Source
r/thedivision•
codeX78

Weapon mod design - too simplified?

Question

Hear me out.

I believe the weapon mod design should have been more rigid to encourage more thought, determination, and loot scavenging.

By allowing any "Magazine extension" to apply to any gun with a magazine, it means you only have to find a "best" magazine once, and it works with all guns.

If magazines, along with a few other types of weapon mods, only applied strictly for the weapon it was designed for, it would encourage users to make pro-and-con choices. If I'm a fan of the M1A, but find a legendary SCAR-H specific magazine, now maybe it's better for me to work on building up a SCAR-H - a gun I wouldn't otherwise consider.

Instead, I'm just going to slap my legendary magazine extension on my M1A and call it a day. While true that some guns share the same magazine design in real life (M4/AR15/HK416/etc), most guns have unique magazines, even when the guns are extremely similar. An example being my personal HK Mark23 .45 and my HK USP Tactical .45. Both are very similar in design, and even the magazines look identical, but they're not interchangeable.

This same concept applies to muzzle devices. A suppressor designed for a 5.56/.223 caliber round will NOT work with a 7.62 or .45. The larger bullet will not fit through the smaller bore. And while you can fire a 5.56/.223 through a .45 suppressor (with proper thread adapter), it is not as effective.

Forced diversity is good in a game designed around customization, extending the loot hunt and giving stronger satisfaction when completing gear if you're truly looking to build up the "ultimate" M1A marksman requiring all M1A-specific parts. (Scopes are generally interchangeable, but you get the point.)

I'm concerned that by making weapon mods (and likely armor mods) too generic, best-in-slot gear will be too easy to complete.

Thoughts?

Posted Feb 5, 2016, 4:47 PM UTC

046
Sebbak_UKPlaystation•

Eh. It's not meant to me Gunsmith Simulator 2016. There's a small difference in that there's large and small versions of the gear - i.e. one lot for machine guns and auto rifles etc and another lot for sidearms and SMG's I believe.

There would be such a ridiculous amount of extra work involved in expanding this to cover every single individual calibre/weapon and would likely result in a lower weapon diversity as a result.

I think it's fine how it is. Ok, it's not 100% realistic, but it's still decent enough imo.

10
[deleted]•

[deleted]

4
AeleasSHD•

If something happens that requires "a ridiculous amount of work," I'd like the artists to make reversed copies of the bag & holster so I can play a left-handed character.

1
St_WoodringBallistic•

I have almost zero RL experience with this. However I don't believe we will see definition past what the game has already deemed as "large" and "small" attachements

1
codeX78OPPC•

Yeah, I'm glad they started with this one step of large and small, but they really had far more opportunity to expand on it. First by going with weapon-type specific mods (marksman rifle, shotgun, etc), then by going even further to have weapon-model specific mods (M1A, M44 Carbine, M1911, etc).

0
JokerUniqueNewsfinder•

It probably just got too much and too complex.

2
Loonkey•

Hmm, I actually like this suggestion. It'd easily clutter up inventory and stash space though. "I gotta keep this incase I get that gun, no no, keep this too!"

I'll wait to see what crafting is like in the full game before deciding on unique and individual magazines/suppressors/etc :)

1
Greedydaveo•

I agree, a lot of the fun will be finding good loot, especially if that loot is specific to the load out you want. I imagine I'll be spending enough time in this game that having gun specific mods wouldn't be too much of an issue. It does make the game more inclusive for people that either won't have the time to loot at that level or do not want an overly complex game.

1
DamnfiddlesSurvivor Link•

I just hope in a more intuitive mod menu

1
KaturKatur_•

I think it seems mods are basically only glorified stat sticks with not much more depth than that. I think your suggestion complicates it too much though.

1
Altr4My Little Boom Boom Pet•

This is not a bad idea. But it will be less appelaing to the casual type gamer

1
JokerUniqueNewsfinder•

At the moment there are 2 types of mods. Mods for big weapons and for small. You have 4 slots per weapon, 5 archetypes and 5 rarities. IMO that is more than enought to grind. Because not every mod is good for every weapon and because of that there will be more than one vest in slot mods.

1
slincii•

i have to disagree.

we dont know the total pool off weapons out there.

also you use mags as an example, however if we are going to talk other attachments, they tend to be universal RIS railing. so would be applicable to multiple weapons. mags and sometimes surpressors being the exceptions.

plus gun specific mods would only make it to difficult to customise the weapon you love.

1
codeX78OPPC•

I used magazines as an example, but I also mentioned a list of items above that are very gun model specific - the stock, grip, trigger group, receiver/bolt/slide/barrel, muzzle device (caliber usually determines threading on the attachment). The only things that are fairly universal are the sights/rail attachments.

