So i just had a game vs velkoz mid and i got rekt pretty hard.
He didnt really do anything amazing rather than the skillful W permapush.
I played TF and couldnt keep up in shoving and my cs went down and after i roamed with ult i almost lost my tower among with cs.
Any ways to beat this strat?
until ludens i could barely clear the wave and have mana while he constantly was able to shove.
Posted Aug 14, 2018, 1:19 PM UTC
#TF
TF is actually a better pusher than Vel'koz. His Q can wreck waves if you use it properly as it comes in. Spam red and blue cards on cooldown depending on what you need to use. Vel'koz only has 2 Ws every 30 seconds. The CD on his W early is terrible, and he will go OOM very quickly trying to match the push if TF is spamming wave well.
Try to hit wave and aim towards Vel'koz with the cards at the same time if possible. Don't be afraid to get creative and use one of the sides to hit the linear wave as it comes in and aim the "center" at Vel'koz.
#Oriana
Oriana is worse at clearing waves, but she has nearly impossible to avoid damage, stronger AAs, and stronger dueling. Use the trading stance and stay near Vel'koz during the laning phase. Bully him every time he goes to AA minions. He cannot clear the waves well with just his W or Q, so he has to get in close to AA.
Practice Q-ing just past the enemy through the minion wave for poke and waveclear in one spell.
Practice your combo -> Q behind them, W-ing to slow them, E-ing to bring it back to you and shield, and engage with AAs. Your level 3 against him is huge, and Vel'koz has very little kill pressure assuming you have full health. If he is using his W to clear waves - you have even bigger safety as he has spent all of his damage in his W and no damage to deal to you.
Save your EW for dodging his E at all costs if you are low enough for him to combo. Save your ult to counter his.
Utilize your AA passive on minions as well, autoing the healthiest target as fast and early as you can. You cannot only last hit against Vel'koz.
#General Vel'koz Counter Tips
Vel'koz players typically go Q->W->E->W->W->RQWE. This means early their W is almost all of their damage. It is also very easily partially dodged so it is almost exclusively used to clear wave.
Levels 1, 2, 4, and 5 Vel'koz is one of the weaker heroes in the game. He has almost no kill pressure, no mobility, long CDs and high mana costs. At level 3 he has access to his combo, so he becomes a bit better than most, but he'll continue to get waveclear in W afterwards over trading power. He becomes extremely strong at 6, and can often simply ult you in lane at max range to get tons of pressure over you in lane.
To dodge his Q, walk diagonally forward just to the side of the initial bolt. You'll dodge it if they let it hit max range, or they'll split it early. Then it becomes juking them for splitting it early, and most of the time they will. The best method though is to simply use your own minions as defense.
If Vel'koz is in danger, or sees an opportunity for a kill he will use his E. If you see his E come out ever, you either need to do everything to dodge it, or everything to go on him. Especially since it takes .75 seconds for it to land no matter how close or far to him it is, it is very easy to dodge with any movement spell. Waiting till the last second to dodge it, will often bait out all of his spells - and then you go in HARD. He has no damage outside of his spells, and cannot get away. Do not chase him for too long, as he is a solid kiter.
You traitor!
Haha I know, but I gotta keep the enemies intelligent so that our squid doesn't get nerfed :D
Tf better pusher than vel? No, even if you do push vel it doesn't matter vel can farm under tower easily, vel has all the advantages in this lane and tf will be under tower most of the time infact it's your objective as vel'koz in this matchup to make sure tf doesn't move and pressure the tower as much as possible, if you keep tf in lane you win and usually with a cs advantage and usually out trading a lot, i haven't faced mr dopa but in solo queue that's what i see, tf needs jungler help. Orianna can be a massive problem though since her early trading is efficient and if you max q she can hide in her minion wave and if you max w she can hide outside the minion wave. She's a pain.
Thank you for the detailed explanation.
Usually when I tried dodging his qs i went forward, didnt even know velkoz can reactivate it midflight.
But I honestly feel that velkoz is very oppresive mana wise for Tf especially, while woth ori ws i can still push cheaply.
Will be trying the new mage meta runes(sorcery with warp tonics) and corrupting start to solve this.
If Vel'koz is pushing you under turret he has to drop both w's. Risk taking a weak Q to the face to get a huge gold card trade off.
Ori has higher dps until like level 3. Gain an early advantage through auto attack pressure when the Vel farms. Stay close to Vel so you can ult when he ults.
Will never work as the main thought in vel'koz's mind is always "what cancels laser", so there are very specific ranges you choose to laser at, for example viktor can cancel laser with silence so only lasers at 75% range away or greater are worth throwing at that range he will reach you after the full duration of laser. Same story with trundle "is pillar off cooldown" if no you don't laser, you develop a mini compendium in your mind of appropriate laser situations. You are right though at level 1 bully vel'koz when he goes to w the wave, auto q auto with electrocute would be good.
Vel'koz can't really shove constantly until he gets a Lost Chapter, so that's the window of weakness you need to hit. Try to blue/gold card him when you can, and try to hit both him and minions with red card and wild cards. Never stop basic attacking! Unfortunately for you, Vel can play at range to dodge your poke, but that'll still take some pushing pressure off of you at least. You'll need jungle pressure to actually kill Vel and start out-pushing him. Also, run back to dodge Vel Q poke, not forward. I hit Q all the time because enemies run forward and I reactivate it early.
Tf is such an easy lane for velkoz. But the problem is mid and late game the tf normally has side lanes rolling and our teammates flaming. And getting within aa range late game of tf is instant death.
I honestly believe you are 100% fukd in this lane as twisted fate but orianna played well can handle vel'koz. I played a fair amount of twisted fate players and even the good ones just get pressured so harshly that they can't roam and they can't trade effectively with you. Orianna on the other hand can out trade by juking in and out of the minion wave, using shield intelligently and out trading per auto attack, vel'koz doesn't want to use W into the wave stupidly and wants to W the entire wave for efficient clear which orianna is good at disturbing.
I'm not telling
While I thought this was funny, please also make an effort to help out people posting in the subreddit - even if they are not worshippers of the holy one.