r/rpg•
RKKatic

Story of the worst player you've ever encountered?

Who is the worst fellow RPG player you've ever encountered? You know, "that guy" who tries to be funny in serious moments, and just plain takes the jokes too far even when the timing is right?

Is inattentive, has no clue how to play their alignment, or their role, or who, for whatever reason, can't understand the rules of the game?

Posted Oct 27, 2011, 7:08 PM UTC

70262
nebbors•

When I was younger, I was a member of a gaming group that met at a local university on saturdays and we played champions, and only champions.

We had a guy join us who we can call "Greg".

Greg knew the game and knew the rules, but he had a quirk, and it ruined the game for everyone;

Greg liked to play massively, morbidly obese women. He would give them ridiculously high comeliness and dress them in skimpy clothes. Oh, they all had gravity control or flying or something that negated the massive girth.

Then Greg would play them as if they were massive slutty flirts. Constant flirting. Creepy look on his face.

I suppose I should clarify, that Greg was slightly odd shaped and just slightly creepy in attitude even when he was not attempting to play a fantasy of his in game.

It all just ended up with me never wanting to play with him, but nobody wanted to be the one to tell him to go away.

sigh Otherwise I loved that group.

But yeah, he was the worst player I ever had to deal with.

70
UFO64Longmont, CO - Pathfinder•

Your DM should have been the one to deal with this.

I take responsibility for the fun and enjoyment of everyone that comes to my table, and part of that is telling some people "No" at the door. I have had to tell several players that they are not welcome. Its not fun, but its better then having a group break up over it.

30
nebbors•

meh, we were a bunch of barely high school power gamers. No one in the 80s wanted to ostracize someone... this was before nerds were cool.

23
ShalebladeIthaca, NY•

Bad Guy Greg

19
sacrificenwa•

i think that guy might fit in just fine in my group. though his character might get stabbed by players from time to time. that's just how we roll.

5
KingBearSuit•

I had a player, really smart guy, knew the rules front to back and had a better knowledge of Forgotten Realms than I did. He INSISTED on playing the most annoying characters specifically to make my life miserable. His most memorable was a halfling who was convinced he was the god Torm. He would constantly talk and act like him, making him incredibly tough to deal with from an RP perspective. When other players (or me as the DM) would try and carouse him into doing things, he would insist on grapple checks, escape artist rolls, and every little loophole he could use to get his way. When someone made a decision he didn't like, he'd have his character act out (most notably, by whipping it out and urinating all over a statue that was part of a puzzle). Ultimately he was so infuriating that I gave up on running that campaign all together. I was a naive DM back then. Now, I eat pieces of shit like that for breakfast.

61
TheJesterSpritGame Master•

You eat pieces of shit for breakfast?

87
[deleted]•

DMs have to talk a lot of shit to keep the story moving, might as well get your breath right.

40
KingBearSuit•

Shooter McGavin Stance

16
Zelcron•

Builds character, yo.

6
Abra-Used-Teleport•

Builds characters, yo.

2
Pyehole•

Apparently.

3
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
kaosjester•

That's easy, though. "The statue comes to life. It is actually an earth elemental. It kills you."

13
Nebu•

"Nuh uh! What about my escape artist rolls!"

10
thescribblery•

My dad was running a low-level D&D game for a bunch of his friends and family once. One of the characters was this vulgar barbarian that liked to do things like make hand puppets out of the heads of his opponents. One time, this barbarian ran across an intelligent unholy weapon that started insulting his manhood, so he decided to do the barbarian-like thing: He dropped the weapon on the ground, unzipped it, and let loose a stream of yellow insult.

At which point my dad looked at the guy playing this character, put on a funny grin, and affirmed: "So, you are making an... /organic/ connection with the weapon?"

Cue 3d6 lightning damage to the penis, and a horribly traumatized barbarian hopping back to the party, squeaking desperately, "LAYONHANDS! LAYONHANDS!"

EDIT FOR DISCLAIMER This player is actually awesome. Only mentioning the story because the conversation reminded me, not because I think that player is bad in any way. XD

42
Hansafan•

If the party's Paladin replied "I'm not touching your junk" that's a 10/10 story.

23
freedomgeek•

That shouldn't have worked like that. Pee is not a solid stream that can conduct electricity, it's lots of little droplets.

/semantics

-1
Arkaon•

A few years ago I played in a game with a guy named David.

David was 34 years old, balding (but what hair he did have he kept about two inches), and always seemed to be in need of a shower.

Well, we played a 3.5 LFR game and he was "friends" with the DM so he got a little bit of special treatment.

Well, One day in particular our party was attempting to rob some gang, and we told his character, a multi-classed half-orc fighter/ranger/rogue type character, to watch the wagons while we went in for the heist.

Then we come running out with about half of the stolen goods and my character yells, "Put EVERYTHING in the wagon!". We drop the items and run back in for more.

David exchanges notes with the DM for a few minutes, who just laughs and says, "They will kill you".

When we run back out, he has disassembled the first wagon, and put it inside the second wagon. Including the two horses that were pulling the first one.

Well, needless to say, we couldn't escape and one of the other players was mad. So, another player stood up and started to get physical with David. At some point. David stood up to leave, and this other guy pushed him. David fell, and what fell with him, scarred me for life.

David fell, and David was wearing shorts. Out of Davids shorts fell this awkward looking, pasty white, dildo. It was then that we noticed David was also wearing sandals, and his toenails were painted bright red.

Everyone just stopped and stared. The DM then said, "Dave, I think you should go home."

David collected his things, tucked the dildo (which was somehow strapped inside his shorts) back up into his shorts, and left.

I stopped playing with that group.

TL;DR: Dude had a dildo and bright red toenails on during a game, and we found out.

59
voraath•

Honestly I'm more offended that the other players got physical at the player for doing something in game. If I saw one of my players do that I'd make for damn sure that when they left they felt more shame than a dildo hanging out of their shorts.

78
Arkaon•

Yeah, that's the other half of the reason why I left the game. The guy who started the pushing was known to slam d20's and even once put a large gouge in the GM's table.

28
Elbardo•

And the guy with a dildo is still the worst player you've ever encountered?

28
snowman334•

Wow, what a royal cunt!

11
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
[deleted]•

[deleted]

1
[deleted]•

If someone got physical with any of my players over a game I would make sure they were banned from both the table and the store I play in for life.

13
Hansafan•

OK... The wilful misinterpretation of "put everything in the wagon" was brilliant, though.

