r/running•
ebbv

Is it just me or is active.com super scammy?

I just registered for a race (the Ypsilanti Color Run) on Active.com for the first time. I have registered for lots of races via other websites and never have I gone through a registration process that had more massive hidden fee booby traps than this one.

They try to get you to avoid a $3 processing fee by signing up for a $35 membership, then they try to get you to end up with $100+ in magazine subscriptions by saying "Hey try 3 of these magazines out for 3 months free!" Then lastly they try to get you hit up with some additional nearly $60 membership fee by presenting you with a filled out form where the only empty field says "Verify your email address", hoping you'll just finish it out mindlessly.

I can't remember the last time I went through such a scammy process, it left me shocked and honestly sad that I signed up for this race through them, thus supporting their awful practices. I would have stopped and not completed it but my sisters and niece are running in the race.

Anyone else have a similar experience or other horror stories? Maybe I'm just extra sensitive to this since I'm a web developer and designer, and at my job we spend a lot of time agonizing over how to make sure everything's as clear and easy to use for the customer as possible, and avoid hitting them up with any of these kind of hidden fee booby traps, especially ones that would amount to nearly $200.

Posted Jan 31, 2013, 1:56 PM UTC

364135
thisonesnottaken•

Oh boy do I ever have a horror story. Last June my father and I signed up for the "Rapid Running Buffalo Half Marathon" on Active. ~$85 each. It was supposed to have tons of swag, chip timing, pictures, a post-race party (With beer!), and featured a finish on the Buffalo Bills 50 yard line. Ten days before the race we get an e-mail from RR stating that the race has been postponed to the fall to accommodate the "overwhelming interest" or some B.S. No hard date for the rescheduled race. RR refused to grant a refund because the registration had a clause that if the race was "postponed" there would be no refunds.

The local news ran tons of stories, and thankfully, a couple days before the race a local running co. picked up the slack and put on a barebones replacement race, with free entry for everyone who had paid RR. No chip timing, not much swag, almost no pictures, NO BEER at the finish!

The race was great and appreciated, but I know the difference between a $30 race and an $85 race. Here's where Active gets real scummy. RR refuses to answer phone calls, e-mails, any sort of contact (For the past 8 months). We tried to contact the credit co. to stop payment. They said they wouldn't because a third party (Active) had taken payment and done nothing wrong. I spent hours on the phone with Active, and they refused any sort of remuneration, or assistance getting money from RR, despite keeping their registration fees, and having touted the director of RR as their "Director of the Month" leading up to the race. Here we are, 8 months later, and we are still out our $170 because of Active's compliance in all of this. And, oh yeah, still no "rescheduled race."

Fuck Rapid Running, fuck Active.com.

131
Blindsleeper•

The way active operates, and how most event registration sites operate is this:

  1. They take the payment for the event, extracting a fee from either you or the race director to pay for the cost of the credit card transaction (which depending on what rate they get is usually in the neighborhood of 3% of the amount of the transaction), which means $5.10 of your race fee was out the door before anything else happened.

  2. They then extract their fee (which is usually fairly small), because hey, they've got to make a profit too, or it wouldn't be worth it to them to even have the business.

  3. The money gets put into an account and on a schedule, the funds are either direct deposited or a check is mailed out to the race director.

After #3 happens, essentially active no longer has your race fee to give you. This is why they have you check a box during registration saying that you understand that they issue no refunds, and any possible refunds need to be done through the race coordinators.

I'm not saying Active isn't scummy (god knows I hate them trying to sell me magazine subscriptions and active advantage every race I sign up for), they just aren't at fault in this particular situation. If they didn't provide the service, most races out there wouldn't even be able to take credit cards, due to the fact that the organizers either wouldn't get a good enough rate from a credit card processor to make it worth it, or wouldn't be able to get approval from a credit card processor at all.

24
driveling•

It is not difficult or expensive for legitimate organizations to take credit cards. And, even PayPal would be better.

10
shanedoth•

For large races, sure. But I've been a part of a student organization that runs a fairly barebones annual charity 5k for maybe 100 to 150 participants, and getting a payment processor for just one student-run event per year is overkill.

Active.com sucks, but there is a very real need for a service like that. Here's hoping a good competitor occupies this market.

11
mswas•

I also do some web work for a very small charity that organizes races to fund free mammograms - like Komen, but on a local level, unaffiliated with them.

They are opting to continue with active.com as their registration company as they are so small, it would eat into too much of their $ raised to build something from scratch. Any other options would be greatly appreciated.

2
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
Blindsleeper•

PayPal isn't absolutely awful these days in terms of rates (2.9% + $0.30 USD for sales inside the US), but that is similar to what active is charging that people seem to hate so much.

