r/fightsticks•
Zevaeros

The Keyboard Switch Pushbutton / Mechanical Switch Pushbutton FAQ

Tutorial or Review

(reposting as it seems to have been snagged by the spam filter; links removed)

What are keyboard switch pushbuttons (KSPBs)?

Pushbuttons generally use a switch of some kind that, when pressed down, allows a circuit to complete and thus send a signal to their control board (PCB) which is then interpreted and sent to the host device.

Keyboard switch pushbuttons (aka KSPs, or mechanical switch pushbuttons) use industry standard Cherry MX or clone switches inside of them in some capacity to achieve that effect, but with some distinctive advantages.

Why do I want keyboard switch pushbuttons?

There are a number of reasons:

  • Durability. The average Sanwa microswitch is rated for 1 million activations. Some Cherry MX switches are rated up to 100 million (though a more conservative 50-70 million is about the average).
  • Customization. Do you like your buttons to be quieter? Have a shorter activation distance? Lighter or heavier resistance? By changing the switch used in your button, you instantly affect how the button responds. And, you can alter any button to be different. For example, if you want high speed, silent light punches but clicky, slightly longer activation heavy attacks, just put in the appropriate switches.

Why do I not want keyboard switch pushbuttons?

  • Cost. Mechanical pushbuttons just cost more (to start, anyway).
  • Difficult to Obtain. Sometimes, anyway. GamerFinger buttons have become excruciatingly difficult to obtain, for example.
  • Not willing to mod. If you're not comfortable changing your stick this isn't for you.

What installable pushbuttons use mechanical switches?

  • B0XX 20MX. Installs into 24mm Sanwa OBSF buttons (similar idea to the Paradise Arcade OBS-MX). Comes preinstalled with Gateron Clear (linear, 35g) switches. Appears to use PCB-mount switches and cannot be swapped without desoldering/resoldering.
  • Gamerfinger HBFS. Available (ostensibly; see GamerFinger-specific question below) in 24mm and 30mm (screw-in and snap-in) with a wide variety of bodies and keycaps. Uses plate mount switches. Easy to swap key caps and switches without opening your case. Has a octagon body shape. Would be ideal for most people but has order fulfillment issues.
  • Layer Shift/OmniArcade O720s. Coming soon (May? June?) in 24mm and 30mm. From early pictures, switches are PCB mount. LS says these will have hot swap capability for switches.
  • Paradise Arcade OBS-MX. A modification for the Sanwa OBFS button only available in 30mm. Has a few pre-made keyswitch options as well as a DIY, bring your own keyswitch option that requires soldering. Switches for the DIY variant are PCB mount.
  • PurpleMagicBellAnime's wood buttons. Available (in limited quantities) on Etsy in 30mm (24mm coming), uses speed silver switches by default. Unknown switch mount type.
  • Samducksa/Crown SDB-202. Available in 24mm and 30mm in a variety of solid, translucent, and metallic options. Uses plate mount switches. Often out of stock at many stores (see FAQ below). More difficult to change the keyswitch in (requires removing the button from your case), but comes in traditional round form factor. Has some incompatibility with certain switches (tl;dr stick with Cherry and Kailh non-box, standard profile). Note: Paradise Arcade Shop has pads available for the 202 that reduce travel length and noise, if you're looking for quieter or quicker presses.
  • Samducksa/Crown SDB-201. Available in 30mm in both solid and translucent colors. This series does NOT use Cherry MX compatible switches, instead opting for Futaba switches. (Mentioning them just for completeness)

What fightsticks come with keyboard switch pushbuttons pre-installed?

  • Frame1 Heavy and Frame1 Light. The F1 Heavy uses (Gateron) optical switches, while the F1 Light uses regular mechanical switches. The buttons in the F1 appear to be integrated into the case and are not removable (the switches and keycaps are).
  • Junk Food Customs Snack Box Micro: Similar to the F1; built-in keyswitches that are changeable; uses Kailh low profile switches.
  • Paradise Arcade MPress. Like the F1, this doesn't use removable buttons but mounts the switches directly to a board and puts an OBS-MX plunger on top with the case providing the surrounds. There is an option to have hot swap sockets added so you can change the keyswitches.
  • Razer Panthera Evo. The (30mm) pushbuttons here use mechanical keyswitches as reported by the vendor, though not sure the buttons are available separately (or if they're Crown 202 rebrands). Razer says that spares are not widely available for this at this time. Unknown switch mount type.

