Source
r/DotA2•
Divinations

Wisp + Sand King ulti combo

I just played a game where SK would channel his ult at the same time as Wisp's teleport ultimate and they would jump into the middle of anywhere they wanted, killing absolutely everything in sight. Oh and they also had a Lifestealer inside one of them.

How is it even possible to counter this?

My main argument though - is this fair? Surely the channel should be disrupted during wisp's teleport? Probably not, but there is no indicator that this shit storm is about to hit you. None whatsoever.

EDIT: For all the dota1 players who clearly think there is an indicator for when Wisp is TPing in - there is not. Apparently this is a bug.

Posted Jul 4, 2012, 12:36 AM UTC · edited

69112
TheScissorshttp://dotabuff.com/players/70013458•

Sounds like fun.

139
Minimumtypayy lmao•

Does it? Let me find Anti-Mage. I'll fix that for you real quick.

67
CountDunkula•

The farming has been completed, and now it's time to end fun once and for all.

26
forgot_old_account•

I like to buy everything

5
bovedieu•

Good luck against N'aix in there.

17
Tetraca•

Keep your mana, anti mage, it's your life I'm after.

6
SufferixNevermore•

Lifestealer and Lich. Saying badass things, all day err'day.

1
Brosephski•

HAHAHA oh man I remember that comic HAHA yeah hey I got a great idea let's start going down that road you know the one the meme road where funny = familiarity and we build up our special reddit culture with things "only le we" understand

or please no.

-9
KinkyFalcon:pup:•

It's a quite a funny comic and which isn't exclusive to Reddit but the whole DOTA/2 community.

Stop being buttravaged over nothing.

4
SufferixNevermore•

I remember Magebane being referred to as the no fun hero as well. This is a common comment that's been around for years.

3
loveisdead•

Even if teleport did cancel channeling, Wisp could use teleport just as the SK ult went off with nearly the same effect.

Its a good combo, but like any combo there are ways to get around it. Essentially its just SK placement. He can surprise initiate on any teamfight with blink dagger or a good burrowstrike. Just need to be cognizant of your location on the map. Epicenter has a long cooldown, so he's not going to want to use it to take out just one hero in the mid/late game. If he has used Epicenter, you know there's two minutes where its not available, so push in.

23
generho•

Epicenter has a relatively low cooldown (100) compared to other team-fight breaking ultimates like... Tide's Ravage (150) and Enigma's Blackhole (180) and Silencer's Global Silence (160).

Epicenter is a medium length cooldown, almost guaranteed to be up for every teamfight. It's actually a fairly tight window to push into SK's base post-ult if you factor in things like unpushed-lanes, and hurt teammates heading to heal etc after the teamfight where the ult was used. The enemy team can delay your push long enough possibly if they're smart about managing SK's cooldown.

3
DivinationsOP•

It's a clever combo for sure, but remember that wisp TP is essentially a risk free blink dagger for SK. The only solid counter would be an early pipe or a BKB on all your team, or absolute control of the map (which is difficult to do in pubs unless you get an exceptional early game).

On top of that, a 2 minute cooldown is very little if the last ult killed most of your team (or at least helped in the process) considering respawn times and the time it will take to push back the lanes.

Map awareness is naturally important, but they can do it from base - and you're going to have to push sometime with more than 1 hero. Baiting it would be another option, but again it would be a risk.

-1
Balorothhttp://steamcommunity.com/id/Baloroth•

There is a casting delay and the enemy has a visual indicator on the minimap at the target location before the teleport occurs.

(from dota2wiki/playdota) So... just line up a combo stun for when the Wisp/SK is supposed to arrive. You can interrupt the channel, if he channels before just straight-up kill him right away or run away from the point he is arriving at, wasting his ultimate.

Wisp is extremely powerful right now, he might get nerfed soon(ish), but until then, really the only answer to good teamplay is good teamplay.

