Source
r/researchchemicals•
hypnagoggle

Warning: It's a possible a downer is being sold in place of 3-FPM. Be extra cautious if you get a new batch.

It's not clear if this is an actual trend yet.

And obviously, if you are consuming research chemicals you should ALWAYS test your drugs to the best of your ability.

There have been multiple reports of people feeling tired and sleepy after sampling their new batch of 3-FPM.

https://www.reddit.com/r/researchchemicals/comments/60l4s0/3fpm_first_time_tired_as_fuck/

This one was removed due to discussion of sources (don't do that!) https://www.reddit.com/r/researchchemicals/comments/60jiov/3_fmp_extremely_sedating_happened_to_anyone_else/

And another user reported recently feeling sedated from 3-FPM, which he discussed in the first linked post.

Always test your drugs, including reagent testing. Of course, 3-FPM doesn't react with the common reagents. That means proper allergy testing is also very important. Don't start with a full recreational dose!

If you receive some 3-FPM, treat it with extra scrutiny. And please post here if you receive similar results!

Edit: Borax told me that the reagent test wiki shows 3-FPM does react to mandelin. But the three batches I've tried over the last couple years did not, fwiw. There may be some variation there.

Do keep in mind that reagent tests are a useful first line of defense, but 100% positive identification of a substance requires a lab test.

Posted Mar 21, 2017, 2:23 PM UTC · edited

4389
greenhouseman•

I'd like to speculate this possibly being mebroqualone or like substance. The dosage is too high for most benzos to be functional after a few hours. Can't be ruled out completely. Opiates tend to cause more nausea and euphoria/dysphoria in the case of a heavy dose or an over dose. Yet can't be ruled out either. However from what it sounds like it could very well possibly be mebroqualone. Just a thought for reagent comparison. Personally if I thought I was sent something else, I'd pony up for it to be sent in to the a lab to be tested.

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hypnagoggleOP•

I guess it could be a lude analog. But mebroqualone hardly does anything orally at that dose. And it doesn't seem that there's been any others in the family available for quite some time. I can't rule out the possibility though.

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ResChemTech•

Reading about mebroqualone sounds like it's a strong possibility.

I'm happy to send it to a lab. Can you recommend any specific good one?

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greenhouseman•

I think that someone else might have more personal experience with this. I don't know if sourcing a testing lab would break rules. A quick Google search will result in some information. Check your PM's.

Edit: Spoke with some mods and it seems as if it is totally within the rules for me to say that ecstasydata.org does testing on pills as well as any powder for $100 I believe and energycontrol.org does anonymous btc testing on substances as well.

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ResChemTech•

I hadn't meant to reference sourcing so my post got locked but the mods were kind enough to lift my ban.

As I said before, I took 35mg PO and went out for an hour. Felt maybe slightly tired when I got back so took another 40mg. I watched a TV show and remember feeling tired so I laid down.

I woke up 5 hours later on the couch. During that time, I took a phone call from work and have only the vaguest recollection of even speaking on the phone. When I was trying to walk around the house after, I was awake and alert enough but very groggy and my balance wasn't great. My legs felt super weak overall and I would have to use the railing to get up stairs.

I've never tried benzos but this felt an awful lot like what I think a benzo would feel like? Today's the next day and I'm still pretty tired and groggy.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Hrmmm, that definitely sounds a bit benzo-like, yes.

However, if it is a benzo, it's a very weak one or it's cut. Most of the RC benzos are so potent that consuming that much of one would knock you out for much longer than that.

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Diflubrotrimazolam•

Not diclaz or meclonazepam for pyraz or etiz or deschloroetiz..

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hypnagoggleOP•

I'll grant you there are exceptions, though I think etiz can certainly knock someone for a loop at too high a dose.

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Diflubrotrimazolam•

Oh definitely - any of the ones I listed could, for that matter. It's just that their "overboard" dose isn't 1 goddamn milligram like flam and clam insanity haha

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GilbertPolytoxic•

How dose the batch look?

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ResChemTech•

Am I allowed to post a picture of it? I don't want to get banned again. The previous 3fpm powder one was a fluffy white clumpy powder. This "3fpm crystal" is a slightly more granulated fine off white powder. Like a very slightly shiney/grey granulated sugar? It really doesn't look that different to the 3fpm powder unless you look closely.