A lot of people also really hate dislike PayPal for quite a few different reasons, but Ill let you read up on that for yourself.

In regard to getting the ability to take credit cards, you also must remember that your organization goes through a similar approval process to that of people apply for credit cards. A lot of times small races (especially new ones) do not have a low enough risk factor for a processor to take them on, and if they do, there may be much higher fees associated.

Also, please remember that not using active (or another similar service) would incur quite a few other costs such as:

2
tominsj•

Sounds almost like they are in cahoots or at least gaming people by using this "third party" clause.

2
GeneralTapioca•

I get what you're saying, but Active should have a procedure for sneaky crap like what the RR Buffalo Half pulled, or in more honest "force majeure" cases like a race being cancelled due to earthquake/tornado/Sandy type situations. They're a business, they should have insurance to cover refunds, and in cases like possible fraud (RR Half's behavior here is incredibly sketchy) the insurance here would turn around and go after the RR's race organizers to recoup their loss.

Otherwise they're just as culpable once they've pocketed the money, and in cases of fraud, it could be argued they're an accessory, even if they're not in on it.

1
bigbadbyte•

Found a news article that said this

A source within a large company here in Western New York says part of the problem boils down to a bizarre mix-up. She says last week, Rapid Running called her company under the impression it had pledged a large amount of money to sponsor the race. As it turns out, someone not connected with the company at all had misrepresented himself, and had promised money that wasn't available.

But that is still ridiculous that you didn't get a full refund.

16
anonemouse2010•

It's quite clearly fraud, why aren't you pursuing legal action?

6
quakerlaw•

Because its fucking $170

6
Virtblue•

small claims mother fucker

8
quakerlaw•

Still not worth it. At least ~$50 in filing fees, plus all the time it would take (20+ hrs), plus the fact that you will likely never collect the money even if you do win.

2
Icebot•

It's not fraud, it's just people not reading everything they are signing up for. They see the words "free" and get a raging hard-on sign up to waive the registration fees then are shocked that the contract that they did not read had a fee assigned to it.

I'm amazed at the lack of importance that people give contracts these days. It's the same people that bragged about it only taking 20 minutes to close on their house then were shocked when their 5/1 ARM changed value and they could no longer afford their home. Read a god damn contract before you sign it.

1
anonemouse2010•

Are you sure you read above posters story?

I claimed it's fraud because it's clear they had no intention of running the race he PAID for (85$.)

1
Icebot•

Active.com does not control that, they are simply a company that race organizers go through so they do not have to deal with the logistics of doing online registrations.

0
burritopete•

I had a similar experience. Signed up for a tough mudder type race a few years ago. Was really excited about it. The week before the race I was talking to a lady in our climbing gym who told me it was cancelled. There was no other notification. Apparently other people prepaid and didn't know it was cancelled as well. We tried contacting the place that put it on but it's been a complete black hole.

I was so disgusted with loosing that money that it's the last race I ever signed up for. It really took the wind out of my sales as far as racing. I only run about once a week now and can't see myself signing up for anything in the future. It just feels like I would be throwing good money after bad.

6
FountainsOfFluids•

Look for races that are annual and have a few years of experience. It's never guaranteed, but you'll have a better chance at the race going off as expected.

8
runamok•

Just to counter-balance your experience and those of others I have been racing for 20+ years and not ONCE have I gotten ripped off by a race. I've done hundreds. That being said I have seen that prices have gone up dramatically which I think is a shame.

Please give the community another chance and don't let one bad experience sour you on it. Look for a cheap local race to participate in. They are a lot of fun and I really don't think you'll regret it.

3
IAmAtWorkAMAA•

Did you sign up on active.com or on toughmudder.com?

2
scuff•

He said tough mudder "type" race. It could have been a one-off from some tiny outfit.

3
fairlydecent•

tough mudder type race

2
LouQuacious•

doling out a beat down may be your only recourse

2
ebbvOP•

Wow that's horrible.

3
bmurph83•

That sucks bad! I hate dealing with Active so much. I think the No Beer would have made me go insane.

2
bizbimbap•

No beer, no swag, no bueno.

4
[deleted]•

Contact a plaintiffs' attorney where the race was located and explain what happened, ask him to institute a class action. That's a simple case.

2
Roark•

Yup, they definitely present themselves as the Ticketmaster of the running world.

106
unpickle•

And just like Ticketmaster, you are not the customer. Race promoters and organizers are Active's real customers. Race participants are the product.

23
bmurph83•

Perfect analogy.

17
notnicholas•

They represent everything good and bad in the race registration world. They make online registration very easy and relatively inexpensive for larger races for race directors (GOOD!), but they do so by passing the costs on to the athletes (BAD!).

