Howabout we stop submitting jokes, and start submitting real content.
[deleted]
Posted Dec 7, 2009, 2:48 AM UTC
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What happened to the submission from a few hours ago wherein most agreed that what was highlighted was joking rather than misogyny? I think an interesting discussion could've grown from that.
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In preferences, you can set the score below which submissions are invisible. The default is -4.
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Mine are set at -8, so I rarely miss much.
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[deleted]
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The two are not a mutually exclusive dichotomy. The reason why many people find sexist jokes funny is because they follow an often ill-informed discourse of women portrayed as "evil feminists, whores, and manipulative bitches." The person often makes the joke because they know it resonates with the sexist attitudes of their fellow redditors.
By condoning attempts at humor, it's effectively saying, "This stereotype is okay because it makes people laugh." Let me remind you that minstrel shows, historically, were attempts at humor that "played a powerful role in shaping assumptions about blacks."
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On a personal level (and as a female Jew) I actually do find racial/sexist humor funny, especially when geared towards myself.
I don't think that means that I am a self hating female Jew, but it does mean that sometimes negative stereotyping can be funny to me.
Maybe im just naive, but I have a hard time condemning people who enjoy that kind of humor because I myself have laughed at it, and i'v met many other very sincere and good people that have as well.
I just think there is a vast difference between someone who kinds a taboo humor funny, and someone who really is a sexist/racist.
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How you interpret humor is your own personal business. My point is that negative stereotypes prevalent in our culture (and reddit) are often perpetuated by, and guised in, a jovial delivery. The intent of a joke's teller is irrelevant to my point.
EDIT: Grammar.
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How you interpret humor is your own personal business. Then you submit said humor to r/ladybashing to share, if you will, your subjective negative interpretation of a joke with others of a similar mindset, for the stated purpose of public refutation -- defending the subjective sensitivities of the ~1000 members of a particular subreddit.
FTFY.
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You don't know me or my intentions for a submission. Please don't address me like you do.
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To suggest the members of this community share a similar mindset as my own is a gross oversimplification.
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No, people on REDDIT find sexist jokes funny because sexism is so far gone from their thinking that it's absurd, and thus ironic usage is funny.
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That's not really the case. A lot of jokes are made about inappropriate subject matter, and they gain shock appeal. That does not mean that people condone the subject matter...
Example: Madeleine McCann jokes, etc...
edit2: The point I make is that a lot of people make these jokes, and they have the ability to be quite memetic but that doesn't mean people think child abduction/murder is okay...
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It isn't all about you. I make jokes for the laughs, not to hurt your feelings. Stop taking it so personal. I know you don't care about my intent, but tough cookies, my intent is what it is. You taking that intent out of context makes you the wrong one.
I have a pretty large group of friends. Happens to be that two of them are black. We crack racist jokes all damn day about each other. We don't get bent out of shape, we laugh our asses off. You think I make a whitemanbashing reddit when my black friend jokes about how white I am? Or vice versa? Do you think I am racist? I was raised in northern California and am about as far from racist as I can be. I learned most of my racist jokes when I moved to North Carolina. I was also raised by my grandmother and mother, no father figure. I grew up with nothing but respect for women and still do. But that doesn't mean I don't see the humor in female tendencies, in fact I understand them better and it allows me to make even better humor out of it.
You're proving a stereotype associated with women in this case, and perpetuating it: You're being over sensitive to suit your needs. Chill out, laugh at a joke, make a joke about guys never asking for directions and putting shit together without the manual. It's funny.
A side note: In male culture, the guy who doesn't take a joke is outcast, made fun of more, and usually disliked eventually for being a sourpuss. So you can see how perhaps by making a gigantic deal about something as simple and innocent as a joke doesn't phase a male at all. All it does is make you that guy. Even if you are a girl. You would earn more respect if you made an equally or if not more funny joke back. This is just a suggestion, and some insight into guydom. That's how it works.
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Please don't tell me the rules of male culture or "guydom." I don't care how you or anyone else evaluates my gender. I've been beyond that since high school, and it's a better place. Seeing as though you don't know me, it's certainly not your place to judge me or tell me when to tell a joke. Please don't give me suggestions on how to live my life. I could do without a life coach on reddit.
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I didn't judge you.
It's not your place to tell me what jokes I can or can not tell.
And I'm not coaching your life. You're what coaches call 'uncoachable' because you are so set in what you think is correct, that you know better, that you never listen to anyone who might just have a bit more wisdom in a subject than you.
I was merely telling you how many male individuals view those who cannot take a joke. It was an insight, something to help you understand where I'm coming from. That's what reasonable people do when they're trying to discuss something and feel like they aren't getting through to you. It isn't a rule, just something I thought I would share to level the ground.
But take it personally, again...I suppose that is just your way. I'm confused now though, male or female? Since I assumed wrong earlier (or so you claim), I guess you're a guy. Awfully indignant today aren't we?