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GilbertPolytoxic•

Yeha of course you are allowed too make pics. Just dont let the shop name or anything in that direction be in the picture. I had a lot of different dissos batches from a lot of different dissos and some were very unique. So a pic can help sometimes :)

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ResChemTech•

Left: Regular powder 3-fpm Right: Crystal "3-fpm" that sedated me pretty heavily for 5 hours.

http://imgur.com/Xt1BC24

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hypnagoggleOP•

Was your response to the previous batch of 3-FPM more typical?

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ResChemTech•

Yes, 100% and I even posted a review actually:

www.reddit.com/r/researchchemicals/comments/5wizzm/3fpm_vs_4fmph_my_review

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ResChemTech•

From one of the vendors:

"During the last few days when clearing the very bottom of the 1KG bag that we have been selling for months we have heard of this from 3 people now. The batch tested fine in the beginning, so prevailing theory is that there was an impurity that, for whatever reason, sunk to the bottom and tainted the last few orders. We can't condone HC obviously, but anyone whose order was filled during the previous week who obtained odd results in the lab we will credit back. We've also decided to re-stock more regularly with smaller amounts so that the risk of distribution impurities on large orders is minimized."

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Thercman6•

Impurities from the bottom of a kilo of a popular stim isn't going to cause these types of reports we are seeing. If anything, it was probably magnesium stearate and at those doses it wouldn't cause an issue.

I have a hard time believing their story.

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YaBwoy•

Great updates through this situation, gj

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ResChemTech•

If it helps the community, I'm happy to buy some reagent testing kits and do some testing. Can someone suggest which kit to buy? I'm curious what this is as well. My guess is a benzo or maybe a (thankfully) weak opiod?

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strawberrysunshine38•

Could be a benzo, how long did the tiredness last? And how long before you noticed the effects after taking it? How much did you take?

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ResChemTech•

I took 35mg by mouth. Was slightly tired 40 minutes later. Then took another 40mg and watched a 40min TV show and I'm pretty sure I passed out before the end.

I woke up about 5 hours later and was clear headed but a bit groggy/weak feeling. That tired feeling has lasted to today - now 24 hours later.

I doubt it was all benzo. But I'm wondering if it got contaminated with a benzo?

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901chemist•

If that was a benzo you would've blacked out pretty badly given how potent most benzos, with a few exceptions, are

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strawberrysunshine38•

Yea, that would have been a huge dose if it was a benzo alone. I'm not very knowledgeable with downers or rc benzos but maybe this information might be relevant to someone who knows more.

Did you have any typical 3fpm effects if you are thinking it was mixed?

Hopefully the reagents help provide some light as well.

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DistilledWafer•

Keep in mind that just because you weigh 40mg of powder, it doesn't mean you have 40mg of an active substance.

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ResChemTech•

Nope. No typical effects at all. But maybe they were there but just overpowered?

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Thercman6•

Flubromazepam or Diclazepam

Classic reaction.

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ResChemTech•

From the Psychonaut pages it sounds like it could have definitely have been one of these.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Well, I definitely think you should have a reagent kit because it's a valuable first line of defense for your health. And seeing the results for your material could very well be helpful. My recommendation is to have at least marquis and mandelin. Mecke and ehrlich are also helpful.

Just keep in mind that even with reagent results we won't be able to positively ID the chem 100%. The results can give us clues, but true identification/proof will require a lab test.

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4-Methylaminorekt•

Just speculating here, but could this be a batch of U-49900 relabeled as 3-FPM?

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Tatatatatre•

No people reported u-49 having to sedating effects, and horrible side effects.

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4-Methylaminorekt•

Seems sensible and I also think that wasn't u-49, but I haven't actually been able to find that many reports about it and the "no euphoria"-part sounded kinda familiar. I guess we can only be completely sure after the stuff of OP has been tested.

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smokenshred•

could it be something as simple as melatonin? maybe it is not even an RC contaminant, melatonin does not cause euphoria and it will make you very tired.

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4-Methylaminorekt•

Could be, though that wouldn't cause the amnesia OP is experiencing, would it?

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ResChemTech•

I read the U-49900 reports and I don't think so. Again, the extreme sleepiness despite being relatively clear headed coupled with the almost total amnesia after I feel asleep really feels like a benzo? I woke up during the time and answered a work call (totally coherently) but don't remember it at all. Even after I woke up I made and ate dinner and then was playing video games competitively and normally with no issues but don't remember any part of that today. I slept from maybe 2-6pm and today I remember from about 9pm on. The only similar experience I can compare it to was when I had midazolam for a procedure and, overall, it was almost exactly the same sensation and course as that.

