Source
r/ottawa•
Prometheus188

LRT Confederation Line 12 Day Trial Run is Eligible to Start + Detailed Breakdown of Previous and Remaining Work

Below is a list of everything required to achieve RSA/handover of the new Confedration Line LRT. Skip to where it says WE ARE HERE down below if you wanna see what step we are on right now/what’s left. TLDR at the bottom.

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1: Belfast yard and the connector tunnel to the main line must be completed.

2: The 12.5 km of track and the downtown tunnel must be completed.

3: The caternary system of overhead wires and poles for electrical distribution to the trains must be completed.

4: All stations must be completed and have received their occupancy permits.

5: All trains must be built and tested, receiving their safety certification from Thales.

Note: There’s a million other things that must be completed here, but I can’t list them all. Basically, all the construction AND testing should be done at this point, excluding the 12 day trial run.

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6: RTG claims they have achieved substantial completion

-This means everything major is done. The only things that can be left at this point are minor deficiencies that would not delay the opening of the line/the line could open even with whatever minor issue is left. Things like paint needs to be added to a random spot at Blair.

-RTG submits their substantial completion paperwork to the city

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7: The city reviews RTG’s claim of having achieved substantial completion

-The city will agree or disagree

-The city has 5 days to make a decision

-Regardless of the city’s decision, both RTG’s claim and the city’s agreement/disagreement will be sent to an independent certifier

-Note: The city of Ottawa did not agree with RTG’s claim of having reached substantial completion

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8: Independent Certifier judges whether RTG has achieved substantial completion or not.

-Certifier has 5 days to make a decision

-WE ARE HERE. If they side with the city, the certifier explains what the outstanding issues are and we return to step 6. (Certifier sided with the city, now RTG has to fix the issues and submit a new claim of substantial completion. Once they do that, we're back at step 6.)

-If they side with RTG, then RTG has achieved substantial completion and is eligible to continue to the 12 day trial run

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9: 12 Day Trial Run Begins

-RTG must run the system as if it was in full weekday and weekend service for 12 days with no major issues

-Minor issues are acceptable and won’t restart the clock

-Major issues will restart the clock back to day 1

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10: Safety Auditor does a final check and certifies the system as safe and complete.

-With this step, RSA has been achieved and handover of the system to the city of Ottawa occurs.

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11: City of Ottawa requires 2-4 weeks of additional work/testing/training before opening the line to paying customers.

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Assume it will take 4 weeks. .

TLDR: RTG claimed they have achieved substantial completion, the city disagreed. An independent certifier agreed with the city. RTG has to fix the issues, and submit a new claim of substantial completion, returning us to step 6.

edit: Formatting, spelling, typos.

Edit: New info shows previous info was inaccurate. The certifier actually sided with the city, post has been amended to reflect that.

Posted May 14, 2019, 2:05 AM UTC · edited

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charlotterachelle•

I would have to admit.... if it is up and running by Bluesfest that would be pretty nice. Will also be a shit show though.

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james2432•

Unlike bluesfest of the past, there weren't buses every 3-5minutes

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bobledrewWellington West•

Let’s hope Bluesfesters are less likely to piss in moving train cars than they are on people’s front lawns.

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hi_0•

Someone has to christen the new trains :)

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Milnoc•

Will the trial run include urine? 😁

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WRXRatedCentretown•

The LRT is designed to move 10,700 people per direction per hour so both Canada Day and Blues Fest would be a great way to test that claim! :)

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Pika3323Alta Vista•

Rush hour would sufficiently demonstrate that capability. ~11,000 ppdph is how many people travel by public transit through the core at rush hour!

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WRXRatedCentretown•

Right yes but I meant more to how the human traffic flow would be for BluesFest or Canada Day when a shit-ton of people all gun for the train after the concerts (or fireworks) are over from one main station where as during rush hour, the loading is kind of split across several stations.

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aelysee761Carlington•

That's very unlikely

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Prometheus188OP•

I read a comment here that says it was announced on the radio yesterday morning. Nothing official from the city. In light of the citizen article that I read this morning, I'm not entirely sure if the previous info was accurate.

If we assume it was accurate, I surmise that the city is looking for a way to respond to the certifiers decision. From Ottawa's perspective, they're probably thinking "Shit. We have X problems with the trains, but the certifier just sided with RTG. How do we proceed from here"? I mean, if the certifier sided with the city, I don't think they'd need to keep it hush hush. The certifier would only be confirming what the city already said at the May FEDCO.

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Prometheus188OP•

That's good to know. They got the message!

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EsterIsland•

I'm not doubting you, but it seems unlikely this would be reported on Majic 100 and not anywhere else, since I've never heard of them breaking original news. Hopefully we'll see confirmation in the next day or two

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Whisky_Jack_•

12 day trial is not an arbitrary period. What are the logistical reasons for it?

Could be as many as 10 week days or as few as 8. Is there a maintenance operation that occurs on a 5 or 6 day cycle?

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Prometheus188OP•

I don't know why 12 specifically was chosen (As opposed to any other number of days between 10-20). It's supposed to replicate actual revenue service. So I assume it will be 5 week days, then 2 weekend days, then 5 week days again. I guess it wasn't 14 since what they really need to see is the week days. No need to run an extra 2 days to make the full "2 weeks", 14 days.

There is no maintenance operation AFAIK, other than the standard maintenance when the line shuts down for the night. For example, on Monday to Thursday, trains run 5 AM - 1 AM. So it's close between 1 AM - 5 AM. During those 4 hours, they will be doing maintenance. But they won't be using one of the 12 days as a "Maintenance day" or anything like that.