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It's kind of funny that within the same comment you say that you "didn't judge" me, then you went on to call me "uncoachable" and lacking "wisdom in a subject."
Unlike the lame jokes, I do take statements like the ones above personally. That happens when strangers patronize me and tell me how to live my life.
For the record, I never told you what jokes you can or cannot tell. I may not like them, I may find them detrimental and argue against them, but I in no way want to infringe upon your ability to say them. Likewise, I expect you to do me the same courtesy and allow me showcase them in a different context. I'm not advocating censorship, just the opposite; I want people to know what others are saying. If you don't agree that a submission to this subreddit qualifies as "lady bashing," feel free to downvote it.
My gender is irrelevant and really none of your business.
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When did I say I take the jokes personally? (Or that I'm a woman, for that matter?) I was arguing that it's actually not about personal attacks but instead contributing to negative cultural stereotypes.
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You're taking it personal when you believe it's contributing to anything but people laughing. It's not. The feminist movement was a success and women are getting everything they deserve slowly but surely.
And yes I assumed you were a woman.
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You're taking it personal when you believe it's contributing to anything but people laughing.
That's not "taking it personal." Taking it personal would be if it hurt my feelings. There are other terms and expressions that describe what you're talking about (e.g., "making a mountain out of a mole hill"), but "taking it personal" is not one of them.
If you know so much about the feminist movement, please tell me which wave you're referring to and which goal they accomplished? Are you referring to reproductive rights? Equality in hiring, pay, and promotion? (Let me remind you the Equal Rights Amendment did not pass.) Equal division of labor in the home? The right to vote or serve on juries? Those items within the developing world as well, or just Western culture?
tl;dr The feminist movement is diverse and has spanned over a century, making general claims of its success very difficult.
You assumed incorrectly.
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There's real content on Reddit?
No, seriously. If it's sufficiently outlandish you're going to tell us there's no way the speaker could possibly be serious, but I know from experience that's not the case. There's no point in saying "howabout we stop submitting jokes" because it's plausible that anything and everything submitted to this subreddit was intended as a joke.
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I think it's inevitable that not everyone is going to agree with what's humorous, what's acceptable, what's insulting, what's perpetuating stereotypes, etc.
And some people are going to get it wrong, especially those just becoming familiar with this subreddit. I think the intentions behind the submissions are mostly good, rather they're hit or miss. And when they do get it wrong, it's usually dealt with relatively quickly through comments and down voting.
Even the submissions that miss the mark can serve to start lively debate and further define the subreddit itself.
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The votes on submissions aren't an accurate representation of how appropriate the submission is, since there seem to be some people who come here just to downvote every submission. Nearly every post is below zero.
Edit: E.g., look at this submission which highlights a positive discussion of women in gaming. There are 42 downvotes, vs. 41 upvotes. That wouldn't happen if some people didn't just downvote everything indiscriminately.
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I see what you're saying.
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I submitted that post, and it actually had 12 points at one point. Over the past week and a half, I've checked in intermittently, and its score dropped at roughly 1 point a day for over a week. From that gradual decline, it looks like someone has gone to a lot of trouble to register a single new account and then downvote everything on a daily basis. (Except of course the posts like this one complaining about the existence of this subreddit.)
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The same person? I don't know. It's more likely random, different people who don't like the idea of r/Ladybashing, or who downvote vindictively if they think that they are being downvoted by Ladybashing. There was a huge influx of people for one thread recently that received 134 downvotes. Maybe some collateral damage from that.
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I do think it's possible that one person would do such a thing but, as you say, more likely that several are randomly at play at various times.
I think it's just assumed that this subreddit is hit hard and regularly by down voters down voting for the sake of down voting.
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My understanding is that wouldn't work. Reddit has controls in place to regulate such practices.
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It depends on how determined you are. If you only post through a few accounts, and rotate them in and out, using different IPs per account, Reddit can't really distinguish you from normal traffic. (And there is 'legitimate' traffic that mass-downvotes LadyBashing - but they don't downvote everything mind you, only the stuff that is closely in line with the point of this subreddit. So it's harder to see it as spam, because they're doing exactly what some real people are doing anyway, and this is a small reddit.)
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What people consider to be misogynistic is always going to be different. I don't find comments or submissions which some people consider to involve objectification to be misogynistic. On the other hand, I think that jokes based on stereotypes about women or the degradation of women to be the most damaging, and most bothersome form of sexism, on reddit.
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Dude are you seriously suggesting people stop being funny? You sound like a woman.
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JamEaterBlues, you are making entirely too much sense. :)
Seriously though, you have nailed the problem with this subreddit since its inception.
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[deleted]
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evil feminists, whores, and manipulative bitches
Which one of those is false?
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Howabout you lighten up a little bit, ignore the jokes and comment on the serious articles?
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how
about
NO
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Hey, how 'bout you submit them then instead of just complaining that there aren't enough here for your liking?
There isn't enough sexism on reddit that aren't jokes to submit.