What does etizolam look like? Could it have been contaminated with that?

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biochemical1•

Etizolam looks just like the chem on the right on your picture. Shiny, almost tasteless powder.

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ResChemTech•

My working theory is that the sample got contaminated with Etizolam since there's no way I ate 75mg of Etizolam. Not sure I'm enough of a chemist to figure out how to test for the presence of Etizolam in the sample though from reading up on the Marquis Mandelin and Mecke reagents =(.

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4-Methylaminorekt•

Definitely could be etizolam. If it was a benzo it must've been a short acting one and a low dosage contamination. I guess you're at least somewhat lucky as they are usually extremely potent and a lot of them last longer than just a few hours. Just imagine accidentally eating 30 mg of phenazepam and spending like a week in that benzoed-out state.

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Thercman6•

He said he still felt it 24hrs after the last dose I would consider that a long acting benzo. It's probably Flubromazepam or Diclazepam.

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4-Methylaminorekt•

The thing tipping me off is the fact that the blackout only lasted a few hours (if I read it right). If it was longer lasting, wouldn't the blackout be longer as well?

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Kstiz12•

I had to make an account once I saw this... I came across the same batch. I had unfortunately just started a new job and fell completely asleep twice at work. I would get an initial rush feel like regular 3-FPM and then there may or may not be a blank out zone of no memory. Twice I completely passed out and somehow completed a significant amount of work (luckily a desk job... luckily my work was good too upon review later).

My guess is it is contaminated - I stupidly continued through a good 5 or so more g before calling it quits on this. It didn't not get the amnesiac affect every time, however when it did I have next to no recollection. There was a bit off an off taste when I would get the amnesiac results from vaping, however, and there was an increase in left residue. Another friend of mine who had purchased the same batch had actually gotten into a bike accident so please, please be careful. He was wide awake one minute, and next thing he knew, totally out and had hit a pole. Very luck he is alive, bystanders said he suddenly just swerved into the pole... seemingly for no reason. No history of seizures or anything of the like.

On another occasion while binge vaping it I started getting a nauseous feeling, reminiscent of ODing on opiates. I started stumbling and was very, very clumsy (reminded me of being way too high on K) for the next while knocking over everything and breaking several dishes. I managed to get to some Tolazoline that I had never expected to use (helped me a TON), I think I may owe my life to this, I was losing consciousness fast and this cleared me up, and made me feel like i could breath correctly.

Everyone please be careful, it really looks like ordinary 3-FPM. I've requested test results for it... will post if I ever receive them. I hope everyone is okay. I also have U-47700 which I thought might have been the contaminant... did not feel the same, so I don't think that is what it is. The amnesiac effects feel like a time when I had too much etizolam, I had an "OD" event when I felt like I was having respiratory depression and i was clumsy like I had too much of an NDMA agonist. What is this stuff? If I didn't take "too much" I could fight the sleepiness but it was brutally hard. I apologize I don't have any reasonable dosage numbers for you, I ahve quite a high 3-FPM tolerance and so I would guess I was averaging 100mg vaped/hr.

I should note, the one time I got the respiratory depression when I took it orally, in a larger amount than 100mg. I would guess closer to 200mg, but I don't know. I feel totally foolish and have learned a huge lesson here and am just glad to be alive.

Sorry If I broke any rules here, attempted not to.

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CrackRockPunk•

Thought I'd let everyone know I've got a reagent test kit on the way, and I'll be receiving it sometime next week.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Awesome! That'll be helpful information. Of course, it's still not enough information to 100% identify the substance. Only a lab test can do that. But at least it will be a useful data point.

I mentioned above that 3-FPM doesn't react to the common reagents, but according to borax, it actually does react, at least sometimes, to mandelin, fwiw. Here's a chart. https://www.reddit.com//r/ReagentTesting/wiki/nps None of my 3-FPM batches reacted to mandelin though.

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CrackRockPunk•

Thanks. Yeah, I spent a bit of time looking at reagent reactions with 3-fpm online last night. I guess it won't mean much if I don't get a reaction, but it'll tell us something, I suppose.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Definitely worth doing.

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CrackRockPunk•

Absolutely. Whatever the outcome, I learned a valuable lesson. Even if this turns out to be 3-fpm, and I just had some weird fucking reaction to it, I'll have a reagent kit to test future compounds.

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PleasePasta•

Possible but sometimes people are just different. I mean I feel sleepy after taking stimulants sometimes depending on which ones, and such.