33
Arkaon•

That wasn't the half of it. I'm pretty sure this guy was an evil trickster in a previous life.

DM, "A'ight Dave. You notice that the guy just pulled the card from a hidden pocket in his sleeve."

Dave, "I communicate telepathically to my team, "He's cheating. Kill him while I distract everyone in the bar". Then I order a water. When it arrives, I pull out some tallow and lather up my pits. Then I start shaving them with my dagger."

23
Arkaon•

Or my other personal favorite.

Dave, "Can I use this Necro stone (Item we found. One time use only, makes something Undead.) to make an Undead Goat?

GM, "Uhh. Yeah, but that will use up the spell."

Dave, "Done. I want to use it on our Goat." (Dave had been caring for a Goat most of that game)

GM, "Ok. You now have an Undead Goat."

Dave, "Cool. Im going to use my skills in taxidermy to take all of the goats innards out. Or at least all the ones an Undead Goat doesn't need to survive."

GM, "Ok. (GM Then describes how undead work and what is and is not needed for the Goat to still function)"

Dave, "Cool. Now I will use my skills in Tailoring to install a zipper in the Goats stomach for easy access."

GM, sighs "Why do you need easy access to the goats stomach?"

Dave, "Because things that are ingested technically have no weight, and therefore whatever the undead goat is willing to eat, will not count against it's weight. I pretty much just created a walking Wells Fargo."

GM, "Dave, I'm not even going to remotely allow that."

Dave, "Well then what do I need an undead goat for?"

61
Hansafan•

Dildos and red toenails aside, this guy couldn't have been all bad.

40
sjb_7•

LOL!!!!

You know, Dave's a total smart ass, but I wouldn't have minded playing with him. He toes the line between hilarious and annoying. Dildo would've been a bit uncomfortable, but meh on the toenails. Now, the guy that got physically violent? He's freakin' done.

21
mincerray•

This is real hilarious.

2
Locavore•

I would have loved to play with this guy. Interesting people make for an interesting game.

2
snowman334•

Yeah, I lol'ed.

4
mightyjakeHalifax, NS•

TIL that this subreddit is very tolerant of alternative lifestyles.

21
IkirysPortland, OR•

O_O

...NOPE.

18
Arkaon•

Yeah. That was my reaction.

11
Nebu•

Yeah. That was my erection.

7
tip_off•

You picked the wrong guy to talk about. Anyone....ANYONE who attacks someone in real life over something that happened in game is a total idiot. The guy didn't even cheat the other players or the DM. What he did with the cart was totally within the "rules" so to speak.

18
mazinaruBC, Canada•

Now, having the party rogue strip him of all belongings before the party breaks camp and leaves without him. That's definitely in, in game action, in game consequence. Also it only stands to reason if his character is allowed to pull stunts that disrupt the party, the others are allowed the same rights.

Pushing a guy over when he's trying to leave because of a hostile environment? Way overboard.

8
Jagyr•

Was it a prosthesis, or an...accessory? And how did you not notice the toenail polish?

11
Arkaon•
  1. I didn't attempt to look to hard. All we saw was about 6 inches of skin colored rubber hanging very close to his leg. (Might have been tapped, but the ease with which he tucked it back and had it stay, I am assuming it was some kind of harness.

  2. He was already seated at the table when I showed up. He was always early for the game.

10
AKASquared•

Maybe he was trying to beat a drug test and was packing clean urine in there?

3
lackofbrain•

Okay, the dildo is a little odd, but the red toenail polish? What's wrong with that? Also, are you certain it was a dildo?

9
Arkaon•

Yeah...

3
mrbrick•

I actually feel really bad for the guy.

5
shokker•

When I was in college I was in a 3.5 group with this guy... He was in his mid 30s, honorably discharged from the Navy because of a shoulder injury, and honestly the worst player I've ever met.

He always played a dwarf paladin. Even when his character was not at all a dwarf paladin, he played it like a dwarf paladin. Seriously, he was zero percent Scottish, but no matter what character he played he did the voice in a Scottish accent. The DM was overall a pretty good guy, but was good friends with this player... Let's call him Steve.

Steve was a dragonslayer. He took a level in Ranger so he could get favored enemy dragons, and then kept levelling as a paladin. I realize that this is impossible in 3.5 rules, but the DM let it happen. The DM also let him have a rhino as his paladin mount, because it "felt more dwarfy than a horse". This made Steve's character about 4 times more powerful than anyone else's at our level, since he could demolish anything on a charge.

Steve was also super paranoid about his dice, and if anyone else touched them they were tainted forever. I've come across people with their own little superstitions about dice, but this guy threatened to break someone's arm if they picked up one of his dice that fell on the floor. "JUST POINT TO IT SO I CAN GRAB IT DON'T F***ING TOUCH IT." Seriously, dude, it's just a game...

Okay, so remember how his character was a dragonslayer? He didn't have ANY ranged weapons. We go hunting a dragon so he can make some armor out of its scales, coax it out of the cave and it starts flying around throwing spells and fire on us. I had taken Ki Blast on my monk so I was basically going all Dragonball Z on it, the Druid was throwing spells, and the Rogue was pelting it with crossbow bolts. The paladin was furious. Suddenly here's a dragon and he can't do anything to it!? He starts yelling at us to go in the cave to force it to the ground, and we're like "Dude, no, we're winning. If we get in to melee with it it'll rip us to shreds." But really we just didn't want to indulge him. The DM, to avoid a tantrum, lands the dragon on the ground. Steve charges it on his rhino and kills it in one hit, and mocks the rest of us for the puny amount of damage we did compared to him.

After that session I stopped going to the games and answering their calls.

51
Plurralbles•

"and you hear a rumbling, rumbling... you fall prone and the earth opens in a gigantic maw, your rhino is eaten by a tarrasque- do an athletics to avoid getting eaten as well"

19
ledfox•

Do an athletics? Pshh... I do all the athletics!

7
Plurralbles•

still, the damned rhino is gone and it's a 5% chance of autodeath. : D

1
ledfox•

Haha... I was just making fun of your word choice.

3
gorilla_on_stilts•

Years ago when I was in high school, I played with a handful of fairly good people -- mostly athletic smart kids... plus one scumbag kid who openly worshipped Satan. He would show up to games wearing upside down crosses, which flipped out my mom. But the worst was the game that ended his time with us.

