For context I’m still pretty new to printing but have been making some nice RC prints, so this weekend I thought I’d try making the jump and try some fibre-based paper B&W printing. All of my prints were extremely over exposed all across my test prints. I was in the Hart House communal darkroom using a 1:9 dev. Any tips on making the jump from RC to FB paper would be awesome !
Posted Jul 17, 2023, 12:55 PM UTC
Just sounds like you need to adjust your exposure. Lots of variables when printing, so you just have to figure out time and aperture each time you print. my advice is don't bother with fiber, at least until you have a lot more experience. I don't think the extra hassle is worth it, unless you really know what you're doing (which is much more than I know, despite my username).
FB paper has some limitations:
It does not dry as flat as RC paper. You may try to do some hacks, but reality is that it's a bitch to get as flat as RC paper. I have an independent press to flatten it.
It needs a lot of extra washing time, and optical brighteners get washed away. RC paper needs 8-10 minutes at most, and it can be more 'whitish white'.
So, it's not necessarily 'better'. Use FB paper if you want, by all means, and is needed for 'serious business' aka exhibitions, but don't think you're missing out by not using oriental seagull fixed grade 3 for everything.
oriental seagull fixed grade 3
You must be old :-D (I know I am due to remembering this paper :-D)
50 now, printing since my early 20s.
RC washes for 10 mins? I've heard it will disintegrate with more than 10 mins of wet time total
hope it's sarcasm wooshing over my head
It's not, should I be washing my RC prints for 10 mins?
Have you missed that
a) I said at most.
b) There are more paper manufacturers than Ilford.
c) 15 minutes is more than 8-10 minutes?
Have you missed that
a) I said at most. Let me grab my exact quote.
RC paper needs 8-10 minutes at most.
I've highlighted the relevant parts.
b) There are more paper manufacturers than Ilford.
c) 15 minutes is more than 8-10 minutes.
Have you missed that
a) I said at most. Let me grab my exact quote.
RC paper needs 8-10 minutes at most.
I've highlighted the relevant parts.
b) There are more paper manufacturers than Ilford. Kodak used to specify at least 4 minutes (https://125px.com/docs/paper/kodak/g21.pdf). Arista specifies 3 to 4 minutes.
c) 15 minutes is more than 8-10 minutes.
d) edge penetration and print curl is not desintegration. At worst, you're now approaching fiber based paper behaviour - which has full plane penetration of water.
I still hope it's an elaborate trolling attempt which I'm falling for.
Actually it has a different look, not to mention "feel".
Perhaps behind glass, RC semi-matt can give a close impression of air dried FB glossy. RC is certainly more convenient and I used it for all my preliminary (not portfolio or wall) printing. But for wall or portfolio, even if it's for your enjoyment only, archivally processed FB is (at least for me) a must. Now I print digitally but still use RC for preliminary and baryta for hanging or portfolios.
Not commercial or pro by a mile, but I feel that if someone asks me for some of my work, even if it's a gift, it deserves to be done the best possible.
Different is not better. The claim is not that there are no differences, but that you are not limiting yourself when using RC.
In other words, it's not a natural progression from RC to FB, but a fork in the road, each with its own challenges.
if someone asks me for some of my work, even if it's a gift,
If it's a gift, I'll consider the person and whether fiber or not is relevant to their enjoyment, expectations[1] and expected print longetivity. All my prints are doubly fixed, and have at least a small selenium toning bath due to myself hating the greenish cast of untoned prints, and secondly, for permanence.
If I'm selling it, my prices are commesurate with my effort. You want a dry-mounted fiber print archivally washed and split toned in selenium and sepia, you get it. Pay me.
[1] younger folx are used to more plasticky-shiny pictures. Also some subjects may have that as more appropiate.
Perfect reflection. In any case I've been printing digitally since 2016 in FB Barita coated Ilford Gallery. My old 3800 takes the same time to print on that or Epson plastic stuff.
What kind of press do you use? I've been flattening mine between two boards with something heavy on top, but always looking for alternatives.
I use a cheap t-shirt transfer press very similar to
mainly for drymount prints. This allows me up to 11x14 prints without any trouble, and somewhat bigger in two stages.
Cool, thanks, that's useful to know.
Every paper emulsion is slightly different in speed. If your test strips are over exposed you need to reduce the light. So use a smaller aperture, less time, or add some neutral density by way of a filter above or below the lens to block the light.
As far as tips go the main ones are: *FB paper needs about twice the development time *FB needs much more wash time, and if you are water restricted try hypoclear to speed that up or look into multi stage washes *FB tends to curl while drying. Air dry between two screens keeps it down, but it still needs to be pressed. You can do that with an iron in a pinch between two thin sheets of clean mat board
Also FB is more expensive, so consider practicing on RC if you're cost sensitive. You should be able to figure out rough contrast and exposure changes to go from one paper to another to cut the work down when you are sure you want a FB print.
My local photo shop no longer stocks fiber. I know college level photo classes once required fiber back in the day. I toyed with it but found it was a huge waste of water and clearing agent to say nothing of the curling like a window shade.
Are you doing test strips or just using the time from your other RC prints? Shouldn't be any different if you're doing it the "right" way and doing test strips in increments. Other than that its just longer fix and wash times and the curl that comes from fiber. I tend to weight my drying prints with additional clips in the corners to help combat the curl but its easily taken out by a stack of books (I use a heat press to flatten mine but not everyone has that option)
All great comments ! Thanks for the input crew, I’ll play around with aperture and exposure next time I’m in the darkroom.
FB will last 100’s of years.
RK designs f-stop timer was the best addition to my departed darkroom. Sometimes I'd have 4x5 negs that required up to 8 different exposures. Without the RK f-stop and the foot switch I wouldn't have been able to do them.
I'm being lured into returning to chem printing for B&W (digital color beats RA4 with hands tied behind its back) but have to replace my enlarger. Fortunately I kept my RK grade analyzer. I'm looking at the Intrepid compact, but still have to find a decent column.
I'm surely gonna miss the Gravity Works paper washer tho.
The concepts are all the same. Just expect to have to contend with the natural curl of the paper. You'll also have longer times in each of the trays. I develop my fiber prints for 2 minutes, stop for 1 minute, and fix for 2 minutes each of two separate baths of TF-5 fixer. I also wash for significantly longer than RC paper.