Introducing Supreme Draft
magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/magic-o...
magic.wizards.comPosted Aug 24, 2020, 3:15 PM UTC
384133
magic.wizards.comThis actually sounds like a really fun way to go through a box with one other player. It's less than ideal for a 24 pack masters box, but I suppose you could try three picks each from twelve packs. Anyway, it can be tough to get eight people together during non-pandemic times, and I like cracking packs, so I'll definitely be trying this out.
178
This seems expensive as heck though
84
Oh yeah, I definitely wouldn't do this every week or anything, but like, my brother and I get a box every Christmas, and this would be perfect for that. Or if Magicfests ever come back, pooling tickets and supreme drafting boxes from the prize wall sounds like a blast.
46
I mean, do you think a single “supreme draft” of a box is better than 6 sealed pools (so 3 1v1 sealed matches)? I guess you could keep the 13 cards in each picked pack separate from one another and do a not-so-supreme draft with the leftovers
29
Depend on wether you think you can have more fun/squeeze more game out of one "supreme draft" deck or three sealed one.
Since "draft/sealed at home" isn't restricted by any limit on the number of match you can do, drafting one or ten times don't change the amout of match you can do, just the diversity of them. I personally loathe sealed (I like the variance of limited, the random go a bit too much in this mode), so I would take the supreme draft each times... but then again, I'm too broke to ever buy a whole box (and don't really have any mate to play with at home), so my opinion on the subject don't matter.
11
Yeah, I think a semi-supreme draft would still be fun, especially if you swapped the leftovers with your opponent. I'm mostly into this idea because I've never been a super huge fan of normal sealed outside of prereleases. I know that building a sealed pool correctly is a skill unto itself, but given the chance, I'd rather do something either more interactive or higher-powered.
Also, if you're patient and keep track of what picks were from which packs, you could even reassemble the packs and do sealed pools too, although you wouldn't have the excitement of opening brand new packs for that.
2
You could modify the process a bit and pass a pack once to your opponent. Then you'd pick half from "fresh" boosters and half from boosters with 2 cards removed. You'd still have a high-powered deck and only go through half the boosters.
1
Decadent is almost the more fitting word.
12
Why on Earth would they be pushing something expensive as heck?!??
6
They do full box sealed st Grand Prixs. I could see them trying to figure out how to do this too.
2
The two-headed giant full box sealed event I did is one of my favorite Magic experiences of all time. It was Kaladesh, so we had five Reckless Fireweavers in one of the decks and got to ding our opponents for like twelve with the white Puzzleknot. It was downright unfair.
7
If you have a box that you are going to open anyway, this seems highly preferable to just cracking packs.
1
I have done this before with a whole box for two players to draft. I'll explain the difference we do:
Each player starts with a pack, and picks one card. We then swap the packs between the two of us and take our next pick. They put aside the rest of the pack and get another one. It's similar to how this Supreme Draft works but you go through all 36 packs, so you end up with 72 picks.
8
It's less than ideal for a 24 pack masters box, but I suppose you could try three picks each from twelve packs.
I kinda like the idea of 3 picks from a masters booster. Probably still a higher power level than 2 from a standard set.
3
I believe you can still easily find 8 people who buy boxes for cracking at every lgs. The tricky part is convincing all of them to do the cracking together by "sharing" boxes.
1
I'd play semi-supreme. You take two and then switch with your partner to take two more, then move on to the next pack.
1
My go-to with pack opening is pack wars. Crack a pack, add 15 lands, you got yourself a stew going!
I think if you do Supreme Draft while opening a box, it's a little sad that you still won't end up using most of the cards in the box. At least with pack wars, most of the cards you open will probably be used. Plus it lets you play with odd/bad cards you'd normally never be able to play with!
