Source
r/mtgrules•
Mitrian

Interaction of multiple triggers for additional +1/+1 counters

Let’s say I have the following in play:

  • [[The Great Henge]] - “put a +1/+1 counter on it”
  • [[Renata, Called to the Hunt]] - enters “with an additional +1/+1”
  • [[Hardened Scales]] - “that many plus one” … “instead”
  • [[Branching Evolution]] - “twice that many instead”

Then I play [[Walking Ballista]] where X=1, so it “enters with”

How do these various forms of counters being added interact with each other? Will Scales trigger on both the Ballista ETB and the Great Henge separately, since the Henge isn’t a replacement effect?

What’s the correct way to stack the triggers for maximum benefit, and how big will it be in this scenario? I know doubling goes on the stack first (to resolve last), but do the others matter which order? (I think the biggest he could be is 8/8.)

What happens if after that I play a [[Deepglow Skate]]? (this only triggers Scales and Evolution, so I think he will be 34/34.)

Posted May 19, 2023, 6:08 AM UTC

24
peteroupc•

The last three are replacement effects that change the number of +1/+1 counters Walking Ballista enters with. The first relates to The Great Henge's last ability, which is an enters-the-battlefield ability which resolves after the relevant creature enters the battlefield (C.R. 603.1, 603.6a).

In general, to maximize the number of counters put on a creature you control:

  1. Apply applicable effects that add counters (e.g., Renata, [[Lae'zel, Vlaakith's Champion]]; [[Master Chef]]; [[Conclave Mentor]]; [[Hardened Scales]]).
  2. Then apply applicable effects that multiply counters by a factor more than 1 (e.g., [[Corpsejack Menace]]; [[Branching Evolution]]; [[Doubling Season]]).

Review C.R. 616.1, 616.2.

In game terms, putting counters on an object includes—

  • "putting counters on that object while it's on the battlefield", regardless of what verb is used to refer to that action (whether "put", "move" [C.R. 122.5], "double" [C.R. 701.9e], "give", or some other verb) (see also C.R. 701.1), and
  • the case of "an object that's given counters as it enters the battlefield" (e.g., "enters the battlefield with ... counters"; see also C.R. 122.6a)

(C.R. 122.6).

See also:

4
MTGCardFetcher•

Lae'zel, Vlaakith's Champion - (G) (SF) (txt)
Master Chef - (G) (SF) (txt)
Conclave Mentor - (G) (SF) (txt)
Hardened Scales - (G) (SF) (txt)
Corpsejack Menace - (G) (SF) (txt)
Branching Evolution - (G) (SF) (txt)
Doubling Season - (G) (SF) (txt)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call

2
MTGCardFetcher•

The Great Henge - (G) (SF) (txt)
Renata, Called to the Hunt - (G) (SF) (txt)
Hardened Scales - (G) (SF) (txt)
Branching Evolution - (G) (SF) (txt)
Walking Ballista - (G) (SF) (txt)
Deepglow Skate - (G) (SF) (txt)
^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call

2
madwarper•

You have 4x Replacement effects, and 1x Triggered ability.

  • Ballista - EtB with 1 counter
  • Renata - EtB with 1 counter
  • Scales - +1 counter
  • Branch - x2 Counter

So, you can have the Ballista enter with either 6, 4, or 4 counters.

Then, Henge triggers and would add 1 counter. You have 2x Replacement effects to apply...

  • Scales - +1 counter
  • Branch - x2 Counter

So, you can have Henge add either 4 or 3 counters.

Thus, the Ballista can end up with up to 10 counters.

2