Source
r/splatoon•
gleepglap

An Open Letter to Nintendo: Fix Match Making in All Modes

Dear Splatoon Devs:

Splatoon 2 is generally a much better game than the first. Weapons and specials are mostly balanced and getting better. Maps are fun. The new gear system is awesome. However, matchmaking is badly broken and much worse than in Splatoon One. Indeed, the matchmaking is so poor it threatens long-term playability. Among the problems:

S+ is too expansive and teams are a mixed bag of ability resulting in few competitive matches.

League matches swing wildly between power level 2300 and 1400. If I'm a 2000 level team, its unlikely either of those matches will be enjoyable for anyone (unless you're a sadist/masochist)

About that power score...why is it hidden?

Turf war lobbies prioritize something other than weapon comp, but weapon comp likely matters most. Guess what: 3 chargers and one shooter is going to lose badly to 4 aerosprays.

At lower ranks being good forces you into high power score games. It actually pays to be mediocre if you want to rank up because you'll face less stiff competition.

For very good players (not me!) the game achieves balance by saddling good players with poor players forcing them to carry. This is a perversion of the game. High level players should be able to play at their level with those at (or near) their level. Carrying incompetents isn't fun for anyone. Twins in leagues does the same. Oh, you did pretty well...here's two B- aerosprays. Have fun!

I could go on. But I think you get the point.

Best,
u/gleepglap

Posted Sep 25, 2017, 10:47 AM UTC · edited

3940
AlfredHoneyBunsThere is no comfort zone in Splatoon•

Add the 3-or-less-person Salmon Runs to this list

It's asking to lose. If most games won't start with 8 players, why does Salmon Run start with 3 or less?

12
Swinerat•

Salmon run isnt competitive. You're fighting CPUs rather than people so having a full team is less important than other modes. At least thats what im guessing

3
AlfredHoneyBunsThere is no comfort zone in Splatoon•

Fair enough, but Salmon Run isn't a 3-or-less-player game, so the lack of a team mate is about as palatable as in TW or Ranked

9
LyndellFlight is better than invisibility!•

I’ve won more ranked matches with 3 people than Turf War or Salmon run.

EDIT: In Turf War it would be cool if they adjusted the percent you needed to win.

3
Effdee1NNID: •

Yeah, twin-league matchmaking is absolutely abysmal. There's been way too many games with 4 S+ players vs 2 S+ players and 2 B+ players, resulting in a one-sided stomp.

Quad-league matchmaking is a bit better, but it still randomly matches you against teams that are way worse than your team or way better than your team

It's harder to find balanced games in this game than it was in the 1st game, I wonder if regional matchmaking has anything to do with that or not

7
Ekyou•

Isn't this mostly because there are too few people in the pool? I play doubles and we tend to get matched with the same teams over and over.

As for the regional thing, I don't think we've ever been matched with a team in Japan (which would be the easiest way to tell), but we usually play at like, 7 PM CST when there wouldn't be a lot of people on the other side of the world, especially teams, playing. And I do get matched with some Japanese players when I play Ranked in the early mornings.

3
Effdee1NNID: •

Yeah, the game does have a preference for regional-based matchmaking for sure. It's way easier to find Japanese players in the 1st game than it is here.

Now that I think about it, the unbalanced games and bad matchmaking overall definitely do seem like they're because of regional matchmaking/smaller player pools.

Really hope they add back worldwide matchmaking, right now there's little to no benefits of regional matchmaking

Makes games harder to find, AND they're more unbalanced

2
CrapJackson•

YESSSS. I've been in numerous twin leagues where our side is me and my teammate, both S+, level 50 and we get teamed up with two level 12 and 18 player for example against 4 comp players. What is the point lol. Part of the problem is there isn't enough people playing possibly in NA. But it creates unfair matches and makes league more luck based than it should be depending on teammates. I know it will always be somewhat luck based but this is just silly.

1
nebunebu•

Turf team comp is completely random so people don't end up on the same team.

3
GorillaDerby•

They should just worry about variety in room composition. Avoid 3-4 of a kind in a room so randomization doesn't give any one team a bad time. Also ignore this rule for the most recently released weapon.

5
NarwhalJouster•

It tries to. The problem is it also tries to minimize latency, match people of similar skill, and minimize wait times. And the truth is, all of these things are important, and changing one element is going to affect another, so it's a tough balance.

Is there room for improvement? Certainly. But good matchmaking is not as easy of a problem as the people in this thread seem to believe.

4
frozenpandamansniper loli!•

Not completely random.

2
maximyzer•

Definitely, my buddy and I played this weekend, we're both around level 10 and new to the game. After a couple games finishing #1 and #2 in every team we were, we got like 15 games in a row in different teams, both of us ending at the #1 spot of our teams. I understand that they want to balance everything out I guess, but it does't feel as much fun.

3
LaXandroResident Nozzlebro•

They meed to fix the ranked system in general because it is really bad.

2
Ekyou•

League matches swing wildly between power level 2300 and 1400. If I'm a 2000 level team, its unlikely either of those matches will be enjoyable for anyone (unless you're a sadist/masochist)

I've only played doubles so I can't speak for how 4 player teams work but - the reason it swings wildly is because your power isn't really fully calculated until you play 7 matches to get your rank established. It seems like what it does is 1. pair you with a team with a similar (current) power 2. match you against teams with wildly different powers, see how well you do against them, and use the results to calculate your final power/ranking. I don't think it takes your level/Ranked Rankings into account at all, except maybe to come up with an initial value for your first match. Presumably this is because teammates can all have wildly different skill levels.