8
tagus•

Wisp is extremely powerful right now, he might get nerfed soon(ish), but until then, really the only answer to good teamplay is good teamplay.

Quote for the ages

14
MaaaetiiiieN•

changed my life

3
bashjeee•

fight FIRE with FIRE

2
gryts•

It seems like when people make these threads, what they are really saying is: If a pro team were to use a strat like this against a pub, the pub would literally have no chance! It must be overpowered!

2
DrQuotaBy the red mist.•

There is no visual indicator as of right now in Dota2, whether this is on purpose or not is still a mystery but as it stands Wisp can teleport anywhere on the map without showing a visual indicator to the enemy.

11
Utoko•

there should be in my opinon

3
tagus•

fyi though there is an audial indicator

2
Balorothhttp://steamcommunity.com/id/Baloroth•

Then that is a bug, there is supposed to be one. I believe it was already reported on the dev forums, but if not feel free to do so.

1
DerpaNerb•

"The only solid counter would be an early pipe or a BKB on all your team"

Or just don't group up?

6
whatwhywhyAsk•

This is like :"

op: guys im dying!!!

Answer: oh, dont die ...

-6
DerpaNerb•

Not really.

It's more like

OP: guy's I'm dying to something that is easily avoidable Answer: Learn to play and avoid it...

4
NavierfuckingStokes•

I was thinking maybe a force staff to break the tether when they TP in.

1
bsterling604•

if you've got a force staff, then its safe to assume a couple of your teammates have one too against this combo, so when he comes in, its mroe beneficial to all force your selves away then to try and split the tether.

0
W2T•

Honestly, it's no different from wisp teleporting anywhere with anyone - big sudden surprise damage.

20
themoop•

I think you see where wisp tp so it should be pretty easy to dodge no?

14
DivinationsOP•

There is no indicator. There is only a particle effect on the floor on his return location when the 12 second duration is up.

4
Pyros•

Yeah it's a bug, it's getting fixed next patch. You'll see a little marker where wisp is teleporting to and you can haul ass out of there during the channel time.

36
ProfMoustache•

maybe it's just me but I've seen a little particle effect on the ground and that's been plenty enough indication of when he is coming in.

-1
DivinationsOP•

It's just your imagination ;)

0
DivinationsOP•

That's a legitimately game ruining bug, at least it will be fixed soon.

-2
RiiBzxX•

According to me, a suitable nerf would be a huuuge ass indicator where he is about to tp. Or just an indicator of some sort.

1
sonicfreak02•

The bigger the ass on the indicator, the better.

1
underground4550WE COME IN PEACE•

it is also supposed to ping the map where wisp is teleporting to as well.

-2
Pathardhttp://tf2b.com/d2/Pathard•

Wisp's teleport doesn't stun the target being teleported. It's the same reason that a team-mate can force-staff an ulting Sand King into the middle of a fight.

A friend of mine and I did the Sand King + Wisp drops last night. Commendations and laughter were had by all.. even the enemy.

12
KnightingGale•

It did interrupt channeling DotA 1. I'm not sure if it is an intended change since it allows you to effective cancel the recall aspect of Relocate by TPing home 3 seconds before you get brought back.

2
philatanusyo soy tu papa•

Replay #?

1
Pathardhttp://tf2b.com/d2/Pathard•

#23834075 For some reason the site still labels me as "My Anus is ready!", but I haven't used that name in about a month or so.

11
jacksch•

Sure.. sure

52
CarutAXE GON' GIVE IT TO YA•

Can I?

2
Xenasishttp://steamcommunity.com/id/xenasis•

Of course, that's not counting your night job.

