Source
r/mechmarket•
Gajible

[META] Regarding the use of "OBO"

Meta

We've noticed an influx of posts recently with prices listed as "$$$ OBO" and we figured we'd clarify the use of it for those unsure or unaware.

While saying "Or Best Offer [below the price stated]", or "OBO" isn't against the rules, bidding is against the rules. The last thing we want is sellers pitting buyers against each other, creating bidding wars through the use of "OBO". This is just a recipe for bad-blood, salt, and hurt feelings and is something we generally want to avoid.

To be clear, your use of "Or Best offer" as a seller should not mean or imply "or better offer".

While we can't directly enforce interactions happening in PM, we'd just like to remind everyone that if a seller is asking you to overbid another buyers price, be it in private or in the comments, you are encouraged to report this behaviour to us.

Thanks for your time, MechMarket! Happy trading/selling.

Posted Apr 7, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

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___LOOPDAED___•

I'd guild this post if I could spare the 2$. Instead I'll have a sausage muffin and hash potato for breakfast. I'm eating it for you though.

But seriously I've never agreed with something so much. This place isn't about taking advantage of others. It's about helping people by let go of things you'd like to keep but realize there's someone who wants it more.

I'll edit if it didn't make sense later.

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frankxandershttp://www.heatware.com/u/107586•

We collect keyboards. There's no money left.

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TheGoldBot•

I'd guild this post if I could spare the 2$.

I got you fam.

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Krakobhttps://www.heatware.com/u/109440•

Hope you enjoyed your breakfast!

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___LOOPDAED___•

I did. My stomach.. Not so much.

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zacheadams•

Clarification request:

If I post an item for $500, a buyer comes along and offers $400, and a second buyer offers $350, am I allowed to tell that second buyer the first offered $400, given my asking prices was higher than both?

Am I allowed to tell that second buyer that someone made an offer higher than theirs, without disclosing the number, but request that they meet the asking price if they want the item?

Cheers!

EDIT: Mod response below, validating that both of these are legitimate because they are based on offers below the price posted in the thread, rather than bidding above it.

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GajibleOPMODMapleMod•

I would say so. If a buyer is willing to offer below asking, he's also willing to lose the item to someone paying full price. It's when the offers start to exceed asking that problems arise.

"Or Best Offer [below the price stated]" should be the major takeaway of this clarification.

This is also why we ask for reasonable asking prices. No $5000 OBO type stuff. That's just bidding through a loophole.

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YouBleed_Red•

Clarifying off this, does this make asking a stupidly high price (let's say 1200 for a duck octagon with gat blacks) and then stating they will lower the price by $25 every half hour unallowed as it is basically reverse bidding: seeing how high someone will bite.

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PrimeWombat•

Thank you for the clarification I think this very fair.

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zacheadams•

Thank you, I appreciate the clarification and it validates what I have done in the past.

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daijizai•

The flipside, if someone knows that the seller is asking too low and offers higher to secure it unsolicited and just because they know there will already be full price offers. I would think that should be cool because it wasn't seller solicited, right?

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zacheadams•

This is indeed a complicated one, I might even say no if it's above the price in the thread. That's the equivalent of taking an item down on Ebay because you got an off-site offer for direct Paypal, it's kinda shirking the market.

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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GajibleOPMODMapleMod•

At that point it should be up to the seller to not cause a bidding situation - Bidding isn't allowed, solicited or not.

In an ideal situation, the seller should be selling to whoever offers asking, at his own discretion.

We know this won't always be the case, all of the transactions that go on are purely based on trust and there's only so much us Moderators can do. It's up to the community to do the rest, which is why this post is more of a PSA than anything.

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daijizai•

I think the important thing here should be the definition of bidding - in this case I expect that you mean playing offers against one another, or allowing prospective buyers to play off each other, in order to get a better deal.

This is exactly why I would handle all offers in a vacuum and negotiate without disclosure of other offers or even their existence, and if someone offered me over while I was still negotiating with another prospective buyer I'd just say "sorry, but I reached a deal and its no longer available."