1
arcalumis•

The problem I had with the weapons modding was that even on rifles with 4 rails you could only mount one accessory. So you had to choose between a laser or a front grip, even though you have 4 places to mount those items IRL.

1
c0matosedDecontamination Unit•

All the mods doesn't fit every weapon, they have size restrictions and also you would want different bonuses for different guns.

1
jazzmannhs•

I agree it is too simplistic, and not at all realistic (other than certain slots being blocked off for certain types of guns)

I feel that it should be a bit more specific, especially the magazine modifications for the exact reasons you stated.

Guns with rails should be able to use more than 1 attachment. For instance it is impossible in the current system to use the laser and a grip at the same time.

The supressor argument is also valid, although I feel suppressors are alltogether too common in the game as is, there simply arent that many in circulation in the US due to the extreme cost, prohibitiveness of the government to give you the right to buy one, the tax stamp, etc. But then again the same could be said for automatic weapons. So I guess the argument is overall moot.

1
AeleasSHD•

I assume SHD agents are above the NFA.

1
jazzmannhs•

NFA

I'd agree haha, but they are dropping from random hoodlems on the street and from ex sanitation workers. Doesn't make much sense to me that they are so common. To buy them at the vendors I kind of get...

1
AeleasSHD•

Maybe they took them from the corpses of the first wave.

1
secher-nbiw•

Nah. It's a video game, not a simulator. It's also an RPG, which means there are already enough items clogging inventory without adding suppressors, clips, sights, stocks, actions, whatever, for every gun.

1
adds102•

I wish they could allow multiple under barrel mods. I want a flashlight/laser sight as well as a hand grip!

1
tifugodLadmo_Tbag•

I'm a fan of more detail & intricacy.

Don't mods have other talents & boosts though? So maybe you have one type of muzzle mod for your shotgun, and a different muzzle mod for your sniper rifle.

1
Hypno-Germ•

I feel with the passives applied to firearms (100% crit below 30% health, etc) there will still be a decent amount of customization but I agree. As a firearms enthusiast I was hoping for a more realistic application to weapon mods. The first time i saw the "handstop" attachment all I wanted my guy to do was hold the rifle thumb-over-bore so I could Chris Costa my way through the game.

1
AeleasSHD•

Some say his beard is bulletproof, and that his thumbnails can zero out recoil. All we know is: He's not the Stig. But he is the Stig's operator cousin.

2
TippityTappityToot•

I agree you with to an extent. Getting the gear, chasing that dragon, is all the fun of an rpg. People are going to rush to 30 then farm and get a good mag/scope/rail set and then complain that there's no more content

1
CYN0_BuhhdustRogue•

I actually think that making the loot more complicated would improve player retention. More to learn is always good, keeps people more interested and actually attracts more intelligent people to the game (no disrespect to idiots!)

I also think that instead of just picking up a mod, and fitting it to your gun, you should have a basic magazine that you pick up, then you go to a workshop to modify the magazine back in the base of operations (BOP), and the level of which you have that part of the BOP determines the skill level of what you can modify. Just a thought! Probably not gonna change so close to the release date though.

1
foofadwhich button kills the man•

No way. Nothing is more frustrating than being that guy that can't find the right upgrades to apply to your favorite gear. I like the one size fits all mechanic. Let the moment be that I found the legendary, not that I beat RNG twice and found the legendary of the thing I actually use.

1
jtclayton612•

Why yes I would like a 1:7.7 twist heavy barrel made of 4150 with a QPQ treatment firing 75grain hand loads from prone into my enemies. Oh and a raptor CH for all the lefties.

1
codeX78OPPC•

This guy knows what I'm talking about. :)

In-depth weapon customization like this allows for long-term progression of building up your ultimate weapon. The fact that I can use the same epic magazine extension on my M1A as I do on my M1911 is just.. meh. Assuming +30%/+10% is the best available, you only need to find one +30% mag capacity and +10% weapon damage magazine, then you never have to find another again and keep using it across all weapons. From an RPG standpoint, that just doesn't seem right. (Mainly because most other RPGs would "consume" or lock the mag to the weapon once you apply it to a weapon.)

1
jtclayton612•

Imagine if we also had durability, gotta replace that barrel once the groups start opening up. My only complaint about mods in game so far is that I'm probably gonna play a medic type character and there's a reliable way to reduce threat generation in suppressors but no way to generate more. I vote compensators increase threat generation so tanks have a muzzle attachment to roll with.

1
codeX78OPPC•

I don't think I'd want to go so far as to include a "maintenance cost" of wearing out any parts via durability, but I do agree with tanks needing threat generators passively and not rely on skills or going Leroy Jenkins into a fight.

1
Hypno-Germ•

Get a load of this guy, not using 1:9 WASP for those leftover civilian .223 rounds. :)

1
jtclayton612•

Of course not, just gotta pick from the stockpile ;)

1