What buttons are compatible with my stick?

The compatibility issue has two fronts: button size matching and snap-in vs. screw-in buttons. For the first, you want to determine the button size you have (usually 24mm or 30mm) and look for the appropriately matching size. After that, just check to see if your stick uses snap-in or screw-in style buttons, and get the appropriate matching style.

How do I install these? Most of the above are installed just like a regular pushbutton. A general purpose guide (assuming you are replacing buttons) is:

  1. Gather tools and a parts tray (screwdrivers, pliers, etc.)
  2. Take before pictures, just in case
  3. Install the switches of your choice into the new buttons, if applicable
  4. Open up your stick
  5. Take before pictures of the internals, just in case
  6. Remove the two wires from existing button (if present) - you may need a precision flathead screwdriver to loosen the quick disconnects if they're obstinate
  7. Remove the existing button (for snap-ins, consider using a purpose-built tool to remove them without breaking tabs, especially for Sanwas)
  8. Place the replacement button
  9. Connect wires (make sure to test that the connection is firm once placed; if you bent the quick disconnect curls earlier, use some pliers to carefully squeeze them back down)
  10. Repeat for other buttons you are replacing (recommend you go one at a time to avoid crosswiring buttons)
  11. Connect your fightstick and test to make sure all buttons work
  12. Close up your case if all buttons work properly

If you want a video demo, see my Zero to Fightstick series on YouTube.

Where can I get key switches? While you can find them at places like Amazon and eBay, there are specialty shops:

  • FlashQuark
  • Kbdfans
  • MechanicalKeyboards
  • NovelKeys (note: some security plugins may false flag this site, unknown why)

What switches do I want?

Short answer: It depends.

The first thing you need to know is the difference between plate mount and PCB mount switches. For most cases, PCB mount switches have two extra plastic stabilizing pins that plate mount switches do not. If you get PCB mount switches but need plate, you can cut these tabs off with a nail or side clipper (and maybe sand a little with a file). I've tried to list the needed switch type in the products above.

Once you've figured that out, you then need to determine what switches you want to try. A lot of the above mentioned sites allow you to buy 10 or so switches for cheap, so don't be afraid to test some sets out. Still, here's a process anyone can use to figure out what works for them:

  • Do you want more sound on activation or not? If so, look for clicky switches.
  • If you don't want clicky, do you like a slight (but quiet) bump on activation? If yes, tactile. If not, linear.
  • How much travel do you want before activation? If you want faster activation, look for shorter travel (speed series from Kailh or Cherry - 1.1mm to 1.4mm). If you want longer activation distance, look for 2.0mm or longer (most switches). (Keep in mind there are activation distances and bottom out distances).
  • How much pressure do you want to have to apply? Gateron clears are the lightest touch at 35g; greens from Gateron and others are around 60-70g. Novelkeys has the Kailh Pro Heavy series which has 70g activation force and 1.7mm travel.
  • In short, increased pressure requirements and travel length will cause presses to take slightly longer and be more deliberate. Decreased will allow more rapid fire. If you're using KSPBs as option buttons, consider using clicky, high pressure, and long travel switches to make them a bit harder to activate.
  • Optical switches are only compatible (at this time) with the Frame 1 Heavy.
  • This thread has more details about compatible switches for the Crown 202s and GamerFingers: https://www.reddit.com/r/fightsticks/comments/eliye0/crown_202_vs_gamerfingers_mechanical_switch_guide/

What are some key switch brands?

  • Cherry - The original and de facto standard. Popular switches include speed silver, blue, and red.
  • Kailh - Several variants (and some of my favorites). Includes the speed silver, copper, bronze, and gold series, pro series, and several more.
  • Gateron - Several Cherry clones. Reportedly not as happy with Crown 202s.
  • Greetech - Several Cherry clones.

What are lubed switches? Some keyboardists like to disassemble and grease their (linear and tactile, not clicky) switches for smoother travel. If you're thinking about doing this, you'll want the following:

  • Lube of your choice
  • Applicator brush
  • Disassembly station (recommended)
  • Keyswitch opener
  • Trays for parts

There are plenty of tutorials on how to do this on YouTube. Whether or not it improves performance in a fightstick is yet to be seen.