Edit: I take that back. Last night we got our final score tallied (1570 or so because I just had to dick around with a charger for a couple matches), and then we were consistently matched against teams 1900-2200. So it seems like it doesn't bother trying to match opponents with similar scores at all. NINTENDO WHAT RU DOING

Not that I'm saying it works at all. 7 matches is (IMO) far too many to develop a base score, and yet because it matches you with teams all over the place score-wise, it doesn't end up being enough. Your score might be wildly inconsistent over a couple play sessions - If my team is matched against a bunch of 1500 and under teams, we'll get closer to 1900. If we're matched against a bunch of 1900 teams, we're closer to 1500.

And League Rankings, at least for US in doubles, are terribly broken. If I want to rank high, it's in my best interest to stop after 7 matches. Score changes are too slow. If it underestimated your score, it's too slow a climb up to bother. If it overestimated your score, you can only go down, so you should stop there. It doesn't distinguish between a team that plays 7 matches and stops to a team that plays 20.

2
splvtoonBooya!•

I just wish they would ditch regional matchmaking already. Apparantly people asked for it in the first game, and I understand prioritizing local connections, but it doesn't work for people in an area with a smaller userbase. Facing the same people every single time, if I even manage to get a match at all, makes me not want to play at all anymore.

2
StarVVarsKid•

I think the first step to fixing matchmaking is making it transparent. Whatever their algorithm is, we should have an idea how it works and know what “hidden” values go into the matching.

If there is a hidden ELO-like score, tell me what mine is... tell me what everyone else’s is... and tell me how much it changes when I win or lose. It’s not an overhaul of the system, just displaying the numbers.

If I play an opponent much better than me, and I lose, but my score barely drops (as the ELO works), then losing doesn’t feel so bad. In fact, I can think of losing as a chance to play better players and learn.... hiding this from me just makes losing feel shitty, because all I have to go on is my last-50-matches stat.

2
PStar7•

I agree!

1
TwilcarioNNID:•

I've been having that last paragraph in turf wars as the lower skilled player. It's not fun when your considering only dieing 4 times with no splats or getting a single splat a victory. .-. I want to play with people my skill level, not be the anchor ment to balance teams.

1
gleepglapOP•

Keep at it until you get to ranked. Ranked is more fun and skill matching is better in the lower ranks. Turf war is a train wreck.

1
TwilcarioNNID:•

Oh yea. It's ironic that I can play the ranked mode more casually than the casual mode.

1
jennianidotsNNID:•

Getting matched with 2000+ points when my league squad is 1800 is...not fun at all. Like it's just a throwaway match, which sucks when we can't play the whole rotation.

1
RemagamerNow let's go tear those Octarians limb from limb from limb from•

I don't consider myself great, but I've had very few matches where either team curbstomps. But I do get a lot of disconnects and sometimes it takes a while to find a match. I think overall, matchmaking needs a lot of work.

1
venompbI like the smaller brush better.•

If I could just get into a game of Turf War without spending 5 minutes between every match timing out of multiple lobbies because they're not filling up that'd be great.

1
froggus•

Adding more criteria to matchmaking is the exact opposite of what needs to happen. Queue times are getting longer because fewer people are playing now; the trend will only continue as time goes on, the concurrent player base is shrinking. Forcing matchmaking to be even more granular is just going to end with more timed-out queues than we're already getting.

1
gleepglapOP•

Wasn't exactly requesting MORE criteria. Better criteria would work, really.

Also, I'll take an extra 20 seconds of queue time over a 30 second blowout game.

2
OldSquidRommel•

This is so true, I always get the low level or inexperienced players in my team.

I am not a pro in Splatoon 2 but sometimes i have to figure out how to make a triple or quad kill to help my team or sacrifice myself to take down the one who is giving my team problems.

1
Soy_el_Sr_Meeseeks•

I'm currently grinding for chunks so I'm playing a lot of Turf War and it is unbearable at times due to the matchmaking. I consider myself a pretty good player, but for most matches I have to go balls-to-the wall and get between 10-15 splats a game while inking around 800-1000p (not great, but I'm always pushing) just to carry my team to a very close victory (within 10% usually). I shouldn't have to carry three people that can't even get to 10-15 splats (all together) and score in the 500-600p range.

0
Komasayu•

I'm mostly agree with all of that

I'm beginning the game, have less than 60 hours of playing (with few hours in solo, in shops and testing a lot of weapons). So I'm nearly lvl 20 I'm playing turf war most of the time, and I don't get why I'm matched sometimes with 40+ lvls, who just raped us. And sometimes too, there is a team with 2 lvls 40+, 2 lvls 25+ against 4 lvls 20-. I don't understand it.

Plus, yesterday I played with a lot of levels 5- There's a huge gap between levels 20 and levels 5. This game is awesome, but please fix the matchmaking :)

-2†
Digity101NNID:•

pls dont use levels as indication of skill level

10
Nym990•

This really needs more attention. There's a skill rating system for turf war that isn't shown to the player. After a solid winstreak of 7 curbstomp carried games, on a fresh account made for salmon runs with lower leveled players, I was matched with lv 40+ players as a level 3.

That needs to be visible.

6
skullkid2424•

If I was convinced it worked like that, then it'd be great. But when a level one is in a game of mostly 20-40 players, then I seriously have my doubts.

3
Digity101NNID:•

it could be fair, the level one could be a smurf or the 20-40 could be shit players

2
Komasayu•

Yes I understand, but i'm just saying people around lvl 40 have more experience than lvl 10, even if level does not mean everything, I agree Just match us with people with same level.

When you are constently killed by way higher levels and can't leave your own base, it matters

1
TwilcarioNNID:•

I'm in a similar boat. I'm usually the lowest leveled player in a lobby by 9 levels. I've had lobbys where I was the lowest leveled by 16 levels.

I always feel bad when I see a random level 15- dropped into one of my lobbys, cause I know they'll have a worse time of it than I did.

1