He showed up to the game with a bag full of clinking metal items. It was a big bag. He could have stashed a sword in there. And in fact, he did.

So as we're playing, he reaches down and pulls out a handful of ninja throwing stars. He hurls one across the table, barely missing another player, and it embeds into the wall in MY house. He says something like, "Let's make this REAL!"

We all knew he was a bit touched, and sometimes he would behave as though he thought casting spells and such were real. However, it had never been more than a curiosity. Now, it was a very scary problem.

We scrambled to disarm him, nicely, so nobody got hurt and he didn't go nuts. It worked. Thinking everything was calm, we started playing a bit more, and that was when he drew out an actual katana, so fucking sharp I could have shaved with it. He stands, takes up a position with the katana poised for a strike on the player next to him, and says, "Let's try to do actual fighting to see who wins."

The player who was inches away from being gutted literally falls backwards out of the chair scrambling to get away from this nutjob. I (stupidly) step forward with my hand out, and say, "Now, you know I'm going to have to confiscate that, too. You can have it back when we're done."

To that he says, "You have to fight me for it." Then he feints a strike, and I nearly shit myself. I mean, when you're young, you don't always feel your mortality. You often feel great, healthy, and growing. But when a very real weapon is about to kill you, it's a whole other thing. My body started to shake, and I realized that I almost instantly had beads of sweat dropping down my forehead.

What saved the day was basically everyone acting like parents of this kid. We sorta huddled toward him and in slightly paternal tones we were like, "Come on now, you know you can't do that here. You need to drop that. In fact, we'd like the whole bag, if you intend to stay here."

Someone grabbed the bag, and shouted about it being full of weapons. Our nutjob friend got all offended that we were looking in it. We were saying things like, "You can have the bag back after the game. And we can't continue the game until you turn over that sword, okay?"

He gave up the sword, we settled down and finished the game, and then after he left, all the rest of us sat around for a long time figuring out how we could avoid him forever.

Nowadays, 20 years later, he's in a low-budget Satanic metal band that has been cited (or had some kind of legal trouble) for refusing to start their concerts until audience members kill a small animal as a sacrifice. Yes, it's a direct ripoff of the old rumors about Ozzy Osbourne's concerts. We were kids back when Ozzy was a huge rockstar, so I guess it figures. It's disgusting, but I guess he found a way to be cruel to other living creatures without getting jailed or executed for it.

50
[deleted]•

And we have a winner..

20
WaffleradioSeattle•

I agree. Lack of courtesy or not understanding the rules... General creepiness.... This guy's story is near death.

4
[deleted]•

'Holy shit' doesn't cover it.

5
DerpyGrooves•

Holy shit, this is literally the only story that seriously scared me.

4
tip_off•

Nicely handled but what REALLY amazes me is that you continued playing together after he threw a fucking shuriken. And to top it all you then continued playing after the sword came out. What the hell kept you playing? Balls of steel? Fear?

4
gorilla_on_stilts•

I personally think it was more of a failure to know how to handle danger, along with a failure to correctly assess the danger in the first place. Like I mentioned in the story, I sorta stepped up like I would just take the katana from him, then ended up with the shakes when he made me flinch. I clearly didn't realize the potential danger, and remained slightly oblivious until he left. Maybe it was a protection mechanism.

I think some of the guys didn't take him seriously. It seemed that they had a line of thinking like, "Oh for Pete's sake, we just want to play and now we have to contain this guy? Well let's get it over with."

Afterwards, everyone wanted him out, though. Half the group wanted to tell his parents & the school. We didn't do that though. We ended doing what I proposed: cut off contact, make no sudden movements, back slowly away. I didn't want to provoke him with any confrontation. So our friendship just petered out. He went off with some other stoner dudes and mostly left us alone after that.

We were grateful.

11
BanksKnowsBestHalifax, NS•

If that had been my house and my mom found out about the ninja star in the wall... Yeah... They'd still be looking for his body.

3
insanityv2•

I've luckily managed to avoid many of the downright creepy players, but let me tell you about Ted.

A few months ago, I wrapped up a Pathfinder campaign. It was, on the whole, a great campaign, with a group comprised of, on the whole, great players.

But then there was Ted. Ted was only invited because he was a friend of the person who owned the house we gamed in. No-one else liked him.

Ted was a bit older than the rest of us, and had been playing some form of D&D since the 80s. Ted had a major chip on his shoulder and acted as if he were the youngest and the most immature of all of us.

For some inexplicable reason Ted felt like he had something to prove. He had to be more creative, better read, and more intelligent than the rest of us. Unfortunately, he was neither creative, nor especially intelligent, and he was only "well read" if you considered pulp fantasy literature from the 80s to be the canon of western literature.

Here are some memorable Ted moments, in no particular order.

  • Ted legitimately thought he came up with the concept of the talky, diplomatic rogue. I thought I was misunderstanding him, but he confirmed that he thought that he had come up with that character concept. I also found out that Ted had never heard of Errol Flynn.

  • Ted was always talking up how well read he was. For example, he liked to talk himself up as some sort of amateur Shakespeare expert. I saw his collection. It was actually quite nice, gilt and leatherbound (and obviously bought as a set). However, when I described the plot of King Lear, he could not recognize it.

  • Ted liked to smugly lament the downfall of today's youth, how back in his day he read books while kids these days only played WoW. Ted later complains that a book that he had asked me to recommend to him was too long (it was ~250 pages).

  • We began to notice that whenever the more bookish people at the table talked up a book before or after a session, Ted would also talk up the same book to his coworkers, one of whom played with us.

  • I work as a copy editor in a publishing house. We don't publish fiction. Despite this Ted constantly pressured me to try to get someone from work to read the manuscript for this fantasy novel he was working on.

  • Whenever the DM tried to get Ted to contribute out of session (write an adventure log, do backstory, etc.), Ted would get all "You kids don't understand, I don't have as much free time as you." Ted does not have a wife and kids. We all work full time.

  • When Ted got around to writing that backstory, it invariably involved rape or child abuse. This was literally the only way he knew how to generate pathos.

  • Ted liked to go on long rants about 4e appropos of nothing. I like 4e, but some of the people playing with really didn't so I kept my mouth shut. However, when one of the diehard PF>4e people in group lost his temper about how Ted was holding up the game with his bullshit, it came to light that everyone else at the table felt the same way about Ted's inane whining.

  • Ted thought the entire genre of cyberpunk was liberal propaganda. Not any specific work--the entire genre.