Where can I get GamerFinger buttons now?

Because this comes up often and Focus Attack no longer carries them, USA customers have a few options, but be warned, as of June 2021, it's bleak. At last report according to Sengoku Densyo on 5/9/2021, GF is still searching for a new factory.

First, watch eBay, r/FightSticksForSale, etc. for GamerFinger sales. Pray hard to the IRL RNG gods. Expect to pay a premium here.

Second, you can try to order from the GamerFinger shop (be sure to specify HTTPS) but be prepared to wait. Users have reported 3-6 month wait times, and received orders only after threatening to cancel their payments. Requests for service have gone largely ignored, and the company's Twitter account has been dormant. This is probably the least expensive route.

Third, you can try using something like White Rabbit Express to order from Sengoku Arcade Shop direct from Japan. This is super pricey, however. As of 5/30, Sengoku has some limited stock!

Fourth, there's the Taobao route (Google search "Taobao Gamerfinger"). Some people have reported using a buying service called Superbuy, and there is an entire website dedicated to showing how to order from there (howtotao.com).

Fifth, try Mercari (especially Mercari Japan). For Mercari Japan, try using Sendico as a purchaser. (credit to u/Mr_Voltiac for this).

Finally, there's the usual response: "Dude, just buy Crown 202MXs".

But where can I get Crown 202MXs?

Yes, the 202MXs tend to be low stock in the common places (e.g. FA, AS, PAS), but are available via ISTMall, eBay, and Qoo10.

Did this guide help? Please upvote. Thanks!

Change Log:

  • 04092021: Added Crown SDB-201 and corrected some SDB-202 details.
  • 04152021: Added PurpleMagicBellAnime's wood buttons.
  • 04222021: Added beginner compatibility and installation instructions as well as "where do I get 202MXs".
  • 04232021: Updated PCB/Plate mount switch notes.
  • 04262021: Revised how to get GFs notes.
  • 04282021: Revised products section & added note about PAS' Crown 202 mod.
  • 04302021: Added new question about pre-installed KBSPB fightsticks and moved RPE into it, added Frame1 Heavy and Light.
  • 05012021: Corrected Frame 1 info, thanks u/natedawgn
  • 05052021: Added Gamerfinger purchasing avenue (Mercari JP)
  • 05092021: Added BOXX 24mm info, thanks u/Chris_H_Nguyen
  • 05112021: Added PAS MPress
  • 05142021: Updated GamerFinger info.
  • 06032021: Added SnackBox Micro & Sengoku restock info for GFs

Posted Apr 6, 2021, 5:06 PM UTC Ā· edited

2346
gssmr•

Hello, keyboard hobbyist and casual lurker of this sub. If you have any questions, you can feel free to pm me or reply. I'm gonna share a few things I've discovered after a few years of messing with keyboards and switches.

  • The quality of cherry brand switches is up to how new their moulds are. Because of how many switches they produce globally, you're more likely than not to get really scratchy switches. I avoid cherry now except for really specific uses

  • the most common lubricant for tactile switches is krytox 203 grade 0 and for linears, krytox 205 grade 0. A frequent mistake beginners make is to overlube the switch, making it slower to push and return. If you're lubing switches for the first time, I recommend using 204g0 for linears as it's less viscous than 205. Don't lube clicky switches.

  • different tactile switches have different sizes in tactile events(cherry brown vs cherry clear) as well as shapes (p shape with no pretravel vs d shape with pre travel vs D shape the whole press is part of the tactile event).

  • switches can be made of different materials such as polycarbonate, nylon, and POM. Generally it just affects sound and sometimes smoothness.

If you wanna get sucked over into the rabbit hole, feel free to check out r/switchmodders!

6
ZevaerosOP•

Thanks, this is good stuff. Do you mind if I integrate it into future revisions, giving you credit?

2
gssmr•

Go ahead! Hopefully more people will contribute their knowledge as well

2
HesRizen•

Hello!

Awesome post of you!

I got a few questions: What is high actuation mean?

Is it really "that bad" to lube the stem legs from tactile?

Specific on gamerfinger buttons: Found out just mx cherry housing is working 100% with the gamerfinger buttons.

-> does switching from saying other switches the spring / stem or a single of these two make that much difference?