They also take a "ticketmaster cut" off the top of each reg.

3
bbibber•

I don't think it's bad per se that the costs associated with organizing a race are born by those actually participating. But it should be done through a clear fee that's communicated up front instead of a shady process of tricking unsuspecting participants into subscriptions they might not want.

1
supaphly42•

Which is sad, they were a decent place back in the day.

1
uncertia•

Heh.. didn't think I'd wake up to see posts about the company I work for on r/running. To be fair, I've never gone through the registration process. I'm on the IT side of things, so admittedly I have little influence on this, but I've passed this along to someone who might appreciate the feedback. Thanks!

59
ebbvOP•

Sorry, it's nothing personal man. It's just my view on how your web design/marketing department has decided to do things. You should let them know that this post isn't even very old and it's already gotten quite a few people agreeing, so it's not just one guy. I thought when I posted maybe it's just me being over-sensitive due to working in web design, but it's apparently not.

26
uncertia•

Understandable. I know we are in the middle of a major redesign, so hopefully some of your collective concerns are addressed with that launch.

9
ebbvOP•

I hope so. I think these kinds of practices are never worth it. Yeah you might trick some people into paying more, but you're giving everyone a negative opinion of your company and that will lead to, well things like this thread.

13
hissxywife•

I'm glad that somebody is here from the company saying that they are willing to look into it. One of my friends signed up for something on accident during a registration on the site and she was able to get the money back pretty easily if I remember correctly.

10
[deleted]•

NO it IS personal. YOU DID THIS. YOUR SYSTEM. YOUR CODE.

-5
OllieOlefin•

Tell them that we hate your company the way concert goers hate Ticketmaster.

So, a lot.

23
uncertia•

Yeah - that comparison to TicketMaster really cut to the core of me. :p

16
OllieOlefin•

But hey, the IT side of the site works great man. Nice work. ;)

7
smellycatjizz•

There's no way whoever is getting this feedback hasn't heard this stuff before.

7
she_is_a_stranger•

Exactly. Everyone who races regularly knows what a shitshow active.com is. I avoid any races that use it. I would rather sign up with a paper form.

3
junegloom•

Yeah, and its probably music to their ears. Every complaint of someone who's stuck with charges they can't get out of is just "cha-ching" for them. System is working the way they want it to.

1
icdapoakr•

Hey man, I gotta agree with OP. I signed up for my first 5k through active today and had to read every line very carefully because it would have charged me for magazines or membership which I didn't care about. Even after my order was complete another window pop upped asking to buy a membership which looked almost like a confirmation page for my original payment. I exited out of that and felt like it was a huge money grab. I know it isn't your department but maybe something could be changed. Thanks for listening

6
gonzofish•

This is my complaint too. When I complete my registration it tells me to enter my credit card again with a wall of text. Now, being a child of the Internet, I know better than to not read what I'm agreeing to, but less savvy users are getting scammed, no doubt.

1
sickandpretty•

I spent a couple of months trying to get out of my "free," impossible to cancel magazine subscriptions that I ended up with after doing a 10k a few years back.

Every time I'd cancel, it wouldn't register in their system. I finally called and instead told them I wanted to change my payment method to my AmEx. They did that, nice and easy, and then I attempted to cancel again, kept a record of it and forwarded it along to AmEx along with a request to reject any charges from them. They obviously tried to charge me 3 more times, were rejected each time by AmEx and finally just went away.

53
areufnkiddingme•

wow, scammy as all get out!!

12
ibaad•

Yeah, I'd see bogus charges around $10 on my credit card statement from them pretty often. I probably didn't unselect a box while registering or something, and when I called they made up some excuse about why they couldn't refund me. I called my credit card company and asked them to refuse any charges from the company, and they promptly credited me back for 2 active.com bogus transactions. Credit card company seem to help me out with little stuff like this whenever it happens--I guess even if they eat the $10 cost, it's worth it for them to keep my business.

tldr: fuck active.com

5
mapmaker_y2k•

I just signed up for 2 races through them this month and got the same impression.

I'm also 100% positive that I deselected the checkbox to receive emails and they're sending me solicitation emails anyway.

19
arborite•

What makes it worse is that when you unsubscribe from an email, it only unsubscribes you from one of the many lists that they use.

6
greggersraymer•

I don't think it matters that you deselect that box; the fact that you have "done business" with them makes it okay for them to send you commercial email (strictly from a "legal" standpoint). I think.

2
tehtide•

Yeah... active does seem like they want to upsell everything throughout the process. However I've registered for enough races through them I tend not to see that stuff anymore on their site. Just click click click boom... registered.

15
darwinquincy•

Yeah, once you know what to look out for, it's pretty easy.

