What if: gods come in four parts?

Lore Speculation

This is crazier than my slime-mould, cucumber and sumo wrestler theories.

Much of the basis of it comes from the Wikipedia page for "Kami", the equivalent of spirits or gods in Japanese Shinto ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kami ).

TLDR:

  1. Kami (or gods) have either TWO parts/souls/spirits/identities or FOUR.
  2. Regardless of the number of parts a kami has, only ONE part (the wrathful "ara-mitama") needs to be confronted, appeased, tamed or sealed away in order to keep the kami peaceful.
  3. The purpose of the Shadow given by the Two Fingers to an Empyrean is to control the god it is given to and it does so by defeating the wrathful part of the god.
  4. Marika has at least three parts: Marika, Radagon and whoever it is that Malekith was created to defeat.
  5. Since "at least three" is greater than "two", it's possible that Elden Ring works on the "four parts" tradition.
  6. Malekith is only known to have defeated one being: the Gloam-eyed Queen.

THEORY:

There are two schools of thought on the nature of kami/gods in Shinto.

The two-parts school

One branch believes that each kami has TWO parts/souls/spirits/minds (called "mitama" (honourable spirits).

The two parts of a kami are:

  • The "nigi-mitama": the gentle honourable spirit, with the power to unify or harmonize. The nigi-mitama is the spirit as it exists when the proper balance is maintained. This is the part of the kami that is commonly venerated and worshipped at a shrine.
  • The "ara-mitama": the wrathful honourable spirit, with the power to rule or dominate. The ara-mitama is the wrathful spirit which causes natural disasters and calamities when the kami has been offended.

Note: The wrathful spirit does not respond to the normal worship that keeps the gentle spirit happy: wrathful spirits must be confronted and either appeased (often with sacrifices) or defeated or sealed away.

Note: Only the wrathful part of a kami needs to be confronted, appeased, defeated or sealed away. All other parts of a kami are either neutral or benign and can be kept happy with ordinary worship.

The world in the movie Princess Mononoke operates under a two-part system, we see balanced gentle spirits and their destructive wrathful counterparts several times in the movie.

The gentle nigi-mitama

The wrathful ara-mitama. Note: this is the same kami.

When the proper balance is kept

Literal walking death

The four-parts school

The second branch adds two additional mitama, which represents the miraculous nature of a kami and their ability to grant blessings.

These are:

  • The "saki-mitama": the happy honourable spirit, with the power to grant blessings.
  • The "kushi-mitama": the wondrous honourable spirit, with the power to cause miracles.

Note: In this context, "good harvests" are a blessing, while "turns your sacks of rice into silver" would be a miracle.

The nature of mitama/spirits/parts in real life

The following part relies on information taken from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitama .

Regardless of whether kami comprises two parts or four, the parts have the following traits:

  1. Each part has a separate identity.
  2. While parts can share a body, they are also are just as likely to inhabit separate bodies.
  3. Parts of the same kami have no easy way to RECOGNISE eachother. The Nihon Shoki records that Ōkuninushi (the nigi-mitama of the kami of nation-building) meets actually meets and haggles with Ōkuninushi, who was actually both the kushi-mitama and saki-mitama of the SAME kami.

The nature of mitama/spirits in Elden Ring

We can identify at least two examples of kami with linked parts/mitama/spirits/identities:

  • Marika and Radagon; and
  • Miquella and Saint Trina.

By reviewing their stories, it appears that different parts of a god/kami in Elden Ring have the following additional traits:

  1. Like with Marika and Radagon, parts of the same kami can share a body.
  2. Like with Miquella expelling Saint Trina, parts sharing the same body can split off into separate bodies if they wish.
  3. As seen when Saint Trina disappearing after Miquella is defeated, parts the same kami have LINKED FATES.
  4. As seen when Marika and Radagon switch forms during the Radagon fight, having linked fates does not necessarily mean that separate parts all fall at the same time: sometimes the FALLING of one part causes the RISING of their counterpart/s.

Note: The story of the two Ds also shows one part waking up after the first part dies.)

Why is this relevant to Elden Ring?

Before we answer that, we need to look at one last matter: the nature of the Shadows given by the Two Fingers to empyreans.

How the Shadow controls a god/kami

  1. Malekith and Blaidd are supposedly completely loyal to their Empyrean.
  2. Ranni claims, however, that the purpose of the Shadow is to be a tool for the Two Fingers to control their Empyrean and that they were designed to attack the Empyrean if they rebel.
  3. In practice, neither Malekith nor Blaidd ends up attacking their respective Empyrean: Blaidd attacks you and Malekith defeats the Gloam-eyed Queen. How does this make sense?
  4. Well, as noted in the above, only the one part of a kami needs to be confronted, appeased, sealed away or tamed: the wrathful part/spirit/identity.

I posit that a Shadow is not intended to attack their Empyrean: their purpose is to keep their Empyrean under control by DEFEATING their wrathful counterpart.

How does this support the theory that gods/kami have four parts in the game?

If god can only have either TWO or FOUR parts, and Shadows were created to confront, defeat and seal away a god's wrathful part Marika has at least three parts:

  1. Marika;
  2. Radagon; and
  3. the wrathful part that Malekith successfully suppressed - the Gloam-eyed Queen.

Since "at least three" is greater than "two", this suggests that the gods in Elden Ring follow the four-parts system.

Identifying missing parts by looking for linked souls

If gods/kami follows a four-part system, we appear to be missing multiple parts, Is it possible to identify the missing parts?

I believe that we can use the fact that all parts of a kami have linked fates to identify the four parts.

Evidence of linked fates:

instances when characters fall asleep, dies or is injured at the same time;

instances when characters wake up, revives or heals at the same time that another character falls asleep, dies or injured.

Possible examples of linked fates:

  • Miquella and Saint Trina being banished at the same time.
  • Marika disappearing at the same time that Radagon appears.
  • Ranni's body dying at the same time Godwyn's soul dies.
  • (Rykard just randomly being cut into bite-sized pieces.)

Another way linked fates can appear is Ranni's relationship with the Fingerslayer Blade. The Blade "cannot be wielded by those without a fate". This suggests that Ranni needed to SHARE her fate with the blade in order to wield it.

Hypothetical four-part gods

Possible four spirit configurations are:

  • Marika/Radagon/Gloam-eyed Queen/Elden Beast
  • Marika/Radagon/Gloam-eyed Queen/Melina
  • Ranni/Godwyn/Rykard/Fingerslayer Blade
  • Ranni/Godwyn/Rykard/Dark Moon
  • Messmer/Meline/Morgott/Mogh
  • Miquella/Malenia/Trina/Rot
  • Miquella/Maelenia/Trina/Radahn

Thanks for reading!

OTHER THEORIES:

What if: Everone's a slime mould zombie?

https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/1hj0dd8/what_if_everyone_are_slimemould_zombies/

What if: Torrent was a cucumber?

https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/1fb3q4m/what_if_torrent_was_a_cucumber/

What if: Godfrey was a sumo wrestler?

https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/1ew0jvm/what_if_godfrey_was_japanese/

What if: This is Game of Thrones? (Rennala murder theory)

https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/1ho2j4a/what_if_rennala_was_murdered/

The Crucible is a Spiritspring and people keep building on them. https://www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/1evy9xm/people_keep_building_holy_sites_on_spiritspings/

ASOIAF THEORY:

Abominations: Of souls, ice, fire and blood.

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/z9kyg0/spoiler_main_abominations_of_souls_ice_fire_and/

Posted Dec 30, 2024, 6:06 AM UTC

236
Loading comments…