Source
r/AllThingsTerran•
Fishtator

G1 playing TvT

Hey guys, I found myself in this weird game where my opponent was doing an amazing macro game, expanding everywhere and harassing me with BCs before switching to Thors. Eventually, I just massed Vikings, did the servos upgrade, and smashed the opponent’s ground army by just using Vikings.

Is there any way this could have failed horribly for me? The opponent had siege tanks but I was able to just fly to them and land on top.

Also, are assault mode Vikings like these still viable nowadays?

Posted Aug 12, 2020, 6:03 PM UTC

2115
COOLIO5676Silver•

tvt is probably the most beautiful and dynamic match up in the game. make too many tanks and viking / lib will smash. make too many viking / libs and thor tank will smash. make an equal number of either and either pure viking or pure tank will smash. make ravens to disable the thors and viking lib will smash. make ghosts to emp the ravens and thor tank will smash. make bcs for efficient harass but risk losing to big frontal pushes, but you can counter those with a ton of static d and panetarys with tanks. but all that sunken cost in d might bite you in the ass when the map is split 50/50 and youre fighting for resource efficiency.

tvt is awesome.

21
jonobonbon•

Lmao, I wish my friends felt the same way. They like to think TvT is Turtle V Turtle

5
dr3amb3ing•

Turtle vs Turtle, using that one in Twitch chat

1
laytonmillerDiamond•

What a wonderful explanation hahaa

1
doofpooferthethird•

Vikings do plus damage to thors, because they’re mechanical, and thors only do plus damage to armored, pretty sure Vikings are considered light units. Also, if your macro is better than your opponent, more stuff always beats less stuff. So yeah, technically, mass ground Vikings can counter mass thors.

However, it’s not a standard unit composition because mass Vikings are easily countered. Widow mines, tanks, marines, cyclones and planetaries destroy them, and Vikings don’t do that well even against units they’re supposed to counter.

Vikings are good because they have a long range, are fairly cheap and fast to build, and are decently mobile, plus they have a back up ground mode if air threats are cleared. They trade cost effectively vs battlecruisers in small numbers, and they’re a good response to idiot players who keep teleporting BCs into their bases.

So yeah, in this very specific scenario, where your opponent went mass BC into Thor, mass Vikings are a good choice. But once they start mixing in other units to complement the BCs and Thors, you’re going to have to change your strategy. “Standard” lower league mech play would be Thor + Hellbats + tanks - hellbats will shield the thors while tanks do AoE damage on the Vikings. Standard lower league bio play would be marine marauder tank, which obviously beats mass Vikings.

The ground mode is there mostly so that you don’t get caught with your pants down if your opponent suddenly tech switches from air to ground, and to let Vikings continue to be useful after you killed all the air. People pretty much never go for Vikings exclusively for the ground mode.

5
gosu_link0Master•

Vikings are armored type. Thors deal no bonus damage to anything on the ground.

1
agalix•

I'm gold too. In one weird game I went mass vikings v mech and had a couple liberators against his tanks. I was thinking to hell normal strats I want vikings. He didn't have any air. I was quite surprised when I landed my 13? vikings and destroyed his 5 or 6 thors. Are they the marines of mech we've been looking for?

3
FishtatorOP•

Yeah, the vikings literally melted the thor army my opponent had. I saw the replay afterwards, and my opponent was floating 6k minerals at one point, which is why I feel that I just got lucky with my vikings.

Regardless, I still feel they are incredibly strong

3
agalix•

Thors have 65.9 DPS in their ground attack. Vikings have 16.8 HOWEVER they also get bonus damage against mech units while in assault mode. So vs thors and tanks they output 24.8 DPS. Well what do you know.

Thors only get bonuses against units in the air.

3
Egobeliever•

You'll realise Vikings are one of these most important units in TvT. Air control for tanks and the assault mode's bonus damage to mechanical are the 2 big factors here. Terran buildings are mechanical. Liberators and BC will get shredded.

In the other matchups, Vikings are not nearly as powerful. It might be the first unit out of your starport to defend against Oracle or hunt overlords, but you usually won't make more than 1 or 2 (unless you need them as a response to something). In TvT you can absolutely just continue to pump Vikings until you are sure you own the sky. When you do, move your ground army(tanks!) into position to kill his bases, use range libs to get yourself there if you need to.

Landing Vikings on undefended tanks and bases ( even PFs ) is a legit tactic, but not a strategy. Don't rely on that to kill your opponent, but absolutely kill everything he isn't in position to defend and fly back to your main army.

3
illuuminauti•

Man I will tell you that that strategy would most likely not work beyond diamond. If you could share a replay it would make more sense to me why he lost to mass Vikings.

2
FishtatorOP•

I’ll try to upload something if the thread is still alive tonight, lol.

2
Helsinky_Smashrod•

Widow mines zone Vikings REALLY well. Pair this with BCs and it's very difficult to engage the BCs in a stand up fight with your Viking fleet.

1
pm_favorite_song_2me•

Basically you can use them in a pinch like that, but they're useless for pushing into tanks and plantaries so they'll never be better than situational on the ground. By all means land them if it makes sense and wins you the fight, but after the fight probably don't keep them on the ground too long.

1
[deleted]•

There is no amazing macro at gold level.

1