  • Whenever Ted was uncomfortable with anything (for example, women being fighters, homosexuality.... existing) his go-to complaint was that it was unrealistic. Verisimilitude never mattered to him unless the matter in question touched on one of his weird issues (or when he was challenging a DM ruling that was not in his favor).

I could write an entire book about Ted.

EDIT

Actually I have one other story about Ted. A month or so after that campaign ended, a few of those players expressed interest in playing Paranoia, which I have GMed many times before. So I was like, sure, let's do a one shot.

So I slap the PDF on dropbox and tell everyone to read ONLY the section of the book for players. Within a week 2 things happen. Ted demonstrates knowledge of something in the GM section of the book. So I start playfully giving him shit about it, oh that's treasonous knowledge and I'm going to have to kill you for it.

The second thing that happens is that he asks me if I was going to be the one DMing (as opposed to our regular DM). I said yes, so he should start directing any sucking up that might have been erroneously directed at the other guy towards me.

He then flipped his shit. Said that I was accusing him of being a suck-up, and that if anyone presented their ass to him they'd be more likely to receive a boot than they would lips. Said that I was using the fact that I was more experienced with the game against him. Interpreted my jostling him about reading the part of the book he wasnt supposed to as harassment.

He did this in a chatroom in which the other players were present. They saw this and decided that maybe playing a game that revolves around plotting and backstabbing with someone like Ted wouldnt be that much fun. The Paranoia game never happened.

Ted sucks.

46
shitloadofbooks•

I could write an entire book about Ted.

Ted would have read it before you did.

58
Pyehole•

I think the party missed a golden opportunity to grief Ted until he literally lost his shit over it.

14
ForestisinthetreesMiddlebury, CT•

I can only picture Ted from Scrubs. Which makes it 98.7% more hilarious.

10
[deleted]•

Ted later complains that a book that he had asked me to recommend to him was too long (it was ~250 pages).

Christ, I find myself skipping over those for being too short.

When Ted got around to writing that backstory, it invariably involved rape or child abuse. This was literally the only way he knew how to generate pathos.

I'll admit that I've done that a few times in backstory but considering I've extensively researched the subject due to a previous job interest as a rape counselor which I have since abandoned, I find that most backstories result in it being narrowed down to "and he was raped and stuff and became emo and cut himself" and have the same result as their mess.

He then flipped his shit. Said that I was accusing him of being a suck-up, and that if anyone presented their ass to him they'd be more likely to receive a boot than they would lips.

He thinks that being able to kiss someone's arse is an honor?

10
insanityv2•

Christ, I find myself skipping over those for being too short.

I suppose in fairness I should mention that when the prose is straightforward, Ted could read pretty quickly. However, give him something that's a little dense or maybe not originally written in English, and he sort of grinds to a halt.

I find that most backstories result in it being narrowed down to "and he was raped and stuff and became emo and cut himself" and have the same result as their mess.

I think the word we're both looking for is 'narm.'

3
instantviking•

Christ, I find myself skipping over those for being too short.

Stepford Wives is only about 150 pages and very good. Just sayin'.

0
[deleted]•

Animal Farm is less than 100 and also amazing.

5
alibime•

a few of those players expressed interest in playing Paranoia

Sweet!

Ted

Oh, oh.

The Paranoia game never happened. Ted sucks.

I would never talk to Ted again.

4
Elbardo•

When Ted got around to writing that backstory, it invariably involved rape or child abuse. This was literally the only way he knew how to generate pathos.

I have a problem with making characters with scarred pasts, too. I can relate to that a little...

Other than that, Ted sounds like a Mega-Douche.

3
Xiroth•

Many, many people have this problem. I remember playing a MUD where everyone had to write a RP backstory for their character. A solid 4/5 of the characters had their parents die horribly to give them a reason to be adventuring.

There are thousands of easy examples out there of other reasons that characters might be off adventuring other than their parents die. For example, as a quick shorthand, you can take an emotion, any emotion, and use that as a reason for adventuring. Taking the first three from the random emotion generator:

Confused: Through a series of coincidences, the character believes that she has been targeted by dark forces. In order to protect her friends and family, she leaves her home and sets off to seek out these dark forces and confront them. And given these dark forces don't actually exist, by god she'll not rest until she finds dark forces of some kind and overcomes them.

Distant: Our character never felt any particular connection to the people around him. Instead, he found himself drawn more and more to the wild places. Eventually, one day he simply disappeared from his home, never to be seen by friends and family again.

Earnest: A flood has ravaged the countryside, destroying the inhabitants' crops and threatening famine. A group of young people get together and decide to head out into the world to try to make money to save their families and friends.

7
Elbardo•

I'm gonna try using that for my future character backgrounds. Thanks

2
delecti•

To be fair, posting a document and telling them to only read part of it was either silly, ignorant, or outright naive of you.

1
nonlinearlystatic•

The book itself clearly delineates which parts are intended for which people. Now mind, it isn't vital that the players don't exceed their clearance level. You just get to kill their characters when they blatantly demonstrate that they have.

I've run Paranoia with my group, and while a few people did read things "PCs weren't meant to know" more than half of my players didn't.

8
insanityv2•

TBH i don't mind players reading what they were supposed to when playing Paranoia. It's a comedy game, knowing stuff you're not supposed to and trying to use it to your advantage without getting caught is an inherent part of the game.

The point of the story wasn't whether or not he read the book. Its the fact that, if he is taking stuff that personally that easily, playing a game that involves stabbing each other in the back is probably a recipe for disaster.

4
rbrumble•

His name was Ian, and he was a major dick head. His thing was he knew the rules off by heart so he manipulated the rules to allow him to min-max the crap out of every character and every sidekick. That in iteslf sucked a lot of fun out of the game, because I think it's the flaws/weaknesses that make characters interesting or more fun to play. He was just about getting high rolls, to hell with everything else. Also, he would try to play every else's character - e.g. if you didn't do exactly what he thought you should do in every single situation he would say to the DM, "No, he doesn't do X, he does Y. I said not to do X before."

He was about 400lbs, and couldn't hold a job either. I wanted to knock his teeth out, but I also have a real job that I'd like to keep. There's not much I could do to him that life won't anyway, haha.

43
[deleted]•

You should have attacked at range, he clearly has a land speed of 15ft at that size and low dexterity, your 30ft meant that a double-move followed by a full attack would guarantee victory.