Thx in advance your post really is helpful

1
D__B__D•

Got my Gamerfingers from Sengoku and took only 2 weeks. Just waiting for my batch from Taobao. Should be the same estimated delivery to Canada.

​

If anyone is looking for quietest buttons for Hitbox with Gamerfingers - use Bobagum silent linear switches. Swap the spring from the original Cherry MX Silvers that comes default with Gamerfingers so you don't get that mushy feeling.

I can attest that this is WAY quieter than HRAP 4 silent

​

​

Please note that GamerFingers are the quietest due to padding inside the buttons.

4
HesRizen•

is the button registration different than cherry mx silvers ?

is the travel distance the same from bobagum and cherry mx silver?

1
HesRizen•

did you keep the mx cherry housing, and changed to stem and spring ?

1
D__B__D•

Yeah I took the default switches out and put bobagums in. For the movement Hitbox buttons I just placed the original cherry mx springs on the bobagums for a stiffer press

2
HesRizen•

Question : is there a difference between clear and pink housing? Which bobagum housing you got?

1
D__B__D•

Got pink housing. Only need ot if you are planning to use lights but I dig the colour

2
HesRizen•

Yo, tried the bobagums, lubed em and they are soo super silent!

But, buttonpressing got bad, and after trials and errors, found out the bobagum housing using outemu housing which is slightly bigger than mx cherry housing. Forcing inputs to drop sometimes.

I used the bobagum stem inside the mx cherry housing , kept the speed silver spring , and buttonpress got normal again.

Did qhat Alex Nostalgix did in his most recent espada fightstick video, where he also said outemu switches housing caused him problems at button pressing, also used the outemu sky stem ( and spring) in the mx cheryy housing for normal presses again.

Overall bobagum is suuper gud, even though im just using the stem now , its still worth

1
D__B__D•

I’m glad you like it!

Probably one of the best uses for gamerfingers Sengoku Japan has the 24mm buttons in stock again

Grab them while you can folks! Get those white rabbit accounts ready!!

https://www.sengoku.co.jp/mod/sgk_cart/search.php?st=40&cid=5633

2
HesRizen•

Ordered from ISTMALL about crown 202 buttons , ebay on 26th April, and 3 days later i got paying tax notification in the morning, paid it, and mail arrived with the buttons.

From Korea to EU in 3 days dayyyum

3
HesRizen•

sengoku restocked some 30mm buttons!!!!

https://www.sengoku.co.jp/mod/sgk_cart/search.php?cid=5759

grab your white rabbit shipping agent accounts guys and lets go!!!!

3
HushMySweetmod•

Great post!

2
ZevaerosOP•

Thanks. Trying to tamp down on some of the common questions that come up about this topic.

1
Brozilean•

I'd highly suggest ZealPC switches for tactile or linear switches. I consider them better than cherry for typing but haven't tried it with arcade buttons yet.

2
HesRizen•

thank you very much for this perfect REDDITPOST! This should get an gold award man!

Before I read this i went the TAOBAO road to get myself some gamerfinger buttons. Now on the way shipped to me. I used Superbuy as a shipping service since i dont know chinese.

2
ZevaerosOP•

Thanks. I'll refine the Taobao note since this is the second time I've seen Superbuy mentioned.

1
HesRizen•

google translate can be used on taobao too... but since its a seller there using taobao as a platform, communication is not possible or very hard.

Superbuy as an shipping agent clearing things for you, I asked the service few times about some stuff and the communication is top. at the time of writing: at taobao there are just PUSH-INS available , and BLACK plunger available ( the transluscent is out of stock and screw ins too).

Sakura buttons out of stock.

rest available atm.

2
natedawgn•

Frame 1 switches are removable but you can only swap out optimal switches on the frame 1 heavy and regular mechanical switches on the frame 1 heavy. Can't switch do vice versa though.

2
ZevaerosOP•

Yes, the switches are removable, but the buttons are not, since they're integrated into the frame. I'll clarify this, thanks

1
HesRizen•

24mm GAMERFINGER buttons are out of stock on TAOBAO!

30mm still available as push in buttons, some colours out of stock though.

2
ZevaerosOP•

Thanks for the heads up.

1
HesRizen•

Per superbuy tracking, my order is on the way to me. First time the package qas denied flight, due to x ray couldnt see clearly whats ibside appearantly, 2 days ago it got cleared for flight on second attempt.