And if I were looking to bundle, I'd state that in the selling post clearly and just tell people I'll let them know when I decide.

You can't prevent all the buyer butthurt even with fair and well disclosed practices.

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soilheartMODUser by day, mod by night•

We can't and won't force a seller to take an offer from a specific buyer, so if the seller gets a better offer than he asked for he is of course free to take that offer if he so desire.

What would make us take action is if the seller ask other buyers to overbid that offer if they want the item, especially if the bid was higher than the price stated in the post.

Multiple buyers trying to overbid each other with offers in the comments (not that I've ever seen an offer in a comment) would also discouraged and removed if brought to our attention.

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ensulyn•

Very good question, would like to know as well.

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Rykno•

it's a tricky situation because you are allowed to edit a post after the fact making it possible to do some fuckery with the listed price.

The once or twice I've encountered the situation I tell the lower buyer that someone else has come closer to the listed price and give them a chance to meet it.

I don't bid up but I would prefer to get my listed prices that's why I've started drawing them into the timestamp.

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brianjkinghttp://www.heatware.com/u/107555•

Very good question, thanks! Appreciate all that you do r/mechmarket mods

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CamisRank1https://www.heatware.com/u/106998•

^ This

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quadfreak•

Well if the first person offered you higher, I don't see why you would even give the second guy a chance since he was not the first one...unless you are trying to create a bidding war. Because then at that point you have to give the first guy an opportunity as well because...he was first.

Now if the situation was flip flopped and the first guy offered $350 and second offered $400, I would give guy #1 an opportunity to match cause he was first.

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zacheadams•

at that point you have to give the first guy an opportunity as well because...he was first

MechMarket is not first-come-first-served. It never has been and it never should be (except in threads where people explicitly say or run their sale "fcfs" by their own choice). On that matter is no substantive difference than the situation you presented and the one I presented.

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quadfreak•

Personally, my experience has been the opposite, everything defaults to fcfs unless stated otherwise. Most of the big for sale threads I've seen have specifically stated that it is NOT fcfs and priority goes to bulk buyers.

But everyone is entitled to sell their stuff how they see fit.

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zacheadams•

everyone is entitled to sell their stuff how they see fit

Yep, and this is the crux of it.

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Ubernooby•

But I get what he's saying, because 90% of the time, this place very much is first come, first served... and I think that many of the people here also treat it as such, whether that's a written rule or not.

I mean, most of us know the general value of the goods here, and sellers generally offer things at that going rate. Therefore, if the first person in line doesn't immediately take the item(s) for asking, then in many cases - and this is solely from personal experience, however anecdotal - the simple fact is that the seller often is fielding bids for over their asking price.

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zacheadams•

90% of the time, this place very much is first come, first served

I totally understand, which is why I included

or run their sale "fcfs" by their own choice

as part of my post.

That's fine if people do that, but they shouldn't be obliged to, especially if there is clearly a bulk sale/trade opportunity. I want to be clear that everything with a listed price on a single item post (within reason, excluding "raffles"), should be FCFS, otherwise that's totally messed up, but in larger volume sales, it's frustrating/silly.

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zombieologisthttp://www.heatware.com/u/109035•

I personally think that OBO should mean "or as close as possible to". Like you might take $490 instead of $500. Anything over set price should not even be allowed. It should be FCFS on the $500 price OBO below asking price. If you want $600 for that set you should have set the price there. Why would it not be FCFS if they met your asking price?

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daijizai•

If someone really wants something, why shouldn't they be able to elect to offer more than asking - if unsolicited - to secure it? Especially if they reasonably believe there will end up being full price offers.

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zacheadams•

Why would it not be FCFS if they met your asking price?

If you're selling a lot of things and people offer to buy multiple.

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daijizai•

The way I see it - nobody hit the number, so why shouldn't everyone be given a second chance.

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soilheartUser by day, mod by night•

Personally, I would trust a seller going with the second approach with "blind" offers more, as I wouldn't have to worry as much that I will regret that I payed too much in the end (or that the seller makes up bids himself to drive the price up).