40
wayoverpaid•

Unless one has the rapid shot feat, I find move + standard every round is better than double move and full attack, especially at lower levels.

10
[deleted]•

He can charge 30ft and sit on you.

5
Elbardo•

What you need to do is tanglefoot the shit out of his fat ass.

The low DEX will make it hard to escape, Plus he's limited to a square of movement per turn and is prone.

5
[deleted]•

What part of the country was this in? I know a guy named Ian who is surprisingly similar to what you described....

2
rbrumble•

Depends what country you think I'm in...

3
[deleted]•

When I was in college there was this guy who somehow attached himself to our group, and wanted to play in a game I was DMing. He was very big and not very bright and was "that guy" who always just does dumb things. Like, the party would meet an old man leaning on a staff, and he would grab the staff out of his hands thinking it was a Staff of Wizardry. Just stuff like this all the time.

He also tended to get himself killed a lot.

One day we were playing and I think he had just killed his second or third character for the day, and he stood up suddenly and overturned the entire gaming table. He looked at me and yelled "It was player against against DM -- but now it's man against man!" Grabbed his bag and stalked off.

I'm not a big guy, and I was actually worried for my safety. I expected him to ambush me on campus and beat the crap out of me, but I don't think I ever saw him again.

43
QD_Mitch•

I've heard this story before and love it every time. Occasionally I'll use that line to my friends, who are typically very confused.

15
[deleted]•

I did describe this situation before -- I tried to find my original post of it but couldn't find it.

5
Plurralbles•

freakin' hilarious! Sorry for your troubles though.

3
EVHKwick•

Yeah, I had a guy I used to play with. Phil. Phil was the resident black duster-wearing kid at school, with long, unwashed hair, and very little going for him except for his nerdy hobbies.

Phil's existence on this earth was to absorb every minute detail of every officially released 3.5 DnD book (by means of stealing them from his friends). Not to mention he was a min/maxer, who would exploit every loophole he could find to make sure his character was always the most important in any given situation. As a fellow PC, everything you'd try to do was almost immediately overshadowed by Phil, and as the DM, he'd make building a balanced encounter, or even a balanced session, impossible, and always offer up his opinion on how to run the game during the session.

Phil was his worst as the DM. I played roughly 2-3 short campaigns with Phil at the helm, and every one involved trying to turn the PCs against each other, and have all alignments shift to evil. He also favored any dark, brooding, badass characters and would give them unreasonable benefits throughout each session. I remember he once, on a whim, had a character lose a limb in battle, replace it with a metal replica, and gave that character all of the half-golum benefits and none of the downsides.

It was a shame so few people at my high school played DnD.

40
gorilla_on_stilts•

*munchkin

8
WuliboVancouver•

I agree, it doesn't sound like he is doing the min part of min/max if he was the most important in every situation.

6
lameth•

That's usually the disagreement most people have with min/maxing: they players doing it are usually charismatic or intelligent individuals that use those for dump stats, tossing it into whatever the powerstat is, and use their personal intelligence and charisma to talk their way through situations, where thier characters shouldn't have an ice cube's chance.

5
[deleted]•

Shit, just realised that I've been doing this unknowingly in my Cthulhu game. I'll need to keep a lid on that.

4
khorveNJ PF DM•

Max/max... did he play a druid?

3
lollerkeetSydney. Exiles Club on Facebook.•

I remember he once, on a whim, had a character lose a limb in battle, replace it with a metal replica, and gave that character all of the half-golum benefits and none of the downsides.

GM? Hello?

2
lameth•

Ummm... did Phil have thick glasses and a younger brother that also had glasses?

2
EVHKwick•

No.

2
SilverSouza•

I once DM'd for a group of fairly young inexperienced players, now when playing with new people I found that in order to avoid metagaming too much it would be in my best interest to pull a specific player aside to explain to them what their character was experiencing unique to the group. I will never forget the day where after explaining the results of a simple spot check to the one character standing watch over the sleeping group, 1 specific player asked for his chracter to wke up so that he could, and I quote "see if player A was seeing something"

34
TheJesterSpritGame Master•

Ya man, that's rough. I tried pulling players out of the room one at a time to get their reaction without giving them a chance to think about it for a situation that was kinda crazy. After I took the first player out, he spilled the beans to everyone else when I was talking to the second player. I felt a little betrayed for that.

21
zero_armadaDM Armada•

Frankly, I've found that those "pull aside" things do not work for my groups. By the time you've pulled a player aside, the rest of the players already knows something is up with/around that player's character.

I give an explanation of what's happening around characters, and if there are characters that do not see this, I say why (if it's not obvious). If a character wanted to "wake up" to the situation you gave, they'd roll a Perception or similar roll vs. whatever was happening if it made a sound or gave some sort of bad vibe (ki, magic dectection, etc.).

8
Nebu•

But it might be something long term, like finding out that that one PC is secretly friends with a specific NPC, in which case even if the character doesn't wake up immediately, the player's knowledge of this relationship may affect the character's behaviour for the rest of the campaign.

3
zero_armadaDM Armada•

Again, pulling a player to the side is a blatant "Something's going on with his/her character" flag IMO. Though they don't know what, they'd know something was up; at that point, behavior is potentially altered anyway.

If it does end up being long term, my course of action would be to mention something to the entire group, and then say exactly what went on with that character to that player's character...if there's no way for other characters to know about it at that moment.

Have you ever seen moments in media where a character does something in secret, and another character notices it but keeps it to him/herself? Those are great plot moments, but there's no way for such events to be possible if there becomes essentially no way for a player's character to pick up on secret events other players do.

And yeah, playing online does make such secret events a lot easier to manage.

7
realistpaladin•

My solution is to pull people aside and tell them meaningless information. The added paranoia is great. I once passed notes to three separate people at my table.
One was a telepathic message from a demon.
One was a tip-off that there was a secret door.
One was a reminder that yes, you are still Mordock the Dwarf, and you are your own battering ram.

16
ShyGuysOnStilts•

Again, pulling a player to the side is a blatant "Something's going on with his/her character" flag IMO

The key is to do it, and things like passing notes more often, not never. Do it for some mundane things occasionally to keep people on their toes, etc.

It shouldn't be "something is up" it should be "they are aware of things you aren't". The party isn't a hive-mind.

8
[deleted]•

It's why I play almost exclusively online now, much easier.