0
My favorite pack wars format is apparently called Pai Gow Magic. My friends and I just call it five deck pack wars though. Basically, you each crack a pack, make five three-card decks, and play a best-of-five series with the following rules: draw all three cards as your opening hand, infinite mana of any type/color, five life, no decking, and the player who lost the last game or finished building their decks first goes first. Once a game is over, you set those decks aside and move on to the next two. Some sets are worse than others (Modern Horizons, for example, was very synergy-focused, so the decks tended to be pretty bad), but overall, it's the most fun you can have with two packs of cards.
10
I think this is super cool from the point of view of offering a play experience that would be very impractical to implement in paper. Very curious to see what the resulting decks will play like.
147
Bah, Supreme VIP pack draft is the fnm staple!
82
If you're not taking out a home equity loan every week to pay for 36 VIP booster packs to Supreme Draft with the other fat cats, what are you really doing with your life?
55
Don't forget the 6 Prize Packs each player needs to chip in, ain't no fun if you ain't got any skin in the game!
15
could you imagine?!?!?! Just set up a shredder in the middle of the table and thats where all the unused go right into.
16
I mean that happens to chaff most of the time anyway. What are you gonna use Ironclad Krovod for after draft?
2
Probably like cube draft decks but harder to get specific archetypes. You're getting the best two cards from every pack, so you're probably taking the rare and/or the best uncommon in most situations. The power level will be high, but you won't be able to easily pull off reanimator or something.
1
I wonder how well it would hold with second and third play throughs keeping the packs in order. So first round 1st + 2nd pick, then run through the packs again, picking the 3rd and 4th cards, then 5th / 6th.
0
So is Supreme draft just in MTGO and not Arena? all ravnica all day sounds pretty fun
52
Just MTGO, Arena doesn't have most of the Ravnica sets.
64
I bet it makes its way to Arena eventually.
14
Yeah, it it proves popular on mtgo it’s one of those features that would be ported over... someday probably quite a while from now.
21
They mentioned it only became feasible when they had to make changes to MTGO's draft system to allow two first picks in Double Masters draft.
11
Right but once you've solved a problem one time, you have a bit of a roadmap to solve it again.
6
MTGO and MTGA are very, very different programs. There's likely little in the way of shared architecture.
17
This actually sounds like a really cool sealed experience in paper - just keep the remainder of the packs together and keep redrafting them. Do a draft a night and you can keep playing for a week. There's a lot of depth here - do you dump all your power in the first couple decks, or do you spread it out, and how do you break up your archetypes, while simultaneously, only having to assemble one deck each day keeps the complexity at a reasonable level. I'd probably do something like set a time limit on picks to avoid the whole thing getting bogged down in metastrategy, and also have the winner of the previous match decide who goes first, to encourage players to try to assemble their best decks earlier, to limit the number of non-matches caused by players trying to start with a 'bad' deck to game the system. Another alternative would be to only eliminate a deck after it has won a match, so starting with a bad deck could mean you're stuck with it, though you'd probably want to implement a mercy rule (like, 3 losses and okay, you can draft a new one).
Certainly seems like a good way to get value out of any quarantine box purchased.
45
Just do it with a large cube.... I want to build a cube again now
24
Not everyone has a cube lying around, and some players like to crack packs. I pretty much treat my collection like one big sealed pool as it is - maintaining a stable of casual commander decks and modifying them as I obtain new cards, but I can count the number of singles I've purchased on one hand. Buying individual cards and optimizing just isn't how I approach constructed Magic - it might be more cost effective, but I'd rather spend $100 on a box and figure out how to integrate the contents into my existing decks (which is fun and interesting in its own right) than buy a couple singles that will slide into a few decks and while they might be better, it's a lot more linear a process.
In an ideal world, I'd be obtaining new cards from limited play and prize packs, but there aren't a ton of events going on because of the whole global pandemic thing. I've definitely spent more money on sealed product since the pandemic started, but, incidentally, a lot less on Magic as a whole, as in a normal year I'd have attended a few Grand Prix at this point.
3
Then why not try building a cube with that same "what I have lying around" approach? That's what I intend to do. A not super tuned cube can still be fun.
