotage when going out to scan things), and was slightly disappointed when it was a sabotage mission.

2
TheGungnirGuyAnd then there was this Bugger...•

You are thinking ship Sabotage. Only the Grineer ship and Corpus Ship got changed. Everything else is still standard sabotage.

1
UesserukunOhh, bubble wrap!•

I haven't seen any deception-like mission on Ceres or any other planet for that fact. A short while ago, however, there was a Deception alert on Ceres. It wasn't even called Sabotage, it literally was Deception. Are you sure you're not confused with that?

1
TheShadowAdeptTenno are tenno and frames are frames•

Nope, I can specifically remember doing a Sabotage mission on Ceres that was basically just a Deception mission. That was several hotfixes ago tho, back during the early SotR days, so DE might have changed it since then.

1
psxsquall•

I went there expecting to do the sabotage mission that's in the tileset while hunting for the last kuria that's in the rare extraction tile. Does the regular sabotage not exist anymore, where we had to access a console and destroy the core?

1
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

The run in, activate a console, and destroy the core, I've run into those a couple times. I'm sure there is a Grineer one on Phobos and a few of the Corpus ones are based on that as well.

1
RaanaarMy command is your wish.•

Sedna - Adaro

it kinda works for grinding focus, that's what I use stealth exterminates anyway. slow and tedious but it's something.

3
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

I'm ok with slow and tedious as long as my dagger gets lots of new friends to play with.

Some of the best focus I've gained were actually from the Rescue missions. Build up a multiplier and slowly stealth a few enemies outside the objective room until the focus orb spawns then go execute the Wardens. That is until the orb decides it wants to spawn with the rescue target, which is a little annoying.

2
RaanaarMy command is your wish.•

The only problem I have with Adaro is that it's very inconsistent. If I get an affinity booster I can do ridiculous stuff there with my loki&orthos primes. record is around 50k focus, with 15k convergence orb scores. feels good man

2
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

Very nice! What focus school do you run btw?

1
RaanaarMy command is your wish.•

atm zenurik

2
uselesshollowshells"Daddy, I got a B on my math homewor--" "VOOOORTEEEX!"•

i do stealth simaris scans at least once a day on phithale, sedna. it's a grineer asteroid sabotage (destroy the mining drills) so no arc traps, and this tileset seems to be spawning a lot of scorches too, and even more of a bonus is that there always are eximus units near the objectives. i usually try to get them to sound the alarms after i've stealth-killed most of them but my simaris rep is still not capped. that way, i can get the spawn rate back up. it's pretty nice.

i believe it will eventually be gone once the new tileset hits, so i just try to make the best out of it.

2
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

I really need to revisit the Sabotage missions on different planets. Already making a list of suggestions so far. Thanks for the addition.

1
WierailiaYu of see Ivan, when shoot 14 arrow like me•

I love stealth even though it's unrewarding. I say 1 alarm alerts the whole goddamn rest of the map. When you close it, the enemy is mega-super alert. Meaning any death in..30m? Will be noticed and the alarm popped again. Of course, maybe 20 seconds^(?) and they return to their original posts. More alert, of course, seeing their pal have his throat mangled all of the sudden.

Actually, remove all kinds of Hush mods and augments. Let stealth be stealth, and not blasting someone's face off with a huge flak-cannon that goes unnoticed beyond 5 meters. Then, increase the overall alertness of the enemy if they see a dead body. Too many times I've seen:

Grineer 1 talking to grineer 2, 3, 4

Grineer 1 takes a quick stroll around

Meanwhile, I've impaled the Grineer 2, 3, 4 in the wall next to them

Grineer 1 returns to his post, next to the 3 Impaled soldiers

"clem, ruksie blablabla" - he says to his impaled pals.

Repeat

Kinda uhh..Breaks the immersion. I'd suggest removing the whole "enemy flies when struck by a projectile and killed" - Thingy. Instead, yes, they would be impaled to walls, but only when being next to them. Otherwise just let them fall.

Ospreys shouldn't be alerted by anything. They should start being alert when an actual living being starts screaming that we're here.

MOA's are ok.

Nullifiers should have their bubble off at all times when un-alerted.

On Corpus maps, laser barriers should always be on when alerts are popped. Security measures active faster. Cameras activate alarms when they spot you. There's someone watching the camera so logically we should have a room that contains said camera man. Accessible by vents and such, this also allows vents to be a more rewarding thing to look for. Such as when crossing high-density rooms you can avoid them all-together. And when the camera man is dispatched cameras don't do anything when they spot a potential hostile.

Capture targets don't see you from 2 rooms away. They see you like other enemies. They don't have more health than other enemies, nor any fancy Eximus-style thingies. Extra weapons, yes.

Also, Assassination node replaced by 'Boss' and instead Assas. mode would be to kill a capture target. Alarms popped means that it turns into an exterminate mission..At the same time that you have to kill the target. We could then teleport the dead, mangled-up corpse back to "HQ" to gather their intel, data or whatever. Stealthily done rewards you with massively increased XP, and "something else". Maybe when you kill the "VIP", you get to go to a room that has a BP or get the BP as an mission reward. I'm talking Grineer style: Miter, Dual Gremlins and such.

Not only would this make me love solo play, but coordinated group play would also get a bite of the cake. One can search for 'the room', one could go take care of the camera-guy and others hunt for the target.

Or...Make things interesting and introduce this via Corpus Raid featuring none other than...drumroll...THE SERGEANT.

2
RekTrain_PrimeLoli Prime.•

I liked the fact you could do it without giving two shits to effort.

2
daniel8020•

My problem with exterminate is the damm dogs... you can't use stealth finisher on them and the mission will mark them as enemies meaning you can't see your next target until you kill them

2
SirVolOptOP[PC] Limbo like a sir•

Indeed. It's the same with the Corpus Ospreys.

2
KektklikWiki Addict•

butbut.. deception missions still exist (in alerts & syndicate missions)

1
Existential_Steak•

I enjoy using Ivara in spy sorties and thats probably it. Apart from that stealth seems pretty redundant and inefficient when compared to just cruising through using aoe cc/damage frames and weapons. Especially in a post void world where before stealth, especially naramon, was good for late surivial.

1
BezelothPC•

This game is not made for stealth to be viable.

0