1
phlidwsn•

Not my own story obviously, but for bad Player/DM stories the best(worst?) I've come across is That Lanky Bugger. There's also part two and part three

27
DylanMorgan•

Wow. Just...wow.

6
WuliboVancouver•

I'm never complaining about my minmaxing best friend ever again.

3
HeirToPendragonChina•

ಠ_ಠ

my god

2
tip_off•

You know I wonder if "get back in the kitchen" was not the best choice of words at that point.

2
saladinzero•

Glad I wasn't the only one who thought that...in the situation, it was a very foolish thing to say.

2
notunlikeSavage Worlds•

After reading those stories, I'm wondering if there's a little bit of unreliable narrator going on there. I've just found that people who seem to be surrounded by drama are usually the cause of a lot of it.

Maybe the guy could have handled those situations a little better.

3
saladinzero•

I always get alarm bells when there's a manhunk best bud who roundhouses someone.

2
kaosjester•

That was... amazing.

1
McGravinAthens, Ohio•

I occasionally make the mistake of gaming at cons. Generally the first game or two I'm in at any given con won't have any weirdos, so it lulls me into a false sense of security. Then, BAM!, the grossest and creepiest guy sits down right next to you at the next game.

I was playing in a Shadowrun game with a guy in his 40s, balding and shaved, weird little mustache, cokebottle glasses. He was missing his upper front teeth and consequently spoke with a lisp that sprayed spittle everywhere like Daffy Duck. He wasn't fat, but he was short and stocky and that gave him a rather round appearance. His arms and legs were skinny though, so he kind of looked like a potato with toothpicks stuck in it.

He was playing a female character, which is fine. However, we were all strangers at the table so it took some getting used to each other's characters, and we understandably referred to his character as "he" once or twice, and he would snippily correct us. But we'd forget and a few minutes later it would happen again. Then one player called his character a "he" one more time and it must have been the last straw because he freaked out! "I'm a woman!" Oh, okay, dude. Sorry. Calm down. Then in mid-freakout, he points at me: "And you look like Ryan Reynolds!" I don't, like at all. I was extremely confused why, in the middle of a hissy fit, he had to compare my appearance to Van Wilder.

In the middle of the 4 hour session we took a break for bathroom and water and whatnot. Most of us were back in 5 or 10 minutes, but he was gone for a good 20 minutes. When he came back, he had a takeaway container of food, but I'm not sure where he got it because it didn't come from any of the places at the con hall food court.

Inside was the grossest fried chicken I've ever seen, way too greasy and the breading falling off in wet clumps. He mushed it in his toothless mouth, getting bits all over his face and grease all over the dice. When he rolled his dice, he got grease and chicken mush on them which then flew all over the place as they rolled. Then he got out a little lidded bowl and started slurping its contents with a spoon; I'm not sure what it was, but it looked like thousand island dressing, and it dribbled all down his chin.

Oh, and his most heinous offense of the game? When combat came we expected his combat monster to be covering the rest of us, but when we waded in he hung back. What a dick!

22
HawaiianBrianSavage Worlds•

"I was playing in a Shadowrun game with a guy in his 40s, balding and shaved, weird little mustache, cokebottle glasses. He was missing his upper front teeth and consequently spoke with a lisp that sprayed spittle everywhere like Daffy Duck. He wasn't fat, but he was short and stocky and that gave him a rather round appearance. His arms and legs were skinny though, so he kind of looked like a potato with toothpicks stuck in it."

When I learn to create characters that vivid, my fiction will finally take off.

12
McGravinAthens, Ohio•

I sincerely wish I had just invented this guy, but no. I was stuck in a room with him for 4 hours.

3
Kijamon•

I was about to say the same thing. This guy is going to be an awesome GM. Sign me up!

2
McGravinAthens, Ohio•

If you're ever in Athens, Ohio, you're welcome to join in on my D&D game. I like having guest players run NPCs once in a while.

2
Gregoff•

Like when he describes how the guy is eating... :D It sent chills down my spine. great story telling skillz

1
Icy93•

I'm part of a club that meets twice a week and there's that ''one guy'' no one likes. He hardly speaks a word of English, which he denies. He constantly cheats, both while playing and creating characters. Every time he plays fantasy he plays a barbarian, which he thinks he understands but when it comes down to it he hasn't even raged. Not once. We've been playing some GURPS recently and he plain doesn't understand the character creation (he created a deaf, cursed, quadriplegic dwarf without even realizing it). Doesn't play his alignment? He doesn't even understand the concept of alignment.

He's actually kind of a problem, it actually affects what people want to play just so they don't have to tolerate him. Now, I haven't been in the business long, I only started playing earlier this year, but I'm fully confident when I say that he's the worst RPG player I will ever meet in my life. At least I hope so.

21
NegativeK•

he created a deaf, cursed, quadriplegic dwarf without even realizing it

I've never played GURPS, but I'm pretty sure I'm filing that in my list of descriptors for the game.

26
mentat•

That's how we min-maxed characters for oWoD.

Also that kinda describes R2D2.

15
happy2pesterGlasgow, Gugs•

They're not descriptors. Gurps is a points system. GM gives you x points for character creation. you can take flaws to get more points. The character was deaf, cursed, quadraplegic and a dwarf.

9
[deleted]•

So he was basically a biological security camera?

15
happy2pesterGlasgow, Gugs•

Honestly? Sounds like it. Maybe he was the charisma monkey or something like that. I dunno

6
KaelosianPF, 3.5•

Just curious, when and how long do you guys meet? Do the times stay constant? And does it interfere too much with life (e.g. not being able to make other plans?)

The reason I ask is that I'd love to play more frequently but usually end up only being able to get my group together once every two weeks or so.

2
Icy93•

We meet every Tuesday/Thursday night at about 7pm and ''play'' until midnight or so (air quotes because a session consists of 70% role-playing and 30% pissing around). I don't think it interferes with my life, rather my life interferes with the role-playing. There are generally about three groups at a time and we try to mix it up on a monthly basis, although we plan to play the Pathfinder adventure we have going on right now behind the scenes. There's a clubhouse in my town where we always meet.

2
KaelosianPF, 3.5•

Awesome! My group is way to flaky to commit to such play but I would be so excited if I could find a secondary group to do this with.

1
WuliboVancouver•

sighs If only I could have a secondary group.

I'm 16 and in all of my life, I've only finally managed to get a party of three players and myself DMing as of two weeks ago. We're having our third session on saturday, and I already love DnD.

1
nerongod•

Heitir hann Snorri?