Still, good to put out a warning in case :)

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hypnagoggleOP•

I completely agree. People can respond very differently to the same drug.

I also agree that there's not enough info to assume this is definitely a bad batch yet. But I think it's at least worth putting up a flag about it so people take extra precaution.

If it turns out it's something other than 3-FPM, at least it doesn't appear to be lethal at the 35 mg insufflated dose that the one user tried. It's the small things, you know?

Edit: Added the all-important "not" to my statement to clarify my actual intent, lol.

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PleasePasta•

Agree :D.

That's why I said it is good to put a warning out, still

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[deleted]•

[removed]

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star_gourd•

Holy shit, I think I may have gotten the same thing. Ordered 3-fpm from a Chinese distributor a couple weeks ago, got an off-white powder. I stuck 1-2mg on my tongue to allergy test not expecting any effects, and about 20 minutes later started feeling tired and heavy and just plain weird. I freaked the fuck out and went to the ER because I was afraid it may have been a fentanyl derivative or a cannabinoid. I wound up being fine and tossed it out. Scary that this is happening to others, I figured it was just a one time vendor mistake.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Thanks for contributing your experience! I hope we get this sorted out.

Most importantly, I hope we are respectful to each other in the process, and that everyone is taking the necessary steps to keep themselves safe. Mistakes do happen. That's why we reagent test, allergy test, and start with careful titration.

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smokenshred•

if you cant list vendor sources can you at least confirm that it is not from either Canada or the USA? that would not be breaking the rules right?

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hypnagoggleOP•

I only made the post to raise a flag, particularly since one of the other posts was removed. But I do not know where this 3-FPM is coming from.

u/CrackRockPunk said on another post that, per the rules, can't be linked to in this sub, that their supplier ran out recently.

Separately, a responder on this post said they had a similar experience with material recently acquired from China.

Make of that what you will. I'm waiting for more reports before I jump to any conclusions. I will conclude that people should be extra careful with 3-FPM, for now.

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Diflubrotrimazolam•

This thread makes me glad my 3fpm 75mg caps are a year old!

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hypnagoggleOP•

I hope you keep some desiccant in there with those. :)

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Diflubrotrimazolam•

Haha, by sheer chance, that bottle did end up with a dessicant packet in it, and I never bothered taking it out, figuring it couldn't hurt. Are you telling me it's actually been essential all this time? The caps do still look fresh except for the couple that got a tiny bit wet once..

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hypnagoggleOP•

In my opinion, yes. But it depends a lot on the humidity of your environment. I never used to think about it that much, but last year I packed up some 4-FA caps to take with me on a trip to the lake, just stashed in a little vitamin planner type container (not airtight). It was remarkable what the humidity did to those caps. They almost got mushy.

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Diflubrotrimazolam•

Ah, I live in basically a desert area so humidity is never really an issue. Only if I forget bottles open and take a shower haha.

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vapenasheyall•

I swear I got one of these batches. Me and a friend researched some and then we fell asleep,in like 30 minites. This makes so much sense now...

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BigMrChad•

Does this batch seem insoluble in water where the older batches would "melt" away instantly?? That's how the current batch I have is..

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hypnagoggleOP•

I didn't personally have experience with the weird batch, so I'm not sure.

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1ledzepplin1•

So what were the results, please?

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the2jzgterb•

That baggie on the right looks a lot like etizolam, especially considering how it's sticking to the side of the bag. If I were you I'd take a very small amount on the tip of your finger and lick it, if it taste sweet then it might be etizolam.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Good info. I've never bought powdered etizolam.

But if the dude really consumed 75 mg of etiz, don't you think he'd have a very different story?

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the2jzgterb•

That's where it gets hard to say, it's extremely hard to OD on a benzo, but at 75 mg you would expect a complete black out within a short time if taken all at once and ORALLY. Benzo's and etizolam have a very low bioavailability insufflated. Usually people who snort benzo's get high from the drip. So in crackrocks case it is likely it was etizolam or some other downer. If you do end up tasting it and it's not bitter then the chance of having some kind of benzo is very likely

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hypnagoggleOP•

Right, I forgot about that part. I had read before that they don't get absorbed as well nasally. So maybe it really could be etiz.

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ResChemTech•

I weighed out 35mg on my mg scale, dissolved it in a small bit of water, chugged it, rinsed the glass, and them chugged that too. Then again with 40mg probably 1h later.

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hypnagoggleOP•

Right, right. I must be thinking of the other redditor who insufflated it.

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