Socialists
Posted Apr 20, 2021, 11:02 AM UTC
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sort of like when republicans claim to support democracy
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History has always demonized him as some kind of monster...but the reality is, Hitler was just another flawed human...like all the rest.
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That is some incredible nihilism you got there bud, you need to get that checked out.
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Can you explain to me how Hitler is any different than say, the Catholic Church during the crusades for example??
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I mean...I don't care to. They were both terrible and murderously ignoble examples of our species.
Am I misunderstanding your statement? It sounded like you were saying Hitler is as just as flawed as any of us, which is a sentiment I do take issue with.
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Yes Hitler was just as flawed as any of us. We all have the potential to become like him given the right environment and opportunity.
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This is a false quote. Hitler never said this.
The Nazis appropriated the name (National Socialists) and some of the language of the populist socialist movement in pre-WWII Germany to pull support away from the real Leftist movement of the time.
It was a lie. Nazis were/are a far-right party.
Where Socialists and other Leftists are anti-hierarchy, Nazis are fascist and highly hierarchical.
To even post this quote is a sure sign of bad faith. OP likely doesn't even know what a capitalist is, let alone a socialist.
https://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/riseofhitler/25points.htm
Read the entire nazi platform. Hitler was a socialist. Start at point 11 and work down from there. Socialism allowed Hitler to become a fascist, it wasn't his alleged conservatism.
Not trying to be mean, but do you have some kind of reading comprehension issue? You implied that Hitler and Strasser were buddies earlier, which couldn't be further from the truth.
And now you are trying to assert that the Nazis were somehow socialists. Which is, again, untrue, and no historical narrative will back that up.
So it's either your reading comprehension needs work or you are just arguing in bad faith.
Hitler was never a Leftist of any stripe. Again, you need to read some real history and listen to some experts on this. I think you have absorbed a toxic amount of right-wing popaganda.
You know what I'm not sure if they were socialist or not. Tbh
Well then read some history...
you're talking to the wrong person bud. please dont be insulting. ive not insulted you and do not want to, but will if you keep slinging insults at me.
Hitler was a leftist socialist, he was a radical for his time. if he was not a radical and changed how things were done, no one would ever say anything about him or bring him up and would have been lost to time.
conservatives usually want to stick to the status quo as we both know. if hitler had stuck to common conventions, he would be already forgotten. since he was a radical socialist, he changed all common conventions by force of government intervention. he did this by harnessing the power of the government to enact radical change and take over industry. if that is not socialist, idk what is. what he did was not status quo ergo not conservative.
I haven't insulted you, that was a genuine question. The snopes article you linked said that Hitler and Strasser were not allies. Hitler had Strasser and his followers killed. Yet you got that wrong, guessing because you didn't read it.
Next, addressing my assertion that you don't know what capitalism or socialism are was also genuine. Or would you prefer more political correctness? Plesse define socialism in your own words, steel-man style. No attacks, just factual, but in your own words, please.
The reason I am asking you you do that is because to have a good-faith debate we have to start with facts.
And you don't have them on your side. No history book backs your statements. Every history book backs mine. It isn't a personal attack to say you are wrong.
I know what socialism and capitalism are. I know what Hitler was. And the Soviets. And what China is. None are Left. Leftism is anti-hierarchy and values democracy so much that even the workplace has democracy.
Nazis didn't uphold those values. Neither did the Soviets or the Chinese. They were/are far-right fascists.
Next, please define fascism in your own words.
Here is my final assertion, because I don't expect you are going to give a good-faith reply, and if you don't I am just going to ignore you:
conservatism does not have to be fascist. It can just be conservative. So you don't have to be so defensive. You don't have to LARP in alt-fiction. There is no reason for it, if you aren't concerned that your party is fash too.
Now... the Republicans are 100% fascist. They still revere Trump, a terrorist. There are house-members trying to start white supremacist caucuses. It is a shitshow over there.
But you don't have to be a Republican. They have shit ideas anyway. You can be a conservative without being a fascist. Just don't vote for Trumpers or fascists. Easy peasy.
Oh and final thoughts, because I really don't think you are going going he able to define those concepts without making stuff up again:
conservatism is dying. By 2036, enough Boomers will have shuffled off this mortal coil to reduce Republican voter numbers by at least 10M nationwide. There won't be a shot for Republicans to hold the House or the White House ever again, and I am betting on GA being reliable Blue and TX being deep purple by then, which puts even the Senate pretty much out of reach permanently too.
And the thing that is killing your party is anti-intellectualism. By sticking to your guns, even when it is obvious to anyone knowledgeable of a given subject that you are wrong, you are not winning the debate any more than a pigeon playing chess is winning by knocking down the pieces, shitting on the board and strutting around like he won.
So think what you want, but know that it only works in the conservative echo chamber.
The Left waxes, the Right wanes. See ya at the polls, friend.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hitler-nazis-capitalist-system/ Sorry another Nazi said it and Hitler generally agreed with it. Close enough
Interesting that you say Hitler generally agreed with it.
This quote comes from the source you linked: "As it happens, Hitler was not a fan of Strasser’s ideas. While his efforts helped the Nazi’s with early electoral victories in the elections of 1928, his views became dangerously discordant with Hitler’s, and he was assassinated on Hitler’s orders in 1934."
Close enough.
Yeah... didn't Hitler famously murder the Strasserites? But he was cool with them. Sure. Sounds likely.
OP, let's try this again: Hitler initially appropriated the name and language of the Leftist movement to steal power for his own far-right movement. China and Russia have done similar things in the past (hi, Tankies). Far-right dictators know that they can't win elections or gain a large following by telling the truth about the awful things they truly want to do, so they clout-chase Leftist populist ideas. Sure, that is a tad reductive, but true at its essence.
Trump tried the same thing, always talking about "drain the swamp," and improving infrastructure, promises he never moved a pinky to accomplish, and and fact did the opposite of both. For Trump, he just wanted to give his dupes something to chant.
You are just wrong, dude. Again, I doubt you have much of an understanding of what capitalism or socialism are. It's all feels, no reals with you thus far.
Try reading some history and some theory if you want to bring a real argument (as opposed to a really dumb false meme). Watching OANN, Fox or Ben Shipiro is obviously not going to teach you anything.