9
You may have fun with it yourself, but it's likely to be horrifically balanced most likely and at the very least restricted (your worst colour pair will dictate the highest possible power level).
To each their own of course, but I think doing this with the leftovers of a supreme draft are going to turn out more fun than a full cube would be.
-4
Isn't this called rich man draft and been around a long time?
36
Yes, expect this has two picks per pack with 18 packs, rather than one pick with 36. And neither form has been on Online before.
31
Yup, re-hashing and standardizing the format for official release. It's a fine strategy that's worked well in the past; why not?
17
There's definitely no reason to not do it, and I am actually of the position that formats should continue to proliferate. I'd rather have a thousand formats to choose from and let the popular ones grow naturally. Then those could be the ones that get official support.
Like... what if Returns Vs Og sets is cool and just nobody knows it yet? Like first, pick a faction - Return or OG. If you pick Return, then you can make a deck from any set where we've returned to a plane. Og would be the original set. If changes need to be made to make it more fun, go for it. If it dies, then ok that was a shitty idea.
While my example my be bad or short-sighted in a way, my broader intent is to create a space that lets formats come into fruition, and flicker out and die naturally. Standard sucks, ok let it change by whomever has a good idea, or let it die. Let something else take its place.
7
I'm here for this comment. I had the same reaction. I guess they are technically different, but i am a little weirded out they didn't reference Rich Man draft in the article. I mean they ran it at the WotC store in the 90s and seem to have no memory of that.
7
but i am a little weirded out they didn't reference Rich Man draft in the article
Because of what that implies. They're not saying the silent part out loud.
9
So for 10 tix you get to draft with 18 packs of MH1? My poor wallet....
31
Phantom, you don't keep the cards.
84
Dang. That’s cool, too. I loved MH1 as a draft format.
15
I read this before I clicked to the article. Then I read that it's Phantom and was sad. Still, a really neat format.
17
And it looks like there’s no prize packs awarded either. They could’ve done it so much better
-25
Phantom is obviously the right way to go so people can actually draft decks for gameplay instead of having to consider the value of moneydrafting like half the time. And phantom events always have the same - pretty reasonable — payout structure.
31
I was just hoping we could get some more MH1 opened an into the market. One day.
3
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1
how are they going to fit the sour cream and tomatoes into the packs
30
I really enjoy these events, but I hate the fact that they're always Phantom drafts. If they're trying to motivate people to play MTGO more, just make the damn drafts add to your collection already.
15
Doing keep-the-cards draft here seems like it would be prohibitively expensive. Even if they half the price of the booster because you're only keeping two cards (ignoring the fact that there are very few boosters with more than two cards worth anything), for 16 packs of Horizons, you're looking at $64. If it were full price, it would be $128.
50
Well, yeah. I was just ranting that it feels bad to open a card that you really want in your collection, and knowing you won't get to keep it. The events would be pricier, yes, but I'm just daydreaming.
-14
When they're not Phantom, everyone just complains that the EV is horrible in the sets and that the prize support is awful. Besides, how much do you think a non-Phantom Supreme Draft would cost when the format is built basically around enabling you to rare draft every pick?
21
The problem with MTGO events is they cost way too damn much, they definitely don't need to be even more expensive so I can keep a bunch of junk I'm just going to trade in.
I'd be in for a few of every event if they were a couple bucks each, but at $10+ a pop to go 0-2 drop, maybe eke out a 1-2 and get half an entry back? Nah, man, pass. MTGO is littered with players who dropped $50 in an afternoon with literally nothing to show for it but a frustrating experience in an outdated client so they keep the lights on for pros and grinders that beat the tar out of them to go infinite. I usually play one or two legacy cube drafts then its donzo for the next year for me.
1†
Nice! A way to get some play value out of some of the booster boxes I've been sitting on! I love cracking packs but have hit the point where doing it without playing in some way feels like a waste, this sounds awesome.