1
Icy93•

Get ekki sagt að ég kannist við neinn Snorra.

1
Rhetorical_Hippo•

I have a guy whom I have been in campaigns with for the last 5 or 6 years across lots of types of games. He always plays exactly the same type of character, although he does change the minor details. He is also a super mega rules lawyer, but he is the asshole kind that will tell you every single rule he can find if it benefits his character but won't utter a syllable if it would have a negative impact on him.

He always plays a combat based, loner type character. The sort that a bad action flick would be about. Super exaggerated, "badass" (although he does it terribly) but they always have a completely blown out of proportion sense of honor. And if anyone steps on that honor...he will absolutely stop at nothing to avenge any perceived slight at the cost of everyone else at the table.

For example...We are playing Scion (you are children of gods, it's a White Wolf system game) and he is a 4 legend Hero who is some gun-slinging rambo type dude. He is going through airport security, and all he has to do is hand over his relics, which are mostly metal, to go through the x-ray machine and he can continue on his way.

He hassles the TSA guy, the TSA guy hassles him back, and he won't let go of his relics. Everyone else quietly complies and gets through the check with no trouble, but this guy won't let it go because the TSA man was rude to him, so a 5 minute check at the security gate turns in to 2 hours and 25 minutes of me (the Storyteller) and this one guy hellbent on getting his revenge deep in the bowels of the airport.

The party wisely wound up leaving him there, they had enough of his bullshit. He nearly ruined that entire campaign because them boarding that flight was a super time-sensitive and important event.

18
ii_akinae_ii•

Okay, I don't normally get all schoolgirl giddy like this, but...

♥ ♥ ♥ I FUCKING LOVE SCION ♥ ♥ ♥

I don't know very many other people who are familiar with it. I've only played one or two campaigns from it, but it was so awesome.

6
VonHavoc•

Aah, Scion. How'd you like running it?

3
Rhetorical_Hippo•

I love Storyteller systems and Scion is a great one. It opens things up where characters and situations can blend just the right amount of fantastical and realistic that your story often needs!

Furthermore, the implications of the "Fate" system for Scion is simply the coolest mechanic I have ever been able to rely on. Would recommend Scion to any aspiring GM, or veteran, as it relies on the story over the rules.

3
[deleted]•

So...he roleplayed as Duke Nukem?

0
Rhetorical_Hippo•

Haha, yeah, except he kept bleeding samurai elements into all his characters (he was a huge Japano-phile)

1
LuiSPPortugal•

So... he roleplayed as Shadow Warrior's Lo Wang?

2
DanParts•

That guy sounds awesome. Fuck the world, stick it to the man.

-5
WuliboVancouver•

Especially a fictional man, particularly where real-life people suffer!

3
DanParts•

That's on the man's head.

2
WuliboVancouver•

I'm pretty sure that that's actually on the player's head.

3
helmWarhammer 2ed, Sweden•

Bah, if you run a straight airport, and one player shouts about planning to bomb the place or similar, not getting into trouble for it is pissing all over the GM and the game. "Screw you GM, my character can do stupid stuff but never suffer the consequences"

1
DanParts•

But then that's not at all what happened here. Not as it's described.

1
charlofsweden•

Not counting people I only played a single game with at conventions and the like? I had this friend who refused to take roleplaying seriously. His whole attitude throughout the whole thing just reeked of mockery and ironic detachment. Not being serious is not always a bad thing, for humorous scenarios it's expected, but there's a difference between being silly and being insulting towards your fellow players and the whole hobby (despite you choosing to partake of it yourself.)

17
WuliboVancouver•

You know what I love about my group? They may not be very good players, and maybe we don't get that much gameplay in our sessions, but they now what I, as a Dm, want.

I can just tell them, "this is going to be a comedy-based evil campaign," plan out any old encounters, and they will make it funny as hell with evil characters. On the flipside, the same encounters can be sombre, interesting, and intense if that's what i asked for.

5
Fenyx4•

First session with a couple completely new people at the table. The GM and I know eachother and the other two guys know eachother. During character gen we decide to make thieves who don't previously know eachother. My character has the klepto flaw because, well, he is a thief.

First session we break into a mansion and my character does a few things that are less than honorable. He slips a possibly harmful but valuable item into another character's pack to sell later. And he fails a klepto roll and slips a few coins down his sleeves while loading bags full with hundreds of coins. The other guys spend the rest of the session trying to use out of character knowledge that I pocketed a few coins as reasons to stab my character in the back.

After the session is over the GM gets an angry e-mail from one of the other players. He clearly has no concept of player/character separation and thinks that I am a horrible person due to the actions of my character.

Personally I felt that playing a bunch of cutthroats that didn't trust eachother (and who hopefully would end up growing to trust eachother in the future and have that trust be all the more poignant because it was earned instead of just assumed to begin with) would be fun for the whole group to play and laugh about together. But I can't do his e-mail justice so here is a snippet of it;

"By the way I wasn't going to ambush to kill him the night we played, I had planed to ambush to subdue and try and teach him a lesson. I'm glad I did neither, I am usually rash in my decision making when someone is purposely trying to screw over friends or myself, be it in a game or outside it. Sometimes people don't think about the real world ramifications, just because he's duping our characters we as players see plain as day his behavior and attitude towards the rest of the group. We suppose to say "oh well, that is all part of the fun"? It isn't about the game really or what ever loot he manages to keep hidden from us. From the sounds of it there is plenty of loot and it isn't going to transfer over into my bank account so who cares. It is about respecting your fellow gamers and whether you're out to make new friends and enjoy a game together or not. I'm looking for camaraderie, making friends and having fun gaming together. What is [Fenyx4] looking for?"

TL;DR Guy can't separate characters from players. Thinks I'm a horrible person for playing my thief character like a thief.

17
gorilla_on_stilts•

To be fair, most people are like that.

In one of the games I was running, there was a player who was a rogue, and who stole from the party. The players were mad because their characters had no idea. Staying in character, they could do nothing about it. The person playing the rogue was all, "Hey, it's all in good fun!"

That is, until his rogue screwed up a roll during the 3rd game. With the characters finally onto his shenanigans, they grappled the rogue, searched his stuff, and when the found out just how much loot he had stolen, they killed him.

Boy was the guy playing the rogue pissed. He turned to me and asked me if I intended to let PvP stand. I shrugged and said that since I had allowed his PvP (stealing) to stand, I felt I had to let their player-vs-player actions stand, too. He said to the other players, "Well, fine, now you have to waste 5000 gold to resurrect me. Good job."