Will keep you updated how the gamerfinger ordering worked out

2
SuperBadAkuma•

There's a store on Taobao with the name "Punk Workshop" (username is "d3qnew") that sells buttons with Cherry silvers and also some slimmer buttons with Cherry low profile reds. They do sell enclosures with these buttons installed too. However, they only offer freight shipping which the seller advised is not very economical if you're buying a small number of buttons. (I asked about shipping to the UK it may be different for other countries).

2
ZevaerosOP•

Hm, not having much luck finding them...

1
SuperBadAkuma•

Type "d3qnew" on Taobao and click the search button. Then a little drop down should show up on the search bar for switching from products to shop. It should be the first result after you switch to shop.

2
[deleted]•

[removed]

1
HesRizen•

Gamerfinger buttons arrived from Taobao!

Ordered around 23rd april, got it yesterday... i loitered a bit here and there and when i finally decided to let superbuys warehouse send it for delivery, it got sent back after 10ish days cuz it didnt get cleared by customs first. Second try it took like 5 days to arrive here.

In total if i would order again , and nothing goes south, it will take around 5 days from taobao seller to superbuy warehouse, then around 5-6 says delivery to me.

2
ZevaerosOP•

Nice. At least for now we know this can work, though seems that supply line may be drying up. šŸ˜”

2
HesRizen•

Ye just 30mm available atm. Lets hope later this year Gamerfingers is back.

1
HesRizen•

Gamerfingers out of stock on taobao :(

2
ZevaerosOP•

Hm, not surprised. I'm guessing it'll be a good 3-6 months before they get things together (or give up entirely, who knows). Guess we'll see. Thanks for the update.

2
HesRizen•

Messaged Vetash, per him Gf buttons have been in production for a while, very possible it will restock in 2-3 weeks

2
ZevaerosOP•

Noticed Sengoku had 24mms in stock

1
HesRizen•

Gamerfinger producing buttons again. Here on sengoku you see the 30mm green button having a new(?) / much different green than before .

Seems gf just selling at sengoku atm

https://twitter.com/sengoku_densyo/status/1404642384873357313?s=19

2
HesRizen•

Mentioned your guide in my guide my friend :p

2
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
Benigmatica•

Has anyone tried those optical keyboard switches for arcade button such as Razer or Keychron?

1
ZevaerosOP•

These require special boards to process the optical input, so they aren't compatible with any solutions out there. Your main control board would also need to be able to process the inputs - I've seen some of Razer's keypads process different levels of pressure and that would be dicey for tournaments (the one button per function rule).

I do agree being able to use them would be cool, given they're (allegedly) more durable though.

1
k6rip2you•

So for threatening to cancel payments to receive GamerFingers, where was this information sourced from? I've sent them an email after reading this in hopes that they actually ship them out to me lol. Man, it sucks that the company treats its customers this way :(

1
ZevaerosOP•

Multiple reports from the subreddit here, nevermind Focus Attack dropping them because they weren't responsive either.

EDIT: There's no guarantee this works, you are taking somewhat of a risk ordering GFs from their shop now; make sure you pay with something you can get your money back with if necessary.

1
Discoid•

I really want to try out some keyboard switch buttons but everything seems impossible to find these days. I've seen glowing reviews of the GamerFingers but was willing to "settle" for Crown SDB-202s or the PA MX buttons, but the former is out of stock everywhere and the latter doesn't fit 24mm buttons. :(

​

Hopefully they get restocked before Strive.

1
ZevaerosOP•

Set auto-notifications on eBay, etc. Check r/fightsticksforsale.

You can get the Crown 202s, just only in certain colors at the moment - I think ISTMall might have more variety too.

2
Discoid•

Never heard of ISTMall! I will check them out. I had been looking on Focus Attack and Paradise Arcade.

1
Discoid•

Forgot to say thanks, lol

1
ZevaerosOP•

No problem! Good luck, I'm waiting on a few colors myself to become available...

1
Chris_H_Nguyen•

Posted this earlier, but apparently the makers of B0XX have a mechanical key switch conversion kit for 24mm Sanwa buttons: https://www.reddit.com/r/fightsticks/comments/n7x56v/24mm_mechanical_switch_button_alternative/

1
ZevaerosOP•

Thanks! I was just about to add this...

1