2
[deleted]•

[deleted]

5
GillyDaFish•

A couple nights ago there were two guys playing together, Wisp and SK combo. Both getting dagons. They were unstoppable

4
aCidrainGr•

I've played versus this combo a lot in matchmaking and it's actually more frustrating and risk free than you guys think. To all of you suggesting Pipe/BKB being a counter, i'd like to remind you that if the wisp and sk teleport right inside you, you instantly get stunned by tether for 2.25 and then followed up by burrowstrike, giving them essentialy a 3.9 seconds of free epicenter + spirits dps. The sooner the wisp and sk hit lvl 6 the faster your team will lose map control, as they ll free kill anyone on every relocate cooldown and effectively snowball to very high levels.

Imo they should really add a strong visual indicator to the relocated area just so the wisp cant tether-stun you instantly, so that they would have to teleport in the fog in order to gank effectively, just like prophet does and thus give you some reaction time.

I've also played versus wisp + aghs Tiny backdooring your base, which is equally painful as well.

4
ColumW•

There is SUPPOSED to be a visual indicator during the channel time. It's a bug that you can't see it. No worries!

1
ejabno•

Oh and they also had a Lifestealer inside one of them.

Damn that's one of the best strategies I've ever heard of.

3
EnjoyTheSauce•

Was doing this last night with a Wisp + Tide + Naix combo. Was pretty lols. Their team was too scared to gank anyone as we'd blink in and annihilate them.

2
Minimumtypayy lmao•

Get Furion and Spectre on that team too. ez

5
xUrEx•

I had to play agianst that sort of lineup. Tiny+Wisp+Spectre+Furion+Omni.

My team had no clue how to fight agianst that and constantly overextended. In the end my BKB+Scythe Storm couldn't face an "invulnerable" 5-man push.

2
onezerotwo•

Have your team re-item to buy a force staff or two, when Wisp and Sand King arrive, shove SK away and then scatter.

It's a one trick pony tactic that can be easily countered, problem is, you gotta see it coming.

(Not as easy as spotting Ursa + Wisp in the same lineup, that's for sure)

2
Krankor•

Wait for Disruptor to be added, cast Glimpse on SK or whoever Wisp ported in, and giggle like a small child as Wisp is blown up.

2
Arclacke•

Glimpse isn't instant, the "projetil" needs to arrive the location before the hero get teleported, it will take more than 12 secs.

1
Steampunk_Wille•

I love the CK + Wisp combo while laning, when CK uses rift while tethered it will most likely stun the enemy letting him get a few hits before having to use his chaos bolt, couple that with spirits and you got a pretty dead target.

1
Marxman119•

And Wisp could help with CK's early mana problems.

1
[deleted]•

if mana regeneration was working properly >=|

*they may have already fixed it

1
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
Bionic0n3•

Did this the very first game after time Wisp went live. It's a lot of fun to use early game but mid/late it becomes risky if the fight last more then 12 seconds. Since wisp gets teleported out and takes whoever is attached.

1
Rignite•

You might be describing my buddy's game lol

1
MrsWarboyszzzzzZZZAP!•

I did this on release day with my SK friend. So freakin funny. I'll get a link up once I get off work.

1
MisguidedWizard•

you can counter this with pipe, hood, mek, euls, force staff, hero abilities like blink, repel, windwalk, reincarnation or spellsheild, heart of tarasque, blademail, shadowblade, bloodstone, necrobook, bkb, split pushing, anticipating when there are 3 missing heroes, ageis, ganking the remaining 2 heroes, using smoke so they cant tell where you are, or just crazy amounts of farm on all of your heroes. you can also try to use counter initiators like enigma, earthshaker, vengeful spirit, tidehunter, panda to hit back with their own big ults. Or if you feel that this is completely overpowered you can use one of your 5 captain mode bans on some of the combo pieces.

1
Steamgear•

Well

I guess you could wait for Disruptor to be released, he sends you back to the place you where 4 seconds ago, Wisp and SK TP in, you send SandKing back to where he was 4 seconds ago and he wastes his Ult, focus on Naix and since he already used his ult, he won't be able to do shit, so you kill him

1
oOoWTFMATE•

There is an indicator. And you can use something called a pipe.. or a bkb.

1