The other players responded almost in unison, "Hell no!"

I would have let him roll up a new character, but he stormed out before we could even start a discussion. I figured it was for the best.

Don't dish it out if you can't take it. (Not saying that the person I'm replying to can't handle the heat -- maybe he could -- I'm just making a comment in general.)

22
tip_off•

Absolutely. You sound like a good DM.

3
Fenyx4•

Agreed. If their characters had found out about it, decided to shank my character and we, as players, had all laughed about it that woulda been great.

3
tip_off•

Quote: "Real world ramifications"? Facepalm.

3
Non-prophet•

Consequences will never be the same, et cetera.

3
ii_akinae_ii•

"Can my character be anything? Can my character be a speck of dust? Can my character be an anachronism? Can my character be a sentient television? Can my character be an amorphous blob? Can my character be omniscient? What about omnipresent? Can my character be a DRAGON?! How about half-dragon, half-amorphous blob?!"

af;djfeiowwiewafjinvnzvkjfzjfiaj8ieoa

17
Frodiddly•

Sounds like you guys need to play Gamma World.

10
Gregoff•

or, when playing in a medieval setting; "Can I have guns?"

4
tip_off•

Sounds like Arcanum of steamworks and magic obscura.

2
Non-prophet•

Can I have an elephant gun that fires an endless stream of knives?

2
MesozoicManDungeon Supervisor•

Bah. My friend spent half of a Dogs in the Vineyard character creation session trying to convince us to let him play as a robot from the pseudo-Mormon futuretimes. He's a good friend, and a good guy to play with, but he has two very annoying traits: he never reads anything the GM tells him to and he makes snap judgements about most things.

It took a ridiculous amount of time to get him to take DitV seriously, and then he really liked it.

4
firelight•

I appreciate the spirit of commiseration at play here, but I gotta say threads like this always make me sad to be a gamer. I once read a story about a guy who's landlord forced him (under threat of eviction) to GM for the landlord's son, who would wear a diaper to the game and shit himself at the table rather than take a 5 minute break to use the bathroom.

Reading example after example of such terrible anti-social behavior--at times bordering on mental illness, as above--makes me want to never play anything again.

Sorry, this topic is just a black hole of badness for me.

15
insanityv2•

I've wrestled with this before, as I have heard about and dealt with some truly horrible and pathetic specimens of human being in this hobby. A friend of mine has taken to calling ours the worlds best hobby with the worlds worst people.

If you want my honest take it on it though, I think quantitatively that the creep to cool people ration in the hobby is the same in the general population.

However, qualitatively our creeps are worse. This hobby really gives people who are already creeps new and frightening ways to express their creepiness.

14
lollerkeetSydney. Exiles Club on Facebook.•

Also, you get to know them. There are horrible people obsessed with all manner of things, but RPGing is one of the few that force conversation with them.

Ask someone who has worked in a niche store, any niche, and they'll have catpiss man stories. Ask someone who has done any job involving the public.

4
vegasdoesvegas•

That is a terrible story. And I agree that threads like these do make the game look bad, but it's really a case of "don't hate the game, hate the players." I play with close friends who are all fun and socially competent, and we really just have the best time when we play. Playing with people that you would otherwise still want to be around is key.

8
gorilla_on_stilts•

If this thread makes you feel that bad, I would note that a "best players you've ever met" thread just opened up and is making its way up the front page of r/rpg. So you could help be part of the solution, and contribute a very postive story to that thread, yeah?

3
firelight•
5
GerardHopkins•

A lot of good comments already replying to you, however, i'd like to expand on this. Like many hobbies, RP/tabletop brings a full spectrum of humanity to the table. Unlike those other hobbies RP forces an intimacy with those people that you wouldn't normally get. I'm sure a similar thread could be started about 'that-guy' in your workplace but they wouldn't be as fun to read. Don't let the ghost stereotypes of the 80's taint your view of anyone or any aspect of this awesome hobby even if they fit the bill perfectly.

TL;DR It's a hobby of intimacy with the human mind. It just reveals good and bad aspects we don't see as much in fantasy football or RC planes.

3
Zenkraft•

The guy of my story wasn't a bad player (for this example at least), just a bit of a tool.

When he was playing while I was DMing, he fought tooth and nail on behalf of his younger brother (who was 19 at the time, this guy was 31ish) to get his wizard who was killed by a lightning bolt trap back to life. He was saying that [his brother] might hold a grudge against the guy who sprung the trap, and [his brother] put days into the backstory and character design. I eventually caved and let him come back...

Fast forward a few months, this guy is DMing. A goblin appears on the path but doesn't attack. The LG Dragonborn Goliath tries to get some quest related info out of it, but it runs. The Rogue and myself (a Barbarian) chase it, catch it, and attack it so we can get more info. The Goliath then charges the Rogue, crits, and kills him. We all protest, saying what a massive dick move that is, I threaten to leave the game, but the DM, who fought so hard to get his brothers wizard back to life, does nothing, and rewards the Goliath for "sticking to his character"

I no longer play with these people.

15
clancyjr•

i played with a guy that would wait until we all crafted a character, and then he'd make one that was the opposite of ours. as in, you're all crusaders going to free spain? this guy is a crypto-jew and will undermine your whole campaign. oh, you're playing space rangers? my guy is a world class smuggler pirate. oh we're gonna do a dune campaign, and you're the freemen? I'll be a royal. ARRRGH. we were never a party. always fighting.

14
[deleted]•

You actually managed to play the Dune RPG? I'm jealous. Though if he were the only royal in a group of Fremen, I'd say the events of Maud'Dib might have to repeat itself.

2
clancyjr•

the dune rpg is "burning sands" from Burning Wheel. Its not truly dune, as you fight for 'salt', not spice, stuff like that. its just different enough to not have to arrange for licensing. its great. very fun.

1
[deleted]•

I thought it was the Shadow of the Imperium, the Dune RPG. Oh well, I might have to look into it.

1
clancyjr•

you should. Burning Wheel is a GREAT RPG system. really solid character building, emphasis on role playing, not tactical combat square counting bs like DnD these days. I personally love it. and the burning sands campaign setting was a blast. the first rule to accept is "the royals WILL lose". like, as in, its written in stone. there is no way to win as a royal. So, have fun while the universe collapses around you!

1