How do exchanges stock up on HBAR?
this question is bugging me. i ask because i wonder: what is the relationship that hedera has with exchanges such as binance? the evidence suggests that binance engages in fraud, probably criminal; they purposely skirt all regulation they can - which is the opposite of how hedera seems to operate. for example hedera is registered in USA, is onshore - binance, who knows which offshore country they actually operate from (okay apples and oranges, on is an exchange one is DLT, but bear with me).
i know on this sub a lot of people, like in many crypto subs, people overall seemed upset by the regulatory crackdown on binance.. i hold a different view personally, but that is besides the point of this post..
what i am wondering, is, how does binance stock up on HBAR? do they buy them from hedera, or what?
i've been told on here, by a hedera employee - and i quote - that: "It is up to each exchange as to what they list, and it is not up to the DLT / crypto company."
whilst that may be true, how exactly does binance (or any exchange) acquire HBAR once they decide to sell them on to retail? i am genuinely curious, how does this work?
on a side note, i do wonder what is the position that hedera as company has on tether as a systemic risk in crypto - though i doubt we'll get an answer related to that.
Posted Jul 11, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC
Binance decides to support HBAR, you then deposit HBAR into your Binance account.
Maybe then you decide you want to sell it, you create an order saying how much you want to sell and at what price. Another user might want to buy HBAR, if they want to buy at the same price you want to sell, your HBAR will be sold.
If nobody wants to buy then you can't sell, or vice versa.
Binance isn't getting a secret stash of HBAR directly from Hedera Treasury. All HBAR which is on Binance (0.0.16953) has been deposited by users and is either being stored on the exchange, just been bought, or ready to sell.
edit - Binance HBAR account ID
so you're saying someone had to sell HBAR to binance first for them to have any to sell to other people?.. but then who was the first person to go and sell to them? forget about selling even.. think about buying. i go to buy from binance, not P2P. i buy from them - how do they have HBAR to sell to me, from day one? you're saying they simply got it from someone else?
i'm not saying it's a secret stash. clearly it's a public ledger, it's not a secret.. but did they not purchase HBAR from hedera or somewhere so that they had some to even sell from day 1 of listing? you're telling me they acquired 1.5 billion HBAR just off of retail sellers since they began listing it? but then how did all those people acquire over 1 billion HBAR to go and sell to binance? you're saying they got it off of another exchange? but how did the other exchange get it? does this really make sense?
You’re not buying from binance. You’re buying from somebody else, who is selling, using binance as the intermediary to make the exchange. Binance charges for every transaction, that’s how they make their money. They’re the middle man.
mmhm, i see. so it's kind of p2p on the surface even though it's centralized.. i mean in theory that is how it works. when you put HBAR onto an exchange, it's like putting dollars into a bank, right - so technically you don't have that crypto or fiat anymore. you own a credit for it and technically the money or crypto is the banks/exchanges.. so technically you place an order to buy from someone else, but really you are technically buying from binance since they have custody of the asset. and how many of the trades are necessarily legit? exchanges using orderbooks are given massive power to manipulate the market. i mean exchanges are known to engage in wash trading and set fake buy/sell orders to push up prices or whatever. whether they do that specifically with HBAR i don't know, but i wouldn't put anything past binance or any exchange really since it's likely all automated anyway for all assets they list..
but what you are saying is HBAR essentially got on the market from founders and insiders that stacked early and proceeded to sell off to the retail market?
No, nobody sells HBAR to Binance. You're buying from other users who want to sell. It's the same for every other cryptocurrency listed on Binance and almost every other major exchange. Binance makes money from the transfer fee it imposes when you buy, sell and withdraw from their platform.
Users deposit HBAR onto the exchange. Look at Coinbase Pro and when they announced they were going to list Dogecoin (DOGE) for example.
"We will begin accepting inbound transfers of DOGE to Coinbase Pro. Trading will begin on or after 9am Pacific Time (PT) Thursday June 3, if liquidity conditions are met.
Once sufficient supply of DOGE is established on the platform, trading on our DOGE-USD, DOGE-BTC, DOGE-EUR, DOGE-GBP, and DOGE-USDT order books will launch in three phases, post-only, limit-only and full trading. If at any point one of the new order books does not meet our assessment for a healthy and orderly market, we may keep the book in one state for a longer period of time or suspend trading as per our Trading Rules."
Binance hasn't 'acquired' HBAR, it's HBAR belonging to users which is being stored or traded on their platform.
Nobody has sold any HBAR to Binance, people use Binance as a platform to buy/sell instead of searching the internet finding someone who wants to trade. Hedera sold HBAR as SAFT in 2017/18. You can read more about that here.
technically if the assets are in the binance wallet, they are binance's assets as soon as they are deposited. good on correcting me, i am learning - so the crypto is not "sold" to binance, it was simply deposited but they are still holding the asset in their custody. i see a lot of people are having difficulty withdrawing crypto from binance these days, you can see it all over reddit or twitter or whatever - irrelevant to this discussion..
we don't actually know how binance makes their money. i mean they pay their employees in BNB crypto which would be like if mcdonald's employees were paid in mctokens that were created out of thin air instead of real money. i mean, binance is indefensible in my opinion. they make money in a variety of sketchy methods, not just fees. the can make money with the absurd leverage they offer, and then use their position to liquidate people. they are unregulated and have free reign to manipulate and extract from their users as they see fit to keep themselves afloat. we don't know what kind of fucked up deal they have going with tether, but i mean, considering how closely knit you have to be to be an insider with those guys, i can only imaging what is going on behind the scenes there..
anyway, honestly, binance just sketches me the fuck out. so i wondered, how does hedera interact with them? if you're telling me they have no relationship, well that is good.
one last thing here: when hedera distributes new coins from the treasury during their release schedule - who gets these newly freed HBAR? council members? employees? i know this info is somewhere on the hedera website, but i mean you seem to be knowledgeable about this stuff so i'm asking you.
You can find previous and this month HBAR distributions here: https://help.hedera.com/hc/en-us/articles/360002789198-When-are-the-next-distributions-of-hbars-scheduled-
We know how binance and coinbase make money. It's from fees.