After all I know how I work on auction sites, where I usually bid a little more than I originally planned at the final bidding phase, because "maybe I can pay a little more after all" when I see the incremental price increases at the end.

(This comment is my own opinion, hence the non distinguished comment).

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daijizai•

I would think your better choice here would simply be to negotiate on the merit that neither offer met your expectation. What is the value of disclosing that there are others they need to beat? What does it accomplish but to make you look shady...

If you don't want to negotiate on the item, another tactic might just be to reply and say that you are collecting offers and they should submit their best and final offer and you will let them know.

Obviously I cannot speak for the mods, but I cannot imagine either of those strategies would be met with disdain.

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zacheadams•

What is the value of disclosing that there are others they need to beat? What does it accomplish but to make you look shady...

People get constantly salty in negotiations. I have done #2 before because if I refuse the offer and then the item disappears, then they come back and say "why didn't you tell me someone else had offered you X, I would have just bought it for what you asked" - and while that sorta indicates they should have spent full price in the first place, it is a positive for transparency.

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daijizai•

It's funny to me how potential buyers can get offended if someone is picked over them. Business is business. I hear you though.

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daijizai•

and yes I realize that my paltry number compared to yours... but opinions being what they are ;-)

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zacheadams•

That's okay, I don't care about your trade rep, I'm in a meta thread to converse about interesting nuances in trade negotiation.

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taylordcraighttps://www.heatware.com/eval.php?id=97557•

Who cares how many trades you have on MM? That's not indicative of anything.

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GreyChillstep•

Meh you guys are boring, let's see some world record price wars!!! :D

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Gilzabizlo•

Lowest bidder wins!

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HappyCatFishhttps://www.heatware.com/u/104018•

This is the whole reason I always sell things at a set price to the first trustworthy buyer.

I prefer to list prices w/ shipping and fees included. So when I post a keyset for $200 shipped I am really taking home around $180 or so. The idea of making a buyer cover the fees and shipping is ridiculous unless they are international, in which case asking an increased price to cover shipping makes sense.

If you want to auction something off, there are sites like Ebay at your disposal.

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pungerthegunner•

I agree, the "+ pp fee" bit always annoy me. I understand that sellers want their prices look lower than it actually is, but that's actually more off-putting when the buyer finally see the price of everything that's has been taken into account.

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asusoverclocked•

I feel like asking for the cost of shipping is fair, but not fees, don't we have a rule about that?

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pungerthegunner•

Not sure about that, but I've seen plenty of listings with hidden PayPayl fees.

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TourneyCollectorBro/Clack Collector - https://heatware.com/eval.php?id=98906•

That really depends because most sellers aren't willing to cover the hundreds of dollars in fees.

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Mr_BeastQuakehttp://www.heatware.com/u/104611•

Good.

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RaageFaace•

Wonderful clarification and I can't support it enough!

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charonpdx•

This is also exactly the reason Craigslist prohibits "OBO" - it is used too often to mean "Or better offer", when it's supposed to mean "or best offer below my asking price."

The idea of "OBO" is supposed to be "I may have priced it a bit high; if you think so, feel free to offer less; but note that if I get a higher offer than yours, you won't get it."

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asusoverclocked•

The idea of "OBO" is supposed to be "I may have priced it a bit high; if you think so, feel free to offer less; but note that if I get a higher offer than yours, you won't get it."

As someone who dosent know his prices well, I with more people understood this.

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ABC123itsEASYhttp://www.heatware.com/u/108807•

\o/ Thank you

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PrimeWombat•

Thanks mod team

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Boba_Phathttp://www.heatware.com/u/109089•

THANK YOU!

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Tally810http://www.heatware.com/u/108861•

Nice

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Wazazabyhttps://www.heatware.com/u/105135•

Finally, thank you mods!

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esumli•

This is a nice thing to clarify!

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

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Mr_BeastQuakehttp://www.heatware.com/u/104611•

Lmao, oops

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libertycannon•

loooool

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