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Prometheus188OP•

HAHA! Fixed! It was a typo. Only need 12 days

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cybergrue•

9: 12 Day Trial Run Begins -RTG must run the system as if it was in full weekday and weekend service for 23 days with no major issues

Is this a typo? or is there another step?

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Prometheus188OP•

That's a typo, it's fixed now. Thanks for the heads up

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Chris_Ogilvie•

I do wonder at what point the remaining issues with the trains identified by the city as potentially preventing "substantial completion" from being declared will be corrected.

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Pika3323Alta Vista•

The things that the City identified were primarily (or entirely?) about the state of the trains, and those are still being actively worked on as far as we know.

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Prometheus188OP•

Presumably, those will have to be corrected before the 12 day trial run has finished. If they can complete the trial run before those issues are fixed, then they're insignificant enough to not delay RSA. If those issues are actually big enough as the city claims, RTG definitely won't be able to complete the 12 day trial run anyway. Not before they're fixed.

So the issues are either small enough to not affect the 12 day testing, or they are large enough to restart the 12 day counter, and therefore serve as a prerequisite to finishing the trial run.

Either way, we wont be opening the line with faulty trains.

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Chris_Ogilvie•

That's a very succinct explanation, thank you.

Presumably, if the issues are indeed small enough to allow the 12 day period to run and for the system to be handed over to the city, RTG is still contractually obliged to remediate the minor issues with the trains, despite the city having taken possession, yes?

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Prometheus188OP•

Yes, I believe so. Even after handover, RTG will still be maintaining the system for the next 30 years. We're gonna pay them 4 million every month for that. I assume part of the maintenance duties will be straightening out whatever minor issues were allowed to exist through handover.

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BaconwichVanier•

The 12-day period would be simulating full service during the best Summer months. What if the problems the city identified have to do with the issues they had with Winter testing?

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Jebus05•

Can I ask where you got your information from? last I head the city was reviewing the independent certifier's recommendation and has yet to release the information to the public?

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As per this release https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/city-reviewing-independent-certifiers-decision-on-lrt-completion/

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Prometheus188OP•

See here

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phosenNepean•

Do you know what the final penalties are for being a year late? If there are any?

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Pika3323Alta Vista•

Apparently after a full year the city has grounds to cancel the contract outright, but I don't think they'd do that at this point.

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BaconwichVanier•

Already built and roughly a month away from completion, they’d be using the Doug Ford definition of “cancel” at that point.

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Prometheus188OP•

The city still owes RTG about $260 million for the project. 59 million for substantial completion and about 200 million when handover occurs. Hypothetically, RTG doesn't handover by May 24th, does that mean the city could cancel the contract AND not pay them the remaining $260 million? I know that's extremely unlikely/no way it's gonna happen, but I'm curious if it's legal/permitted by the terms of the agreement.

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Pika3323Alta Vista•

I'm sure it's technically allowed, but it would leave the city with a non-functional LRT system which they'd need to fix somehow.

If they waited until all the problems were fixed and then cancelled the contract to avoid paying out they'd probably be sued (and most likely lose) for cancelling the contract in bad faith.

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Prometheus188OP•

Yeah we would be stuck with an incomplete system, but it's 99% done at this point. Probably 99.8%. I'm sure whatever work remains would cost a tiny fraction of $260 million. So financially it could be worth it. But then we'd lost the 30 year contract where RTG maintains the system and handles all the risk for future issues.

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Prometheus188OP•

There is the standard 1 million each time for missing a RSA deadline. There is no final 1 year late penalty as far as I know. But after 1 year late (May 24, 2019), the city can legally cancel the entire contract with RTG. But given that the city already knew RTG would be doing handover in Q2 2019 (fancy way of saying June 30th), I think it's safe to say that won't happen.

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Prometheus188OP•

My guess is that anything that is already built belongs to the city. Any payments made to RTG, stay with RTG. The city doesn't have to pay the remaining 260 million. RTG leaves the stations, trains and everything else "as is". RTG is no longer obligated to do any work on the LRT.

RTG loses the 30 year contract to maintain the trains, so the city will not be paying 4 million a month for the next 30 years to RTG (1.44 billion altogether for 30 years).

Just a guess.

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HolyCrapMyPugLebreton Flats•

What is step 11?

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Prometheus188OP•

That's a typo, it's been fixed!

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HolyCrapMyPugLebreton Flats•

I thought it might have been part of a Jim Watson cover up! /s

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WRXRatedCentretown•

So if they start the 12 day trial run in the next week and it goes off without major problems (not impossible give how many major issues they've run into a solved) that would mean hand over by end of May and even if the city takes 2-4 weeks to prep for opening, that could mean it working for Canada Day.

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WA472P•

Praise Jesus!

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bobledrewWellington West•

Are you saying “we” as a resident, or as part of the RTG team?

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Prometheus188OP•

As a resident. I'm not part of the RTG team.

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undeariusBarrhaven•

RTG must run the system as if it was in full weekday and weekend service for 12 days with no major issues

Who determines what a major issue is? If it's RTG, what's stopping them from cutting corners so they can maybe hit their 4th deadline?

"A train fell off the track? Minor issue. Keep the 12-day clock rolling."

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Prometheus188OP•

I can't tell you off the top of my head what's a major issue and not a major issue, but it's all in the contract. I would be surprised if all of this wasn't explicitly laid out. There's a reason these contracts are super long.

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WA472P•

Open to the public on Labour Day weekend 2019.

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Ichbinian•

Yep

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