Source
r/Sourdough•
PinBobAwl

Why don't professional bakers autolyse?

Let's discuss/share knowledge

Like most people on here (I'm guessing) I've watched a lot of YouTube videos of people making sourdough. One thing I keep seeing is that home bakers always stress the importance of autolyse for promoting gluten development, but whenever I watch I video of a professional bake in a shop or a micro bakery they don't do it. The routine always seems to be adding water to the bulk fermentation box, adding the starter to that and mixing it in to the water, then adding the flour and combining into a shaggy mixture.

I'm just curious if others have noticed this and if anyone has any thoughts. Happy baking!

Posted Apr 24, 2021, 9:21 AM UTC

710
_manchego_•

I found the same when I did a day course at a bakery - they had been doing autolyse but dropped it. They said there was no perceptible difference in the quality of the finished loaf (appearance and taste).

From a simple production engineering perspective if you remove a production step (and have the same finished goods) then your labour cost per loaf will go down (for manual processes). At the same sale price your margin is therefore higher.

Edit: if you wanted to get Lean on your process the it would be the E part of the ECRS method - Eliminate.

8
PinBobAwlOP•

This is the most recent pro bake I've watched:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8amVlwPv_GU

What they do after they've mixed the water, starter, and flour, is put it into a big mixing machine. I've heard some bakers talk about a 'fermentalyse' which is an autolyse with the starter added so that could be what's happening here. You can't really tell what their whole bulk fermenting process is from the video but it's a nice watch anyway.

2
_manchego_•

Nice serene video that! If autolyse is just the flour and some water for some time then this is a ‘fermentalyse’ as you say. I thought they were the same! In the video they are adding the leaven, water and flour and resting. Then water and salt in the mixer. You see them putting the salt scoop as a reminder.

I had forgotten one other reason they mentioned as well and that is to poka-yoke the process - i.e. mistake proof it. Less room for error if the ingredients are all added at the start. Bread without salt doesn’t taste good!

2
PinBobAwlOP•

Yeah I noticed the guy adding more water in the big kneading mixer–I'm guessing that's to help incorporate the salt or something? I have a stand mixer so I'm thinking of giving this whole process a shot at home.

1
BarneyStinson•

While your dough is sitting around idly in the mixer you cannot use your mixer. Maybe this is why?

2
H1GGS103•

I'm not convinced an autolyse does what it's said to do. I'm not saying this is scientific, but here's an observation I've made:

There's absolutely a difference between autolyse vs non-autolyse. However, in order to incorporate the starter, salt, and extra bit of water once the autolyse is complete, you really have to knead the dough again. I think this second round of kneading after x mins of rest is the real key. I was curious as to what affect that second round of kneading had vs just the autolyse, so I mixed the entire dough and instead of the first S+F happening after 30 mins I did another round kneading, as if I was doing the incorporation. I've noticed no difference between loaves I've given an autolyse, which still required 2 "kneadings" vs loaves I mix immediately and knead twice. I've done this "standard autolyse vs no autolyse with second knead" comparison between loaves of many different flour compositions (100% bread, 5-15% whole wheat, 5-15% rye, 5-10% whole wheat AND rye, etc.) and I've found no real difference between the 2.

2
PinBobAwlOP•

That's really interesting, thanks for the feedback!

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Rare-Ad-6423•

Professional baker here- we auto only for breads that have a second incorporation of water. We move dough into bins while it rests and continue mixing our other doughs that don’t require an auto.

2
PinBobAwlOP•

That's interesting–thanks!

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[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
szakee•

because (at least for bread flour / AP) there's no point in it.

0