12
I'm actually thinking there could be some fun replayability too. I've often thought about just keeping the cards from boxes I open together as a sort of pre-built set cube for drafting repeatably but don't have enough friends who play for a full pod... But this could enable my best friend and I to just grab a mix of "packs" from my boxes and have a blast!
4
I wonder what drafting a cube like this would be like... I have some testing to do.
10
https://www.channelfireball.com/all-strategy/articles/cube-design-grid-drafting-and-more/
I'd try tenchester instead, since it allows you to see more of the cube while drafting. Not an issue in a regular set, where what you see is basically just up to what ended up in your packs, but definitely an issue for cube.
5
I hate tenchester. Grid drafting is my current go-to, but it's time consuming and still has the same issue that Winchester, Winston, tenchester, and Rochester have. It doesn't actually feel like drafting in magic.
3
So then, how is Supreme draft any different?
3
I don't know yet, I haven't tried it, I've tried the others and grid drafting was the best of them. If supreme is better, then it's better. If it's not, then it's not.
My suspicion is that opening full packs and getting to actually pick from a pool is going to feel a hell of a lot better, and being able to run it concurrently with the other player is a huge swing in it's favour. It also allows the potential of adding draft matters cards again, which are clunky in tenchester and just straight up don't work in grid or the other forms of drafting.
I can't say that Supreme will be better, but I can say that I've tried most 2 player drafts and that, on paper, it sounds like it has potential.
3
I think if you were doing a cube then you could alter the packs depending on it's size. Mine is a weird size (405) so I could do packs of 10 cards and each player would come out with 40 cards.
360 might be a bit rough since there would only be 24 packs of 15 cards.
This is my favorite resource for 2 player cube...
My friend and I really enjoy Poker Draft (think it's under sealed variants).
1
I've seen that one yeah.
I actually think that's an advantage. If you go all the way through the cube, you can reshuffle the remainder into new packs and redraft those, possibly seeing cards you wish you'd taken but couldn't.
1
That's true! That's a pretty good idea.
1
This is just a powered up sealed not a draft, in a drafting sense.
10
This is just a powered up sealed not a draft, in a drafting sense.
It's kind of a weird blend - it's sealed, but it plays more like draft since you make decisions without future knowledge the way you would in a draft
1
Seems odd that they have a timer for picks
6
When you see them talking about how much of an ordeal it was just to have 2 picks for a pack, is it really that surprising that getting rid of the timer was deemed as too much effort?
10
draft isn't optimized for two players? winnnstooooooon
6
bork! bork bork!
1
I love the fact that in 2020, MTGO can still do fun and innovative stuff!
5
In one of the old Ramona books, there was a story where Ramona finds a crate of apples and takes one bite out of each one, because the first bite is the best, and then the adults have to make applesauce out of the bitten apples.
This feels a bit like that. I realize that it's all digital, but it still feels wrong somehow
5
Only $2000 for 18 packs of vip double masters...
4
VIP boosters, like all collectors boosters, are not meant to be drafted.
0
joke's on you i only draft with Italian legends.
2
Not sure how I feel about it but I'll give it a shot, something new is always welcome. With regards to modern horizons though they need to flash it back again non-phantom (regular draft style) or do something with it as force of negation prices are out of control at the moment. Either that or up the treasure chest drop rate a bit, would rather have regular draft back though.
3
Dang, that sounds really fun. Especially excited for the Ravnica launch, since I’ve always had a thing for Ravnica plane Cubes. Will almost certainly be doing some of these over the weekend!
2
This sounds awesome.
Pls give year of modern supreme flashbacks.
2
Open a pack, take two cards, THROW THE PACK ON THE GROUND
I THREW THE REST OF THE CHAFF TOO
WHAT DO I LOOK LIKE, A PAUPER PLAYER?
I'M NOT PART OF THE SYSTEM
MAN, THIS AIN'T MY DAD. THIS IS A BOOSTER PACK
Maaaan, I was hoping you'd say "I'm not a part of that format" :(
"I'M AN ADULT!"