I understand that they make life easy for race directors. Plus, it saves them the trouble of depositing 500 checks.

5
gogogidget•

This exactly! I did sign up for the trial membership once, but had no issues cancelling it, and even getting my $60 yearly fee back once I did cancel. I think you do have to read through the check boxes carefully the first time, but after that, using Active is not a big deal. You can opt out of all of the extras (memberships, magazines, etc.), so I don't see what the big deal is.

1
FoodBeerBikesMusic•

I say many, many bad words every time I have to use active.com. If there's an alternative, I use it.

15
[deleted]•

They got me with the "verify your email address" trick when I signed up for a race just over a month ago. 30 days later I received an email saying my trial membership had expired and $60 was charged to the credit card they had on file. No previous notification or anything.

Fortunately it was quick and easy to call and cancel, but I wouldn't have intentionally signed up for any premium services.

EDIT: Of course it is my fault for not proceeding more carefully, but it is pretty shady that they try to dupe their users like that.

15
xenonscreams85:48 half-marathon♀•

Yeah that happened to me too, and I don't think I even got an email about it. I just saw $60 on my credit card statement and freaked out.

6
[deleted]•

Had the exact same thing happen here, I also realized later, sure this is my fault because I didn't read the fine print, but for as well known as they are I wasn't expecting these kinds of hijinks.

2
running4mylife•

lobby your races and race directors to use www.racemenu.com for online registration.

14
Cosmic_Charlie•

signmeup.com is good, too.

3
tommymat•

My tale of how crappy Active is:

I ran the Tri-State Super Spartan in September. The race said rain or shine it's a go. However there was a tornado warning so Spartan paused the race mid way through for our safety, then after a 90 minute delay they officially cancelled the race but let us keep going through the course.

That night I get a letter from Spartan apologizing for the weather and inviting me back to run with Joe DeSena (Spartan CEO) the next day for free. They also told us we would get a full refund and discount code for another race. Spartan is really great that way. Spartan gets it - keep the people happy and they will come back.

So a month goes by and I get an email from Active that I received my credit BUT Scumbag Active kept $50 because they said the ToS outline the refund policy.

I really don't like Active. But the problem is they are the Ticketmaster of racing. You really don't have a choice.

11
ebbvOP•

We as runners don't have a choice but I feel like the race directors must have a choice since this is the first time I've encountered them.

3
bigbadbyte•

It's "scammy" in the way they try to hide their upselling. I don't really like business models that rely on user ignorance for money. But having been sure I unchecked all those boxes, I haven't had a problem with the several races I have registered through them.

10
OhDannyBoy•

Yeah they suck and I don't like registering for races with them.

That said, I'm the race director for a small 5k and I use active.com for our online registration. The interface isn't really intuitive at all and is definitely not user friendly. In terms of "scamminess" I haven't really had a problem, but would be open to alternatives for online registration.

9
nemezule•

Yep they are the most annoying site I have encountered in terms of race signups. I have heard of this happening to other people accidentally clicking items on their site and then getting charged for membership months later.

Just take your time and read everything so you don't get caught up in something.

8
sourmilksmell•

I've had a couple times where I had trouble completing a race entry because I had to decline out of their magazine hustle, then it would force me to re-enter my personal data. If they want to sell magazines, then sell magazines. If they want to sell memberships, then sell memberships (I have no idea how a membership would help on their sparse and hard to search site). But yeah, it tends to feel like a shakedown just to register for a race.

7
darlingcharlie•

I will not participate in a race if it's through active.com. They have shady business practices, and I refuse to give any money to them.

6
LeftHandedGraffiti•

I don't like the Ticketmaster experience. Don't tell me the race is one price, then charge me 10% on top of it at the end. Then offer me a litany of upsell packages along the way. No thanks, I'll just fill out the paper form. The "convenience fee" is inconvenient.

6
[deleted]•

Bait and switch scumbags. I will never use them again.

5
HutSmut•

The magazine sign up and the membership is so scammy I feel like taking a shower after registering on active.

Edit: reminds me of the fake crackhead in office space that tries to sell magazine subscriptions.

5
[deleted]•

[deleted]

5
Jemaclus•

I signed up for a race via Active.com, and then I got an email with links in it confirming my registration and all that. A few weeks later, I wanted to look at the registration details (to find out where to pick up my packet, etc), and it said that I was not authorized to view that registration. Why would I not be able to view my own registration?

So I emailed, and they said that my account was created after my registration (I guess I registered as a "guest" and created the account in the last step?), so the registration wasn't attached to the account. Fucking weird.

I'm not a fan of Active.com, and I generally try to avoid it. I think there are better ways to handle that kind of thing.

5