07/06/2020
Posted Jun 7, 2020, 1:49 PM UTC
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Sad how those "influencers" on social media always leap to post the negative view of our British police and choose to ignore such heartwarming acts by our officers. I love you officers and would like to thank you for working tirelessly to keep our public safe 💙
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Surely you can criticise the British police whilst also acknowledging it's overall fantastic compared to many other countries.
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Absolutely! Nothing is perfect
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Because the negative is what they are trying to change. These are great but this is what should be expected of the police.
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But but but but
This doesn't further the rhetoric that I have been spouting on social media despite doing no research into or having any of my own opinions about!
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This is quite a dim witted view in all honesty. If it wasn't for social media, and particularly twitter, we wouldn't have seen a great many of the atrocities that the US police for instance have been committing. Hell, this whole recent resurgence in the BLM movement is because cops were filmed murdering someone and it was put on... wait for it... social media.
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The US police. Not our own.
Two very different things.
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While I support the sentiment, many of the names on that list had absolutely nothing to do with police brutality.
Mark Duggan was in possession of a handgun when he was shot.
Edson Da Costa and Rashan Charles both choked after attempting to swallow drugs (or paracetamol in Charles' case) to avoid arrest.
Smiley Culture stabbed himself.
I support the movement to end inequality and prejudice, but you can't compare these cases to what's happening in the US.
37
I think you should re-read the BBC article you linked.
So, over the last 10 years, a white individual who has been arrested was about 25% more likely to die in custody than a black individual who had been arrested.
Black people make up 9% arrests and account for 8% of in custody deaths. White people make up 79% of arrests and account for 85%.
I don't deny the existence of systemic racism and injustice in the UK. However, saying that a black person is more likely to die in custody than a white person in custody is provably not true and I think it hurts the cause to say so.
37
Mark Duggan was an atrocity now? Even a career gangster and habitual gun carrier getting shot is still regrettable but, a police atrocity? Please.
Also, smiley culture killed himself and Jimmy mubenga was in custody of G4S, not the police.
I can't be bothered to fact check the rest of your list right now but I hope you will go away and educate yourself.
31
Oh good, another person trying it on with a misleading Gish gallop. Sorry, but you don't get to do that here - we work with evidence, and I've taken the time to do the due diligence that you should've done before sharing it as purported fact:
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Mark Duggan: Lawfully killed, determined in court by a jury.
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Stephen Lawrence: Was murdered by others - this was not a death caused by police although obviously there were wider failings.
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Nunu Cardoso: Caused his own death by swallowing his own drugs, determined in court by a jury.
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Smiley Culture: Suicide(!)
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Jimmy Mubenga: Literally nothing at all to do with the police - G4S contracted by UK Border Agency. Found not guilty by a jury at court.
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Rashan Charles: Caused his own death by, again, swallowing a plastic package. Accidental death, determined in court by a jury.
Were you completely unaware of the above before you shared that list (in which case well done for perfectly demonstrating u/MisterPrice1000's point about how social media misleads those who fail to fact check), or did you choose to share it in full knowledge of how misleading it actually is (in which case you're simply a liar)? I'm not sure which one is worse, but as you're not the first person to attempt this I have to be a consistent moderator and remove your post until/unless you can make it less misleading, with a final warning for breaking our rule on honesty and integrity.
19
I think it poignant that of all of the persons you listed there, you missed out possibly the most clean-cut police shooting of an innocent man there - De Menezes. Poignant that he’s not quite the right ethnicity code, no?
I’m not going to go down the list and tell you why each one was justified or not because people with this level of confirmation bias usually aren’t here for a discussion.
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Thank you, will post this on my Instagram !
27
Amen brother.
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I understand why Police want to share this, to show that we aren't like America here, and that the protests feel like they're a direct attack on the UK police, but its ultimately self defeating. It isn't going to convince people who think otherwise and comes across as defensive and "We're not racist, we've done this...". There are racist police in the UK and every time they express that in their duties it makes the job harder for every other member of the force.
The British police are arguably the best in the world in dealing with the population size it does in as diverse a place as it does. Keep doing good police work and the idea the police are racists will continue to die down over time when those who are, are removed and people in minority communities see things are getting better compared to the 80's and 90's when their older brothers, fathers, uncles etc. genuinely did experience outright racism from the police.
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Anyone got any information about these particular pictures? When these incidents are from etc?
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Top right is Camberwell August 2017. 4 stabbed In big gang fight. I'm the one leaning over him, slashed across abdomen all his intestines had fallen out
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Strong work bud.
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Left one is in Haringey, It was my street duties unit who responded and this occurred winter 2018/2019
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Top right is a stabbing in Southwark last year
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Yeah I want to know that too before I post it because of the inevitable "that's because they hurt them first"
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I'm so glad I checked your flair to see you're not a DC as even I'd worked that out.
I was meaning what incidents these are to get more background. There's one thing that this current issue is highlighting (as most of these things do) it's that the spread of misinformation being used to further the aims of a group or individual. It only takes one bad actor to post a "look what police did to this innocent protester", much nicer if there are a list of links to news articles on hand for where these came from to ensure balance.
6
Is this today? Hope the victim is ok
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US police do this too btw.
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Uk police are nothing like American police, it’s a completely different breed of officer
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Same for alot of USA cops. Sick of hearing ACAB
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No matter how you spin this, Duggan was a dangerous criminal armed with a firearm. He was lawfully shot. End of story.
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He was no lethal threat to the police. You consider that a lawful killing?
You've left out the simple fact that what is known during an inquest, well after the fact, is not the same as what is known at the time if the incident. Duggen was a dangerous individual who was shot based on a reasonable belief in the information known at the time. Police aren't omnipotent, they can only make judgements based on the information available.
But you know that, and choose to ignore it, so I don't know why I'm wasting my breath.
6
Cool, and my reply to you; do one!
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The jurors are understandably laymen
And you're not?
they should have been told that if they accept that Duggan was unarmed, they cannot then accept the killing is lawful because surprise surprise, it's unlawful to shoot someone who is unarmed.
It categorically is not automatically unlawful to shoot someone who is unarmed.
The common law rule is: if you have an honest belief that you or another are in immediate danger, you may use such force as is reasonable and necessary to avert the danger you perceive.
Now:
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If the jury had found that the officer did not have an honest belief that he was in imminent danger, then the killing would have been unlawful.
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If the jury had found that, although the officer honestly believed that he was in imminent danger, the force he used was unreasonable or unnecessary to avert that danger, then the killing would have been unlawful.
From their verdict, we can deduce that the jury decided that, notwithstanding the fact that Duggan was not actually armed, the officer honestly believed that he was in imminent danger, and used only such force as was reasonable and necessary to avert the danger that he perceived.
You don't have to be right about the circumstances when you use force to protect yourself - you can be genuinely mistaken and still use force lawfully, because it would be unreasonable for the law to expect omniscience from any person considering defending themselves from an attack which they perceive is about to happen.
2
This is probably the best one I've seen.
I'm the one in top right picture. How weird seeing yourself in a meme
I think you've earned yourself a flair young man
One the floor or being attended to?
for real? wow.
What was the context here?
https://youtu.be/m0ygiHA6Wng 4 stabbed in Camberwell, we (police) came across it by chance about 30 seconds after it happened. All survived.
How could you tell that was you? Makes me wonder how many things I’ve been in but not realised because of angles like that
https://youtu.be/m0ygiHA6Wng I remember the video lols
Name checks out.